Brown & Sharpe Horizontal Mill help needed

Hey gang,

found an old B&S horizontal mill. looks mostly complete. I think its a #1 ( pics included ) assume its in pretty serviceable condition ( ill try to go over it as best as i can before purchase )

Main question is, is it a time suck ?

Some things about myself
Im a home shop type guy.. im not in business machining

i have 2 BP J heads and space is kinda tight..


your thoughts and opinions would be valued and appreciated


thanks,

Joe

Joseph Durnya said:

Hey gang,

found an old B&S horizontal mill. looks mostly complete. I think its a #1 ( pics included ) assume its in pretty serviceable condition ( ill try to go over it as best as i can before purchase )

Main question is, is it a time suck ?

Some things about myself
Im a home shop type guy.. im not in business machining

i have 2 BP J heads and space is kinda tight..


your thoughts and opinions would be valued and appreciated


thanks,

Joe

Click to expand...

"Time suck?" Or "time warp?"



Let's see...

First mill I ever made chip with was probably its litter mate. A good fifty years old already and nearly 60 years ago. Reliable as a Hay-Budden anvil, and not a great deal more sophisticated. Oilier though. Bigtime. Old dark sulfurized, and that worked a treat.

But.. it dind't have ANY of that tribe of gypsies hovering above the cone-pulley.

That menagerie is your potential "time sucker".

If you have two BirdPorts arredy, even ONE worth keeping, I'd be tempted to peddle the lot of those add-ons to the B&S to he who has NO vertical milling capability, and strip the B&S back to down and dirty basic horizontal milling 101 as coverage for the BeePee's limits.

Early, simple, B&S horizontals were reliable enough and cheap in time and money to keep that way. Do bring oil and get used to it wandering about.

2CW

thermite said:

"Time suck?" Or "time warp?"



If you have two BirdPorts arredy, even ONE worth keeping, I'd be tempted to peddle the lot of those add-ons to the B&S to he who has NO vertical milling capability, and strip the B&S back to down and dirty basic horizontal milling 101 as coverage for the BeePee's limits.


2CW

Click to expand...

Funny you say that... here is my mascot !

Joseph Durnya said:

Funny you say that... here is my mascot !

Click to expand...

Trainer brought real live Eagles to our school back in the late 1950's.

Warned us in advance that they do not willingly foul their own nest.

That his Eagles considered their cages AS nests.

That they'd turn eighteen shades of green holding it in on the drive over.

That Job One once that cage door opened was "blessed relief."

About the time he was saying an Eagle could accurately (s)hit a target ten feet out?

His lead bird pulled a Wartime Emergency Power climb out would humble a Mach five Nike-Herc detonating off the launch rail, proved him conservative with a low-altitude eighteen-foot birdshat-shot... that nailed the teacher acting as emcee, clear t'other side of the auditorium stage all down her skirt.

Skirt . HAD BEEN .sort of a muted orange.

I don't really remember much else about Eagles.

How could one?

Check the column on the right side for patent date and model number.
Might be close to 1918 as it has the spindle lugs for keys on the toolhoolder, arbor or collet.
If that is a coolant tank on the right lower side and not just a shelf that also puts it closer to 1918.
That flat space is for stowage of the dividing head and tailstock.
Data from 1916 catalog;
# 1 net weight 2,800 22" x 8" x 18"
#1D net weight 3,000 22" x 8" x 18" back geared
#2 net weight 3,100 28" x 10" x 18"
If the mill is newer than 1916 add a couple hundred pounds.
Your mill is a Universal.
Capable mill that can do what the Bridgeport cannot, in the right hands.
John

Skirt . HAD BEEN .sort of a muted orange. Ha ha, one of the memories burned into your synapses forever!

Owner verified its a 1D going to run over there this week to have a look !

jhruska said:

Check the column on the right side for patent date and model number.
Might be close to 1918 as it has the spindle lugs for keys on the toolhoolder, arbor or collet.
If that is a coolant tank on the right lower side and not just a shelf that also puts it closer to 1918.
That flat space is for stowage of the dividing head and tailstock.
Data from 1916 catalog;
# 1 net weight 2,800 22" x 8" x 18"
#1D net weight 3,000 22" x 8" x 18" back geared
#2 net weight 3,100 28" x 10" x 18"
If the mill is newer than 1916 add a couple hundred pounds.
Your mill is a Universal.
Capable mill that can do what the Bridgeport cannot, in the right hands.
John

Skirt . HAD BEEN .sort of a muted orange. Ha ha, one of the memories burned into your synapses forever!

Click to expand...

Went had a look at the machine today.. its a 1D and has the coolant tank under the shelf... Looks like the current owner hasnt used the machine for anything but light drilling for as long as he has had it.. He has never hooked up the Horizontal motor to electric and didnt have a clue as to how the j head power feed / back gears / etc work. he has owned the machine for 30 years.

Joe

here are a few more pics..

I would second Bill's suggestion: since you're covered in the BP vertical mill department, strip off those components on the B&S and return it to horizontal duty. You'd be pretty much covered in all milling functions. Nice machine, BTW.

Tom B.

Owner doesn't need to vacate his home ( he is moving out of state ) until around June... so i have some time to move some stuff around ( read: make room to shoehorn this machine in the shop ) and arrange a roll off to go retrieve it... But, to be honest, Im still kind of flip / floppy .. have done quite abit of digging. I'm not finding ANY info on youtube or the interwebs in general regarding the # 1D and its starting to intimidate me. Not sure i have the time or more importantly the resources to work on something like this.

All these old machines require some work. But then again that's the point. I recommend you buy it and just dig into the process of returning it to service. The project will grab you.

Joseph Durnya said:

Not sure i have the time or more importantly the resources to work on something like this.

Click to expand...

They were built in a simpler age. Innards are easier to understand and easier to get at.

In essence, the machine right in front of you is its own "book". A few "clever" solutions, but nary a mystery. Everything makes sense. Anything worn is simple to repair, adapt, or fab, new.

Far the less demanding project, time-wise, than even a BirdPort's variable speed head alone. Which isn't rocket science, either. Just more awkward.

You want "complicated" in a combo / universal mill? Avoid a USMT "Quartet". Rube Goldberg would be confused by their whoredom to a legion of Gilmer belts, multiple right-angle gearboxes, vari-belt drives, vertical pillow blocks, and, and... then there are the electricals for its four motors, and.. not even CNC. Just a complicated all-manual.

But, then.. I don't HAVE to "make chips". I was just LOOKING for a head-games challenge, so I'm good with what I have.

You, OTOH, should grab that B&S 1D. Great complement to a BeePee vertical and for meagre rations.

Mills just don't get a great deal simpler, and back of the scabrous paint, this one even looks to be in well above-average condition as it sits.