where to find good simple used OD/ID universal grinder
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  1. #1
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    Default where to find good simple used OD/ID universal grinder

    I'm interested in an OD/ID grinder, of the sort that could make an MT4 shank ER20 collet chuck, or lathe test bar, or the like.
    (This is a personal exercise not a business one - to be efficient of course one buys those things.)

    Seems that people do lots of good work on aged OD/ID universal grinders, and at least in videos they don't seem to be all that large.
    (I have 3 phase power, etc.)

    Is there a good mother lode of these machines somewhere? (To see in person...)

    What I'm hoping for here is "Go to CA and visit the following 6 dealers" - as being better than scrolling through ebay.

    Also - things to look out for - brand X machines use a center taper unused by anyone else, or brand Z machines cannot actually use dead centers - that sort of weird bit.

    thx
    bmw

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    Go talk to a tool liquidator. Typically they pass up these kinds of machines because they weight 3000+ lbs and people don't want them. You might be able to get a good deal on one if you ask around a bit.

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    I have an old Landis universal in my shop. It's a lot like it's owner, most would consider aged, clapped out and bald in more than a few places. That being said, I can still do respectable work with it. Like all older used machine tools, you learn it's shortcomings and the work around's if needed. That's why we have indicators and mics, yes?

    My old Landis uses Jarno taper centers. Not thrilled with that, but have accumulated plenty of them from ebay on the cheap.
    Landis sent me a free copy of the original operators manual and another one on grinding. How many companies will do that?

    I bought my grinder off of craigslist. You will enjoy adding one of these machines (whatever brand you get) to your arsenal of equipment.
    Gus

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    Quote Originally Posted by bryan_machine View Post
    I'm interested in an OD/ID grinder, of the sort that could make an MT4 shank ER20 collet chuck, or lathe test bar, or the like.
    Landis made a 12 x 28 toolroom grinder that would be perfect for that. Probably rare as hen's teeth now. A standard older C or CH type Landis is a pretty hefty mofo. The 1R's and so on are still kinda pricy and not as versatile.

    The Cincinnati universals tend to be more flexible and lighter than the production Landises, too.

    What you might like is a Browne & Sharpe 13. Those were designed for the kind of work you are describing. They had a gazillion accessories and some had ball-bearing tables and dead centers with fingers and so on, so you could sharpen cutters, too. Nifty machines.

    There's an English one that's nice but the name escapes me right now.

    I would avoid the Nortons. Definitely not fun to run

    Anyway, I think the term you want is "toolroom grinder". A 6,000 lb machine is maybe not what you are looking for

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    Quote Originally Posted by SeaMoss View Post
    There's an English one that's nice but the name escapes me right now.
    Myford? Or Jones and Shipman.

    Ex-cell-o made some neat cylindrical grinders.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ewlsey View Post
    Or Jones and Shipman.
    that's it ! Those are pretty. Thanks ! One more synapse shows up for work ...

    The B&S might be the most versatile tho, if'n he was only going to get one machine. You can even use them for light surface grinding.

  7. #7
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    My #4 B&S Universal mechanical is a treat, and the fact that it is nearly as old as me suits both of us.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails p1000617sm.jpg   p1000645sm.jpg   p1000351sm.jpg  

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  9. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by SirRage View Post
    Go talk to a tool liquidator. Typically they pass up these kinds of machines because they weight 3000+ lbs and people don't want them. You might be able to get a good deal on one if you ask around a bit.
    What is a "tool liquidator"?
    Where do they exist?
    We sure dont have any up here in Washington State, where Bryan lives- we dont even have used machinery dealers any more.
    There used to be a row of used machine dealers on Santa Fe south of Downtown in LA, but they are mostly gone now too.

    Century is still in biz, they have a Landis and a couple of B&S universals.
    http://www.centurymachinery.com/
    Wheeler has a Misal- http://inv.wheelermachinery.com/q/we...,,a,,,20212943

    then, theres always Sterling- never the cheapest, thats for sure.
    The owner used to park his rolls royce convertible in front. But, since they finance inhouse, it never seemed to cut down on sales...
    Dealer Sells Used Lathe, Milling Machine, Metal Shear, Press Brake All Fabricating Machines | Industrial Machine Tools For Sale- Sterling Machinery Grinders, Cylindrical Plain (Angle) & Universal - Grinders Sterling Machinery

    Frankly, I would be interested to hear of other west coast used machinery dealers that actually have stock on the floor- there arent many.

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    Just brought home my B&S #13 this weekend. I'm guessing it's a 1950s model. I used SearchTempest with a 400 mile radius search. Been looking for about six months. Cost me $700 and $200 for the drop deck trailer rental and diesel fuel. It was a long, long 600 mile round trip on Saturday. At 3000 lbs., it fits in nicely with my shop of #2 sized machines and I like the fact that it can be a tool and cutter grinder with the right accessories. I wanted one for much the same reasons you stated. I just wanted to have that capability and learn a new skill. I have also spent a lot of time searching ebay. Occasionally the old grinder in the $1000 dollar or less range shows up. There are a lot of multi thousand dollar ones that sit there month after month.

    John

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    Ries's point is worth noting. Very few machines show up on any listing I can find for WA. And machines that seem appealing listed in say Chicago are often associated with people who don't answer email....

    Shipping a 2K or 3K machine from say New Jersey is clearly doable, but not cheap....

    My luck with local auctions has been mixed.

    Patience is a requirement, whether virtuous or not....

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    Quote Originally Posted by bryan_machine View Post
    ,,, machines that seem appealing listed in say Chicago are often associated with people who don't answer email....
    Tried to buy a machine in Detroit. Cash money. Even sent him a photo of a pile of hundreds. Fucker is too lazy to take a couple of cameraphone pictures and email them. People are weird.

    Oh, and he won't bother giving us even a rough-guess address so we can figure out what rigging and shipping would cost. He considers that unreasonable. Why do people put ads up if they don't want to go through with the sale ?

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    We still have this Landis 1R for sale.

    FS: Landis OD Grinder in Enid, OK.

    Although we dont have an ID attachment, 1Rs are pretty common. Surely one could be sourced from elsewhere if the need arises.

    I bet the boss would accept any reasonable offer. we need the floor space.

    Let me know if you're interested.

    and yes there is a mixup on the add of the fine feed graduations. Ive never run that machine but I can put you on the phone with our grinder operator.

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    Have to read up on Landis 1R and see how hard it would be to get an ID attachment.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bryan_machine View Post
    Have to read up on Landis 1R and see how hard it would be to get an ID attachment.
    If'n I was buying just one, I'd hold out for something more versatile. Had a Landis which I really liked but it's pretty much a shaft grinder. Anything else is a pita.

    If you have space for two, tho, a Heald or Bryant will kick ass for id. None of the swing-down / swingarounds can match a real id grinder. In fact, once you get used to a real i.d. grinder none of the workarounds will satisfy you. And maybe there's some opportunity there, i.d. grinding could be something of a specialty ?

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    I may have a surplus of cylindrical grinders shortly. I'm getting in three Jones and Shipmans from Michigan hopefully next week. I already have six of them here. Now this may seem excessive, but there is a slight amount of logic to what I'm doing. I AM definitely NOT keeping them all. I'm NOT a machine tool dealer.

    For some reason, I just got into a comfort zone with these grinders. I DON'T like to change setups so I just buy more machines. I've ground thousands of parts with one of my Jones and Shipman grinders, and it's just run flawlessly for 17 years. They're around a 5500 pound machine and not very big. With a swing around ID spindle, that's frankly NOT very heavy duty, for even medium production duty, it's certainly served me well. For a hobby homeowner, a small cylindrical grinder gives a person real capabilities to do precise, beautiful work.

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  21. #16
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    Brian - let me know, you are close enough I could come inspect one, make a deal....

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    I have a Jones&shipman 1314 Dirthy but with a decent amount of tooling
    Price would be ,deliverd at the Seattle area, a bit over 4000 Euro Depending on shipping costs and crating Can be seen under power Although its a bit far away
    http://veltmanmachines.nl/en/vm/grinding-machines/deutsch-rondslijpbank-jones-shipman-1314/

    Peter


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