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Anyone know how much this lathe is worth?

Nathan114312

Plastic
Joined
Mar 26, 2017
I have this old lath in my shop it says H.W.Petrie on it as well as London heavy duty on it. It works, except the gear that moves the carriage is mangled but that can be fixed. My question is how much money I can get and, what the approx year is. Thanks, it is a big lathe.
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Nathan,
I can't get your pictures to open, but I do believe that johnoder has nailed it... Your lathe was most likely manufactured by the London Machine Tool Company. They were originally located in London Ontario Canada but moved to Hamilton Ontario Canada in 1910. Petrie was the dealer.

I have a single page saved from canadian metalworking and machinery magazine from 1911 in which London Machine Tool announced that they had signed an agreement with Leblond to use Leblond designs. Will try to find & upload it.

What does this have to do with the value of your lathe...? Not much really, but interesting nevertheless.

What's the machine tool market like in Algeria?
 

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The Original Poster (OP) of this thread lives in Algeria. This country may not be the place to find good used machine tools, or much-if any-machine tools for home/hobby shop use. Stuff in the photo has me wondering if the lathe is actually in Algeria- a cutoff plastic bottle from
A & W root beer and the blue plastic boxes from Delco Electronics and a chunk of what looks like cordwood (hardwood cut in short pieces for firewood), as well as the light switch on the post and "romex" wiring to it (all US or Canadian style switch, coverplate & wiring) have me wondering: is the lathe actually in Algeria of somewhere on the North American Continent such as Canada ? The dealer plate on the lathe is from a Canadian machine tool dealer.

That being said, the lathe the OP has appears intact, aside from the mangled gear in the apron. It has a lot going for it, having a motor drive built onto it. It is too big a lathe for most home/hobby shop use, but is a hefty old lathe probably still capable of some good work.

Getting back to the OP's big question as to the value of the lathe, it comes down to: "Location, Location, Location". If in the USA or Canada, I'd say the value varies between giving the lathe away ("free to a good home") in places where there are old/used machine tools available to no more than 500 dollars. It is a LOT of iron to move for a home shop. It is too big a lathe for most home shops, and unless a shop was going to be doing something like refacing auto and truck engine flywheels or machining weld bevels on pipe flanges, or boring the hubs of larger diameter pulleys or gears, there is not much demand for this kind of older lathe. It is not modern enough to be usable in working shops of any size as it turns too slowly and is not really rigid enough for carbide cutting tools. It also has unguarded moving parts. It is a plain bearing machine, meaning anyone using it has to take the time to oil all the various oiling points on the lathe- and they will be numerous.
Most working shops would not want this lathe. Some might want it to use as a lathe for doing something like metal spraying (to buildup worn shafting), or semi-automatic welding to build up worn shafting or rollers, or for doing driveshaft work requiring welding in the lathe.

If the lathe were here in the Catskills of NY State, I doubt it would fetch 500 bucks, and anyone having it would be likely taking "any reasonable offer" to get it moved out (if they needed the space in their shop).

Truth to tell, when I saw Nathan 11432's location as "Algeria", I got curious. How a lathe like a heavy duty LeBlond knockoff from the 1920's wound up in Algeria (if that is, in fact, where the lathe is located) has to be a story in itself.
 
Nathan,
I can't get your pictures to open, but I do believe that johnoder has nailed it... Your lathe was most likely manufactured by the London Machine Tool Company. They were originally located in London Ontario Canada but moved to Hamilton Ontario Canada in 1910. Petrie was the dealer.

I have a single page saved from canadian metalworking and machinery magazine from 1911 in which London Machine Tool announced that they had signed an agreement with Leblond to use Leblond designs. Will try to find & upload it.

What does this have to do with the value of your lathe...? Not much really, but interesting nevertheless.

What's the machine tool market like in Algeria?

The american style switch on the column,the A&W root beer bottle and the blue box labeled "Delco Electronics" tells me that that lathe is in the states. Joe types faster than I do.......
 
Sorry guys my location must be messed up, not sure how to change it. It is located in Ontario Canada. Thanks everyone for all the help.


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If it is not worth much then maybe I will try to fix the gear on it sometime, can't at the moment my
Fingers are a little torn up.


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Nathan:

I am glad that my "detective work" was validated with the lathe, as well as yourself, being in Canada. Algeria seemed highly unlikely.

OK: old lathe, you have possession of it or at least the use of it. My recommendation is to clean it up, try to repair the gear in the apron, and start using it. Taking the lathe apron apart and repairing the gear and reassembling is an education in itself. Cleaning the old lathe with something like kerosene or diesel fuel and rags, you will "unearth" oiling points and become more familiar with the old lathe. I'd suggest cleaning the lathe using diesel fuel and rags, and washing with a strong degreasing detergent such as Zep's "Royal Purple" or "Industrial Purple". Protect your torn up fingers with some chemical resistant gloves and get the lathe cleaned. By the time your fingers heal, you will have things clean enough to take apart the apron.

All of us, over our careers, have had assorted cuts, scrapes, bruises, fractures and similar. Occupation hazards, and the injuries were worse when we were younger and full of piss and vinegar and shorter on patience and brains. My own hands are a study, with a mangled right ring finger (1967) having a kind of half assed claw instead of a nail, numerous scars, a couple of smashed thumbs that had the nails heal up a little ridged and flattened, and a missing/busted knuckle on the 4th finger of my left hand (got a deer with that, using a Harley-Davidson).
In short, cuts on our hands are something we lived with and often had to keep on working with. Back in the day, no mechanic or machinist wore examining gloves to work. We worked barehanded. If someone HAD worn examining gloves, I thing they'd have been hooted and hollered at and chased off the job. About the only time we wore gloves was using solvent dip tanks or doing hot work like welding or similar. The trend nowadays to wear thin gloves when doing machine work is an accident waiting to happen. The real trick to learn to think each move we make, be "spatially aware" of where our bodies begin and end, and not cut corners- take the extra few minutes to clamp a job to a drill press table, wait until a machine tool is stopped before clearing chips, adjust tables and guards on grinders and sanders so small/thin jobs do not get grabbed or thrown. Older and wiser, with the scars and lumps and bumps to prove it.

Old Machine Tools are great, and they can be great teachers aside from the other good points. I can get fine work out of a machine tool that many people would say is too worn to be of any use, and I have done it many times. Overseas on jobs, we had nothing but really worn out old machine tools in many cases. We did what we had to do to get the jobs done, and it included fixing those old machine tools so we could use them in a number of cases. As for the mangled gear, post a photo or two when your fingers get healed and you can get it out of the apron. Plenty of us have repaired busted, mauled, or mangled gears or gears that were snaggle toothed or gap toothed and needed a little dental work.
 
Sorry guys my location must be messed up, not sure how to change it. It is located in Ontario Canada. Thanks everyone for all the help.


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So, the old lathe didn't go for a long boat ride after all!
Joe Michaels has given you some very good advice, but if you do decide to sell it, watch kijiji to establish a price range for lathes in your area. Also, if there's farm country reasonably nearby, try listing it in local farm papers as well as kijiji. There're still a few farmers out there who are interested in such things.
 
Ok thanks everyone I appreciate the help will work on it in but, cannot start for a bit. (My finger is more than a scrape 7 stitches at the tip and a little exposed flesh, Also 3 stitches on other finger tip)


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Nathan:

My advice" use the time your fingers are healing to read and study something of some interest or use to you. Machine shop work is mostly "head work"= being able to design or sketch the jobs to be done, doing the trigonometry to figure missing dimensions if angles, figuring tapers, figuring tap drill sizes and so much more, aside from figuring setups for the jobs on the machine tools and hot to do the jobs. Whether it is turning a simple shaft with a few different diameters, or something more complex, shop work requires some "head work". Time spent waiting for your fingers to heal can be time well spent. A human mind is an infinite and amazing thing, but it needs to be exercised and kept limber, and doing math in your head or designing stuff that requires some figuring is a good mental exercise.

As for your injured fingers, I can relate a couple of stories of how people got a little mileage out of there injuries. An uncle of mine had sustained an injury to the middle finger of his left hand when he was a kid. We never tired of asking: "Which finger got mauled when you were a kid ?" Needless to say, our uncle would not hesitate to stick up the middle finger of his left hand, and us kids would howl with laughter.

A high school machine shop teacher had served an apprenticeship before WWII in Berlin, Germany. He worked in a shop which produced worm gear reducers (gearboxes), and milling the "threads" on the worms was something this fellow did as an apprentice. As he told it, he had to set up a universal milling machine with a dividing head geared to the table feeds. Once the machine was taking a cut, he had to make sure the chips were cleared and cutting oil flooding the cutter and work. He went to clear the chips on day while his milling machine but, instead of using a brush, used his pinky finger. In nothing flat, the cutter had grabbed his pinky finger and taken off the top portion to the first joint. Doctors cleaned up the remaining finger and stitched a flap of skin over the stub end of the bone. This teacher, who was normally a very reserved and formal man, used to clown around with the stump of his pinky. One of his favorite gags was to stand in a crowded NY Subway car during rush hour and act like he was picking his nose with his pinky, having seemingly jammed it up a nostril a bit past the first joint. Naturally, some people around him would start shooting disgusted looks at him for picking his nose in public. He'd act like his pinky was stuck up in his nose, seemingly tugging his hand to pull the pinky free, grasping the wrist of the hand with the stuck pinky with his other hand. All of a sudden, he'd give a lurch and act like the pinky had come free from his nostril. Of course, he'd then look at the missing portion of the pinky, and start acting agitated, putting a thumb to cap the opposite nostril and attempting to "blow out the missing hunk of pinky". The effect had varying results- some people laughed, some rolled their eyes, some studiously ignored him, some kidded him, and some few stuffed shirts were so disgusted they moved out of his vicinity. This fellow was a fine shop teacher, and he was very safety conscious. We had an old machine shop for our classroom, with lineshafting and belts from the overhead to drive the machine tools. Despite the teacher's kidding around about the missing pinky, he was a stickler for safety and we had no accidents beyond an occasional small cut or bruise.

A couple of simple rules I follow religiously:
-I put on safety glasses with side shields as soon as I get into my shop or garage. I wear prescription glasses with ANSI listed safety lenses, but have found that these let small chips get over the top of the glasses and into my eyes. I do not need my prescription glasses for close work, so plain safety glasses work fine for me. I feel naked without them if I start working in my shop or garage. My wife has pulled a lot of chips and small pieces of welding slag out of my eyes over 35 years of marriage and hauled my butt to the ER when she could not get whatever it was out of my eyes. Standard practice in the ER is to numb your eye(s), dilate them, stain them with dye and then start looking for the foreign objects and scraping around to get them once found. You go home seeing "starbursts" of light since your pupil is now dilated and you get a prescription for an opthalmic antibiotic and maybe some eyedrops. Your eye feels like someone threw sand under the lid for a bit, and you are out of commission until the next day. Wear safety glasses and make sure they have side shields and shield across the top. Make sure they are clean and not too scratched up so you can clearly see your work.

-never leave a key in a lathe chuck or drill chuck an instant longer than you need to have it there to tighten, loosen, or center a job. The instant you are done using a chuck key, get it OUT of the chuck. Accidental starting of machine tools can send chuck keys flying with enough force to seriously injure anyone in their path. Oldtime machinists and shop teachers would holler murder at anyone who left a key in a chuck when it did not need to be there, and giving a young fellow a jab in the ribs or a swat "upside the head" while calling him a "Dummkopf" (dumb head in German) or far worse was standard practice.

-never grasp an end mill cutter or milling cutter barehanded, particularly to put it into an endmill holder or collet or to pull it out. I use a cloth shop rag.

-never touch, let alone grasp, the turning (chip) coming off a machine tool while cutting is in progress. If the turning is getting to be a problem, I use a wrench or similar to hook it or guide it. Never clean up chips while a machine tool is running. Never handle the chips barehanded, use a pair of leather gloves. If long chips are snarled in a bird's nest and won't come free of a machine tool, do not tug on them even with gloved hands. Sharp edged turning cut like razors and will slice thru a pair of leather gloves and into your fingers before you know it happened. Use pliers or wire cutters to deal with tangled chips.

-never stick your finger into a freshly bored or drilled hole- chances are there is a wicked burr or very sharp corner at the mouth of the hole and you can slice a finger and cut a tendon just that quick. Plenty of guys have done it.

-if your lathe has a quick change toolpost, remove the holder and toolbit when setting up a job in the lathe. One slip of your hand into a toolbit or parting tool and you will be bleeding. Similarly, remove the tailstock center when not immediately needed. One slip when you are setting up a job or reaching around the lathe and you can get nailed by the tailstock center on a smaller lathe.

-wrenches are a whole other matter, and slipping with a wrench has caused me to skin a handful of knuckles. Using the right sized wrench, trying not to use adjustable (aka "Crescent" wrenches), making sure the wrench is properly seated on the head of the bolt or on the nut and has room to turn with the fastener are all things to keep in mind. Adjustable wrenches, under heavy strain, can and do slip and chew the corners on nuts and bolts- and result in bruises and cuts for the user. A 12 point socket or 12 point box wrench may fit a nut or bolt properly, but if that fastener is made up too tight or has slightly rounded corners, under the strain you put on that wrench it will slip and send you flying. Use a 6 point socket on more ornery fasteners and have no chance of rounding the corners and slipping.


Lastly, make sure your tetanus shot is up to date, and keep a good first aid kit at hand.
 








 
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