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Galloways rolling mill engines

Asquith

Diamond
Joined
Mar 3, 2005
Location
Somerset, UK
For Rick .....

Galloway02.jpg


This is one of two rolling mill engines supplied to the Johnson Co. of Lorain, Ohio, by W & J Galloway of Manchester, England. One engine was ordered in July 1894, and the second in October, and both were shipped in February 1895. This was a repeat order, Galloways having supplied two similar engines seven years previously.

One engine had cylinders of 55” bore, 60” stroke (for a blooming mill), while the other was 48”/50”, for a train of roll stands for rolling streetcar rails. Both operated at 150 psi.

Galloway01.jpg


The second engine was made by Galloways in 1880 for Bolckow, Vaughan of Middlesbrough, England, in 1880. 40” bore, 60” stroke.
 
I suppose adding to my own threads is the equivalent of talking to myself, but no matter. I forgot to include a link to pictures of some more Galloway rolling mill engines (and others):-

http://www.practicalmachinist.com/vb/showthread.php?t=113935&page=2

I should also mention that Galloway's factory site is now serving a useful purpose as a car park, no doubt soon to be covered by pricey apartment blocks for wastrels.
 
Me again. Looking for some information on Bolckow, Vaughan, I came across some interesting steel mill photos on this site:-

http://www.communigate.co.uk/ne/cardboardcity/page18.phtml

Half way down, there’s a list of company rules. Hard to read, but they include a fine of one shilling for leaving your candle burning, or neglecting to shut your gas cock. Striking another workman or even quarrelling would cost you two shillings and sixpence.
 
One thing that surprises me about some of the old manufacturers is how close their factories were to town and city centres. What doesn’t surprise me is how few people know, or indeed care, about the former importance of some of these companies. I wonder if any of the residents of expensive Manchester apartments know that the derelict land used as a car park seen in the bottom left hand corner of this view:-

http://www.webbaviation.co.uk/gallery/v/manchester/knott-mill-aerial-img0353.jpg.html

….was the site of the Knott Mill Iron Works of W & J Galloway, suppliers of steam engines and boilers to factories all over the world. Yeah, whatever.

As we’re here, I’ll offer a bit more history. In the aerial view, top LHS, right below ‘.uk’, is the terminus building of the Liverpool & Manchester railway (of Stephenson’s Rocket fame). Those buildings, and the ones extending south-eastwards towards the tall building, are the home of Manchester Museum of Science & Industry (who have a Galloways horizontal textile mill engine that can be seen in steam). The grey building with a pitched roof is the air museum, which manages to house a surprisingly large locally-made Avro Shackleton maritime reconaissanace plane. The building with the curved white roof is the former Manchester Central Station, and just out of the picture to the right of it is The Midland Hotel, where Mr Rolls was introduced to Mr Royce. On the other side of the tall new building in the centre is a road called Deansgate. Heading up there to the right was No. 15 Deansgate, where Richard Roberts, engineering wizard who produced all sorts of pioneering machines, including lathes, planers and slotters, had his first workshop in 1816. His lathe was in the bedroom, powered by his wife turning a big wheel in the basement. I suppose she looked up to him.

The area outside the picture was a hive of industry, engineering, steel, textiles, etc. It’s all gone, but there’s plenty of money around. It won’t last, of course, but the people down there in the picture don’t know that. They probably think that an economy based on shopping and suing will be perpetually self-sustaining.

I fear a note of bitterness has crept in.
 
Asquith said;

"It’s all gone, but there’s plenty of money around. It won’t last, of course, but the people down there in the picture don’t know that. They probably think that an economy based on shopping and suing will be perpetually self-sustaining.

I fear a note of bitterness has crept in."

No Asquith, it's not bitterness, it's called reality. :(


Oh my gosh, I just posted number 3,000 - How can one post so often and say so little?
 
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Oh yes! Love those rolling mill engine pictures. Why would the company in Lorain go to England for an engine when they could have purchased one of better quality made right here in Youngstown!
 
Perhaps they were attracted by the shiny cylinder end covers. And the delivery time, now that, in 1895, ocean-going ships could come within a couple of miles of Galloways works, via the new Manchester Ship Canal.
 
Yeah, we certainly wouldn't provide any engines with shiny cylinder covers like that. They might get a nice 1/2" thick cast iron cylinder head cover complete with cold laps, misruns and sand holes. I can show you sometime!
 
This is one of two rolling mill engines supplied to the Johnson Co. of Lorain, Ohio, by W & J Galloway of Manchester, England.

I grew up in Lorain and don't live too far away. The Johnson Company is one I am not familiar with, perhaps they were near the steel mills. The Black River Historical Society in Lorain has a photo database on their web site. I didn't see anything identified as the Johnson Company, but there are other photos to look through if anyone is interested. Dennis

http://www.loraincityhistory.org/archive/archive_searchindex.asp
 
Thanks, mixdenny - That site has a lot of great photos in the archive section. Lots of steel mill related pictures, although they do not display as large as would be desireable.

Dave
 
Johnson Steel Street Rail Co.

Dennis,

Many thanks for the links. Some excellent photos there, but as Dave says, small.

The site sparked my interest, and I did some searching on the Johnson Steel Street Rail Company. Turns out Johnson’s rails were very successful but difficult to roll. A Mr Moxham features prominently in making the company a success, and the original mills were in Youngstown. That would be the location of the first pair of Galloway engines. They decided to set up an integrated iron and steel plant on a 3700 acre site in Lorain, the Lorain Steel Co. The plant was built in only 10 months, and produced its first steel on April1, 1895.


There’s quite a detailed history of the company, focused on Mr Moxham, and an account of his early involvement is here:-
http://www.pitt.edu/~zander/Jaybird5.htm

Page 7 of the account mentions that the first Galloways engines developed 2500 HP.

The next link describes the move to Lorain. Johnson ran streetcars from the plant to the adjacent communities.
http://www.pitt.edu/~zander/Jaybird12.htm


A more concise history can be found here:-
http://www.pitt.edu/~zander/MoxhamANB.html

Going back to your link

http://www.loraincityhistory.org/archive/archive_indexfullpicture.asp?imageid=698&str=factories
Locos on a bracing day at Lorain Steel, 1899.

http://www.loraincityhistory.org/archive/archive_indexfullpicture.asp?imageid=685&str=factories
Somewhere warmer, National Tube

http://www.loraincityhistory.org/archive/archive_fullpicture.asp?imageid=510&str=steel
Ore dock at National Tube.

http://www.loraincityhistory.org/archive/archive_indexfullpicture.asp?imageid=675&str=factories
Steam engine, National Tube.

http://www.loraincityhistory.org/archive/archive_indexfullpicture.asp?imageid=578&str=factories
….and another

http://www.loraincityhistory.org/archive/archive_indexfullpicture.asp?imageid=679&str=factories
Whoops.

http://www.loraincityhistory.org/archive/archive_indexfullpicture.asp?imageid=369&str=factories
Filing on a shiny lathe.
 
It appears that the Johnson Co is where US Steel is now, formerly known as National Tube. Lorain was a thriving city back in the 1950's as I grew up. The steel mill ran at capacity. We used to drive by the slag dumping area near the Hendersen Drive "high Level" bridge. It was neat to see the red hot slag get dumped down towards the river (hmm, guess they don't do that anymore). That whole part of down was always red from the iron dust. Every night the sky light up from the Bessemer Process open hearths. We could go down to the docks and watch the huge Hullet unloaders pecking away like giant animals.

The shipyards were great. The drydocks ran right up to Colorado Ave and the ships were merely a stone's throw away. The bascule bridge over Erie Ave was always being raised to allow large ships to pass.

Ford opened the Lorain Assembly plant there in the 50's, I think, employing thousands more. Smaller industries like Thew Shovel and Lorain products kept the area employed.

Nearly all gone. The shipyards are now a marina. The Hullets are gone. The Thew Shovel buildings are there, but I'm not sure what company is in them, there are no more huge power shovels and excavators in the yard. The Ford plant closed a few years ago. Lorain products is downsized into Marconi Products. The steel mill has been sold and resold, and is doing OK, I guess, although just a shadow of its former glory. At least the neat headquarters building that looks like a castle is OK. The downtown, once thriving with two hotels and three movie theaters is a ghost town, although it is slowly being turned around.

The Lorain Creamery, where my dad still drove a horse-drawn delivery van into the early 1950's, is a used car lot, although the beautiful English style building is standing.

National Tube office building:

http://www.loopnet.com/xNet/MainSit...225&linkcode=10850&sourcecode=1lww2t006a00001

Lorain Creamery:

http://www.loraincityhistory.org/im...erId=13&MaxRecs=122&Section=BUSINESSES#bottom
Dennis
 
Dennis,

Sounds as though we grew up in very similar places! Wasn’t it great? None of that boring wandering through the fields and fishing in the stream!

We used to go down the lane between the two tar works (which occasionally entertained us by catching fire), over the railway track where we might see some steam shunting locos (switchers) in action, sit on the canal bank and throw stones at the flotsam while waiting for ships to go by. Then past the steelworks, watching the cranes with magnets dropping big balls onto piles of scrap. Locomotives grinding their way up the grade pushing slag ladles, to be followed by the violent business of trying to tip the contents out. Then off to the railway sidings to watch steam trains bringing iron ore, limestone and coal in, taking billets, girders and coils out. Ah, the outdoor life, with a canopy of smoke to save us from getting sunburnt.
 
Rick,

It is an interesting question as to why Johnson & Co. went to England for their engines, I suppose it could have been something like a shorter waiting time, or a better price - or maybe they wanted a better product. It is probably hard to realise that in the 19th century America had a reputation something like China has today - reknown for copying ideas and reproducing them quickly, in mass, undercutting with sharp prices but with somewhat questionable quality. Also corruption was rife and import barriers were put up against imported products. An example I have been reading about recently was the world-reknown steam ploughing machinery of John Fowler, Leeds, England. These machines were used throughout the world, but they had to give up in the US due to most of the factors mentioned above.
In the 19th century America was a second rate industrial power compared to Great Britain, not just in quantity, but in quality of product. If you headed a bit further West than Ohio, you might have found it hard to make an engine at all - collecting up horseshoes and any old iron so crankshafts could be hammered together etc....
 
Rick,

Quite right. My brain knew it was Johnstown, but my fingers thought Youngstown (they’d just sent you an e-mail).


Peter,

I don’t disagree with the China analogy, and there was certainly a lot of shoddy stuff being produced in the breakneck pace of industrialisation (boilers and bridges come to mind). However, by the end of the 19th century, Britain was rapidly falling behind, especially in terms of innovation, and was firmly set in complacent mode.

It’s interesting to see the march of progress in the old engineering magazines. There was a lot of admiration expressed for many US products and methods, but the letters columns often included predictable comments from diehards, expressing similar views to what we now hear about Chinese products (or, before that, Japanese motorbikes). For example, people would accept that the new US machine tools, might be cheap, innovative, accurate, but, looking for some ray of light, claim they won’t take such a heavy cut or last as long(!) as the home product.

With other products, such as locomotives and stationary steam engines, they would point to inferior finish. However, I’ve also read contemporary editorials that greatly admired the American approach, noting that time and effort was wasted on finishing, while the American products tended to have exemplary finish where it mattered. These observations weren’t always well-founded, though. For example, one editorial commented that engine connecting rods were often left as-forged (obviously machined at the ends), and this demanded very high standards of forging work. This view seems to ignore the importance of finish generally on connecting rods to minimise the risk of fatigue.

Of course the compacent view gradually died out under the overwhelming merits of US and European products in many areas of heavy and light engineering.

However, editors and correspondents were united in one aspect, namely the frequently expressed frustration at the US patent system, and puzzlement at how products which had been produced in Europe for years could be hailed as new, patentable inventions in the USA.


I hadn’t really thought about the lack of penetration of British products into the US market. I’d just assumed that in many areas they were simply uncompetitive, on price, delivery or technical merit. And yet they did well in those export markets where there was open competition. I think that for most of the 19th century, industrialised countries tended to be self-sufficient in many fields, but ‘globalization’ was making itself felt by the late 19th century.
 
Asquith,
My post was certainly simplistic, but intended to provoke a bit of interest, and besides I was provoked! :) :)

---------------------

In the latter part of the 19th century (when the Lorain engines were ordered), there was huge worldwide demand for British-made goods.

No doubt magazines etc could see the changes that were taking place, and certainly British companies knew about the increasing American competition in their markets - yet at the end of the century (1899) Great Britain's annual trade was still twice that of the US (£800 million as against £400 million) and that trade was supporting only 40 million people in Great Britiain as against 80 million in the USA. There was still a formidable difference, despite the trends discussed in magazines.

As an aside (which relates to this thread nonetheless), a good example of how contemporary writers (engineering magazines etc) don't necessarily reflect real life is seen in the production of steam engines in the US at the turn of the century. The reciprocating engine was at its triumphal peak, all the writing was about improvements long available in high class, cleverly designed engines. And yet 3/4 of all steam engines sold in the USA were old-style, fixed cut-off, throttle-governed, non-condensing and worst of all - mostly fitted with a slide valve - which were (as Louis Hunter writes) "infrequently mentioned, save in reproach, and rarely discussed in the literature of steam engineering, this common mill engine continued to be the preferred power source in most industrial enterprises." Never mind the technical experts of the day, the US businessman knew what he needed - an engine "whose prime characteristics are mediocre efficiency and ability to pull hard whenever requested". Such an engine "may not save coal but is saves everything else". I like those quotes :)
 








 
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