History and pictures of H.W. Kearns boring mills - Page 6
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  1. #101
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    That D type was probably made in or around the early 1960's, maybe slightly earlier, so it's a reasonably late machine for the range. That makes it around 60 years old. Another customer of mine had one just like that and he did really good work on it but his operator was the best Hor bore guy I ever met. They were good, reliable, user friendly machines. Quite simple to maintain. The travelling spindle speeds are slow for modern cutting tools but you won't be bothered about that. The facing slide is probably a bit better on the D type than the SH and the speeds will be roughly the same. I suspect the longitudinal travel is greater on the D type. You also have the advantage of the tee slotted main table. You can remove the revolving upper table in 5 minutes if need be.
    On the SH you only have the upper revolving table.

    The main failing on the older machines was the way lubrication was very poor. On some of the early machines there was no means of lubricating the vertical ways other than a MK1 oil can! I haven't seen many of the older machine that haven't got scored up ways.

    The later machines had a hand pump but that means you're relying on the operator to do the job regularly. You can see the hand pump for the saddle ways on the back side of the saddle nearest the operators station in the photograph. On some of the machines it was mounted on the front of the saddle. Given the pump was up stroking when the lower table was moved over towards the operator you couldn't actually use the pump !

    In the case of the SH 75 it'll be possibly late 1970's, maybe even early 1980's, much higher travelling spindle speeds, hand/hydraulic clamping to the ways, power drawbar on the spindle tooling. Feed rates will be significantly higher at the top end and are normally infinitely variable through three ranges. Probably a bit easier to operate with a pendant control.

    You can see were I'm going. If you're only concerned with boring and you don't plan to do any milling maybe the D-2 is the one for you.

    You need to go and have a good look at both machines, check out the ways and have a look at the main drive belt on the D-2 as they are expensive to replace these days. I take it the machines are under power ? Do either of them come with tooling ? That's really important if you're starting from scratch.

    That's the best I can do going off two pretty basic and not very helpful photographs.

    Where abouts are these machines, roughly ?

    Incidentally there's a guy on this site " Abom 79 " who has a similar D type machine that doesn't look to be as new as the one in your photo. You could look at the videos he puts up.

    Regards Tyrone.

  2. #102
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    The older machine is located in barry.
    I was going to have a go at it but Ive decided not to spend a fortune moving it.

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    The d2 seems to have lots of tooling with it.
    Is there much difference in the capacity of the 2 machines?

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    With all due respect both machines are better than you.
    If in similar condition go for the one with the most tooling,as it can take years to accumulate. Also be aware that a hbm can take longer to set up than a mobile boring outfit if it is a casting with limited datum surfaces.
    Where in the country are you based

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    I'm in Northern Ireland, my gut tells me to buy the newest machine within my budget, but newer isn't always better. That's why I have a lot of questions.
    The problem with the mobile machine is set up , for the cast stuff I have to make a jig which may never be used again.
    Also the mobile machine is limited with feed rates and many many other things I have learned over the past.

  6. #106
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    Quote Originally Posted by lineboring steve View Post
    The d2 seems to have lots of tooling with it.
    Is there much difference in the capacity of the 2 machines?
    I'd say hardly any difference but if anything the D-2 has more capacity with the removable top table. Both have similar sized facing slides, 3" spindle, 1 metre cubed on the revolver. The tooling is important, you can't just pick it up anywhere.

    Regards Tyrone.

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    Yea, I was thinking about the tooling.
    Some times tooling has a greater value than the machine.
    I guess I'm swaying towards the older machine with the tooling rather than the newer one with virtually none

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    Quote Originally Posted by lineboring steve View Post
    Yea, I was thinking about the tooling.
    Some times tooling has a greater value than the machine.
    I guess I'm swaying towards the older machine with the tooling rather than the newer one with virtually none
    If your main concern is boring the D-2 will suit you better. They're a nice uncomplicated machine and nothing much goes wrong with them other than the ways firing up because of lack of lubrication. The built in facing slide is great to use, but that applies to both machines.

    If you need spares most small components can be made by any decent machine shop. I've done much more work on the D type machines than the SH so if you need advice you know where to come.

    What sort of foundation have you got. I think a foot of concrete was recommended in the old days and of course the machine was supposed to be bolted down.

    Regards Tyrone.

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    Firstly thanks for taking the time to reply once again.
    I have 8 inches of 45 newton concrete with fiber reinforcement. I reckon it should do the job.
    Is there a similar procedure to prep the D2 for transport?

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    Quote Originally Posted by lineboring steve View Post
    Firstly thanks for taking the time to reply once again.
    I have 8 inches of 45 newton concrete with fiber reinforcement. I reckon it should do the job.
    Is there a similar procedure to prep the D2 for transport?
    No not always, some machines had the hole in for the balance weight bar, some didn't. Has your machine got the hole in the column ? If it hasn't the pulley cover on top of the machine needs to be removed and long timbers slid down inside the column between the column side and the weight. Try and make them a snug fit. Bang a few large wooden wedges in but be sure not to drop any of them down the column !

    Regards Tyrone.

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    8" of good concrete should be ok. If you do drop any timbers down the column I can recommend a length of round bar with a nail in the end !

    Regards Tyrone.

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    Will the D2 have metric or Whitworth nuts and bolts?
    Is it a must to bolt the machine down?
    I guess I could bolt some 30mm plate to the floor and then bolt the borer to the plate.

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    Quote Originally Posted by lineboring steve View Post
    Will the D2 have metric or Whitworth nuts and bolts?
    Is it a must to bolt the machine down?
    I guess I could bolt some 30mm plate to the floor and then bolt the borer to the plate.
    Whitworth.

    It's in your best interests to bolt it down otherwise you'll be tinkering with the alignments on a regular basis.

    In your situation I used to mark the floor through the holding down bolt holes with a piece of bar with paint on the end. Move the machine, rawlbolt the floor, move the machine back over the rawlbolt holes and bolt down.

    If I remember correctly some of the holes are shrouded so you can't just drill down through them and use Parabolts.

    Of course the best way is to pocket the floor and use rag bolts but I suspect you may not want to do that.

    Regards Tyrone.

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    Well, I have purchased the D2.
    Just had a demo on it this morning.
    Anyone know where I could find a manual for it, and what it weighs?

  15. #115
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    Well done. I will post the link now

    Kearns Horizontal Borer | eBay

    You will probably find down the track it will not be big enough. No matter how big you buy, some job comes along where they are not big enough.

    Here is one for sale in this country. Kearn's Horizontal Borer | Other Tools & DIY | Gumtree Australia Frankston Area - Carrum Downs | 115425179

    The price is well. Optimistic. 10% of the listed price would be closer to what someone would pay in this country.

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    Quote Originally Posted by lineboring steve View Post
    Well, I have purchased the D2.
    Just had a demo on it this morning.
    Anyone know where I could find a manual for it, and what it weighs?
    Best way to estimate the weight of Hor bores is to break them down into their respective units. Educated guesses -

    Bed with gearboxes - 4 tons
    Spindle Frame - 1.25 tons
    Balance weight in column - 1.25 tons
    Column with pulley box etc - 1.5 tons
    Saddle with revolving table - 1.25 tons
    Outer support with base - 0.75 tons

    Total guesstimate trying to err on the side of caution - 10 tons. Could be a little bit more.

    Tony's lathes at store.lathe.co.uk has manuals for " Kearns No 2 and No 3 " machines but he doesn't say how old the machines in the manuals are. I'd make sure the handbook is relevant to your machine before buying.

    Good luck with it, I'm sure you'll have hours of fun.

    Regards Tyrone.
    Last edited by Tyrone Shoelaces; 09-16-2017 at 01:15 PM.

  17. #117
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    As I said I thought about bidding but im glad it went for reasonable money otherwise id be kicking myself if I could have got it for £1500!

  18. #118
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    Quote Originally Posted by RC99 View Post
    Well done. I will post the link now

    Kearns Horizontal Borer | eBay

    You will probably find down the track it will not be big enough. No matter how big you buy, some job comes along where they are not big enough.

    Here is one for sale in this country. Kearn's Horizontal Borer | Other Tools & DIY | Gumtree Australia Frankston Area - Carrum Downs | 115425179

    The price is well. Optimistic. 10% of the listed price would be closer to what someone would pay in this country.
    Not 100% sure but that machine looks like it could be wide bed and extended height.

  19. #119
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    Quote Originally Posted by RC99 View Post
    Well done. I will post the link now

    Kearns Horizontal Borer | eBay

    You will probably find down the track it will not be big enough. No matter how big you buy, some job comes along where they are not big enough.

    Here is one for sale in this country. Kearn's Horizontal Borer | Other Tools & DIY | Gumtree Australia Frankston Area - Carrum Downs | 115425179

    The price is well. Optimistic. 10% of the listed price would be closer to what someone would pay in this country.
    Not 100% sure but that machine looks like it could be wide bed and extended height.

  20. #120
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    The one I bought has had the same operator for 40 years.
    It was probably worth paying a sensible price, I think it was good value


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