'3D printed' Ti mountain bike frame

Please don't flame me if it's already been done!

First metal 3D printed bicycle frame manufactured by Renishaw for Empire Cycles

Empire's old cast and machined frames were cool, but this!

Thanks. I hadn't seen that and it's a great example of continuing improvements.

Looks like it has a way to go before commercialization, though.

Interesting article, wonder how long cycle time (no pun intended) was to create the components used in the assembly?

I wondered that myself. I imagine it's measured in days rather than hours.

Other than the fact this ti and skinny CF tube concept is pretty old bike technology and has been superseded by moulded CF, it does play to 3D printing's strengths. The parts being printed are small relative to the bike and have otherwise difficult geometry to machine. Still, for this much trouble, why not knock out a CNC machined mould of the front half of a full CF frame (the only part that really needs to be custom for fit purposes) and go nuts.

Robin Robin Robin:
There you go again, offering sensible practical solutions to making a bike frame.
This isn't about making bike frames the best way; it's about shilling for the fantasy.
Remember what the experts say; very soon, we'll be 3D printing PEOPLE, no less.
You're just not buying into it properly!!
Imagine...no more need for sex; your printer can do that!
Cheers

Marcus
Implant Mechanix – Design & Innovation - home
Vancouver Wire EDM -- Wire EDM Machining

3ders.org - 3D printer and 3D printing news, trends and resources.

Fabbaloo

Get tired of you trolls that can't see past your own nose. Go educate yourself.

When you start printing crankshafts that are lighter because they have an internal lattice structure, or have faster cycle time than injection molding presses.
Then I will be amazed.


Right now the only application for 3D printing I see, is prototyping and medical related.

alskdjfhg said:

When you start printing crankshafts that are lighter because they have an internal lattice structure, or have faster cycle time than injection molding presses.
Then I will be amazed.


Right now the only application for 3D printing I see, is prototyping and medical related.

Click to expand...

Won't ever make it there when everyone discounts it as a toy.

I think it's more of a technical limitation...

tjb1 wrote:
"Get tired of you trolls that can't see past your own nose. Go educate yourself."

You know, tjb, if you've read any of my previous posts on the subject, you'd know I have participated reasonably extensively in the technology and I do know what I'm talking about.
Yes, I've had projects done on the EOS DMLS machines.
Yes, I've used services like Quickparts for everything from FDM to SLS, to stereolithography.
Yes I own a Stratasys UPrint Plus 3D printer and use it where it works for me.
Yes I have been doing this for a long time.
Yes I pay attention to what it can do, what it can't do, and where it's going.

So spare me the bullshit; that's all I ask.
Promotional stunts like this one are not helpful to make a case for adopting the technology.
Ignorant boosters breathlessly hyping the wonderfulness of it all don't help to make the case either.

I'll be the first to embrace it for what it can do, and I look forward to its evolution.
Many of the problems that limit it currently, can be solved and are being worked on by some incredibly smart people.
When they develop it and new applications for which it makes sense, I'll be all ears, and I'll grab it for the benefits it offers me; but this application is only a marginal fit for the technology and if you know anything about the limitations of the current process, you'll concede the point.
It's right up there with "Oh look, I've printed a gun".

Robin is right on; if you want to build the best bike frame, this is not the way to do it.
If you want to encourage the naive to buy in, go right ahead.
I look at the antics of the Makerbot and Company crowd, and I smell money being made on the newest version of the Dotcom Bomb.
I look at the retarded blather of some of the public figures who've praised it with ecstatic zeal, and I want to laugh and cry at the same time.
Cheers

Marcus
Implant Mechanix – Design & Innovation - home
Vancouver Wire EDM -- Wire EDM Machining

I'm rather more impressed with this instance of "Oh look, we've printed a gun" -

World's First 3D Printed Metal Gun Manufactured by Solid Concepts » Solid Concepts Inc.

Apparently there is some post-printing machining and finishing but they're obviously confident enough to sell an acceptedly very expensive limited run to well heeled collectors -

1911 3D Printed Guns Will Sell to Lucky 100 - Solid Concepts Blog

There's video of the range test near the bottom of the second linked page



1911 3D Printed Guns Will Sell to Lucky 100 - Solid Concepts Blog

I suspect the price of the laser sintering equipment isn't insubstantial and the $11,000 price tag suggests CNC has nothing immediate to worry about ;-)

- Nick

Really neat stuff. Inconel? Amazing.

From Powder to Production: Empire's Printed Titanium Bikes - Pinkbike

I'll just leave this here...

Neat.... still got a ways to go.

how much does it cost to print one of these?

assuming its in the ballpark of ten or twenty times a production titanium frame (which is my guess) why would anybody pay that for one?

3D printing has its place.

At some point in the future, it might even be affordable for consumer goods.

But right now, I am pretty sure I could machine a frame from inconel for cheaper, making chips out of 80% of the inconel I buy for the project.

Looking up the specs on the Renishaw printer, metal deposition rates are quoted as from 5 to 20 cm^3/hour (yes, hour) "depending on material". A 6 lb Mt. Bike frame is going to have 660 cm^3 of titanium in it. So you will have somewhere between 33 and 132 hours in printing it on a $750,000 (base price) machine.

It may be awhile before you see those bikes in Walmart.

I have been scanning the comments so far: I am a technologist flying an Optomec LENS 3D printer with some 20 years development experience, mostly in subtractive technologies in South Africa of all places. It appears that the majority of us have been conditioned to think production and production=cash. The problem with our reasoning is that you better be first by getting the picture of the product into your customer's mind. By saying customer I mean the guy with the cash. Not the guy living on credit limits.
So in order to get the production going as those of us who have done some large development work before the presses and machines poops out the parts, a lot of communication and miscommunication happen and in the mean time the clock is ticking and your customer ( the guy who really has the Rubles (used to be guys with Dollars)) is getting irritable. So I tell you that if a concept that was discussed on Wednesday is in full metal product on the board room table by Monday morning you are in a better position to make a $50mil deal. So what is the 50 hours printing job worth now? This does not mean you could not have been able to machine an Eiffel tower out of a solid piece of stainless, Titanium or an custom made alloy. The printing guy has the material in his store. He need not order any stock in another dimension. It is there in kilos or pounds or even tons. The stock dimensions doesn't matter. As two machines being Lathes and Milling machines are specialized, so are printers. The field is already hitting many niches in it's own.
The surprise is coming when a new generation will not think like us knowing the limitations related to milling, drilling, turning and tapping. Take a human bone, say a Femur for example: it requires a ball joint on the one end, extended tube to connect the ball joint with a hinge on the other side. There must be some areas for muscle adhesion and the lot. Without going into too much detail and please forget the bio issues, it is a simple job with a ball sphere, pipe and hinge and a good engineer can tell you how strong this limb will be and in all directions. New software will be given the requirements and it will and already do produce the models. So time is not the only issue here. You simply can not make the parts by any other method. These are smart parts.
Be assured that there are many challenges still out there but they are enjoying attention from some very smart guys. Be careful to look at 3D printing from the point of view of production output only. Rather ask yourself why do I have all these machines but I don't make money? Or maybe why can I only sell hours on my machine but the guy that has no machines is the one making the money? So how many parts does your machine produce this month if there is no contract? If your prototype is not on the table in time you will run the risk loosing it to someone who has the ability to satisfy the customer's first need to see and feel the product in the material of his choice. If not, you'll sell hours. Now do the sum again. Your customer is getting spoilt and used to a more concrete medium of communication as he is losing the ability to even understand what he is looking at on a CAD screen not to mention a drawing.

Hi Johan:
That was a very well written post; I enjoyed reading it and you make some excellent points.

The current buzz about additive technology becomes annoying when people make claims for it that make no sense.
Mostly these are people who have no understanding of what they are claiming, but too often, they are people who really should know better, given their experience, and these are the especially disappointing ones.

I know what you're saying about the power of a physical prototype produced on a quick turnaround especially to people with no understanding of the process limitations; the growing risk is that this audience regards the production problem as solved as soon as the prototype lands on their desk.
Persuading them of the vast gulf between the prototype and first production article is a growing task as they become ever more indifferent to what it actually takes; and it's my contention that additive manufacturing has shortcomings not easily surmounted that will limit its feasibility to special cases, and I don't think that will change.

I do disagree with your implication that a human femur can be, as you call it, a "Smart Part", capable of being produced on such a machine on a fast turnaround with no other intervention.
I know you didn't state it explicitly, but that's not true, and the same ignorant executive who sees the "Smart Part" and believes it's complete and finished, will increasingly be the one who drives the direction that resources flow and will not recognize that it's actually only a preform, requiring a lot of post processing before it becomes useful.
That post processing can still only be accomplished efficiently by subtractive processing (machining); until that reality changes, additive manufacturing is a fantasy for any tightly toleranced parts such as the surface of the ball joint of your titanium femur.

Every publicity stunt like the printed gun and the printed titanium bike frame parts make the willful ignorance problem worse. (not that I'd ever want to stop them stretching the boundaries: I'd like just as much as you to see it blossom to its best advantage)

Rude awakenings will be an increasing issue as the expectations shift in the way you describe, and the ignorance you also describe becomes even more commonplace than it is now.
Cheers

Marcus
Implant Mechanix – Design & Innovation - home
Vancouver Wire EDM -- Wire EDM Machining
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implmex said:

I look at the antics of the Makerbot and Company crowd, and I smell money being made on the newest version of the Dotcom Bomb.
I look at the retarded blather of some of the public figures who've praised it with ecstatic zeal, and I want to laugh and cry at the same time.
Cheers

Marcus
Implant Mechanix – Design & Innovation - home
Vancouver Wire EDM -- Wire EDM Machining

Click to expand...

Thanks for that! I like this part!

Cheers
Trev