Results 21 to 31 of 31
Thread: More Trashed Government tools
12-12-2011, 01:15 PM #21
We like to get wrapped up emotionally in material objects.
Some work went into building that lathe, but nobody alive today was actually involved in that first hand.
That lathe was used to machine parts. What parts nobody knows.
Through an unknown turn of events it came to be how it sits now.
Life is too short.
There are lots of decent running machine tools from Americas golden age of machine building. If you have a use for one save a few bucks and purchase one of those.
12-12-2011, 03:03 PM #22
"....put a crowbar through a window on my Cessna 195, then pryed it out against the fuselage, leaving a crease in the aluminum, just to steal a couple of low value cockpit lights."
Eeeeeeeekkk!!! Man, that's a shame.
12-12-2011, 06:45 PM #23
Davis Monthan is hardly an example of waste if anything it is the exact opposite. When it comes to aircraft you have an object that is highly sensitive to storage in the elements, rather than storing like the lathe in question, they found a location where those are minimal and land is cheap.
Many of the aircraft are there as their fleets are in the process of being retired. So those at Davis Monthan serve as parts machines to get the maximum use out of them. Other aircraft have cyclic fatigue limiting parts where they are only good for a certain number of hours. After a certain number of hours parts can start breaking, or falling off. Often the costs of rebuilding are not justified over buying new/retirement. On the other hand the aircraft still has plenty of parts that can help others in the fielded fleet. So Davis Monthan further serves its task of reducing waste by reusing parts.
Then there are aircraft like the A-10 Warthog that is one of the most cost effective ways to destroy large fleets of enemy armor. However thankfully at the moment there isn't much demand for such role. So they will sit at Davis Monthan waiting for the day when they may be needed again. How is this wasteful? If anything it is quite thrifty. Clearly the cost of keeping a fielded fleet of A-10 Warthogs in hangers in other parts of the country would be far greater than prepping them for long term storage in a dessert.
12-13-2011, 07:28 PM #24
...Davis Monthan is hardly an example of waste if anything it is the exact opposite...
Correct answer. The place is Unique for it's weather. Nothing there is scraped until It's time.
12-13-2011, 08:31 PM #25
air force boneyard, tucson, az - Google Maps
Here are a few of the 400 B-52s destroyed because of the arms reduction treaty some years ago. Cost $53.4 million each in 1998 dollars.
I still maintain there is more waste here than in one broken rusty lathe.
Navy: suisan bay mothball fleet, ca - Google Maps
suisan bay mothball fleet, ca - Google Maps
Inside the Ghost Ships of the Mothball Fleet | Beyond the Photos
james river reserve fleet - Google Maps
bremerton naval shipyard - Google Maps
Naval Inactive Ship Maintenance Facility - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
12-13-2011, 09:33 PM #26
I'm sure I'll piss somebody off who is trying to snipe it (in it's rusty glory... maybe) , but did you see that 10 year old machining center that ran 90 minutes a year? Edit:They never unpacked it, the 15 hours was factory setup time. Spindle's still bolted down.
Conveyor still in cardboard
been outside for awhile...
12-13-2011, 09:56 PM #27
I have heard that Davis Monthan is not a good place to store airplanes to preserve them. The extreme temperature cycling is bad for the materials. Supposedly the reason for storing them there is that there is a lot of flat unused ground.
12-13-2011, 10:23 PM #28
Paul, while a few of those Naval vessels may have had some potential that cannot be said of the B52s. The earlier models were rode hard and put away wet during the Vietnam war. You might recall that WWII bombers were designed to fly 25 combat missions. If you think about it, B52s were designed to fly 1. In Vietnam they flew hundreds of missions with maximum bomb loads. When those bombs were released the wings, which had a normal vertical travel of about 16 feet at the tips, flapped furiously. They were beset with cracks and corrosion was persistent after the tropical climates they were operated in. Their life was very limited and reliability had been compromised. They had very little value in a nuclear conflict and had been ineffective with dumb bombs. They were easy to shoot down . As an Air Force brat on a SAC base I loved 'em but their time was past.
Aircraft at the AMARC facility are in 3 classes:
1. Short term storage. These can be supposedly be restored to airworthy in a week or so.
2. Long term storage. These are cocooned and evaluated for their potential use. Early models may be sold to civilian operators or cannibalized to keep later aircraft flying. Some may be sold to allies. They have the potential to be reactivated.
3. No further application militarily and must be demilitarized to be sold. All useable parts are removed and stocked for current aircraft. The balance is sold for scrap.
12-14-2011, 12:59 AM #29
Something people not on Navy ships may not realize is the mothballed fleets serve as parts ships for the active fleet.
I've made several half million+++ dollar repairs at no cost with no downtime using parts that were floating in Bremerton.
There is a Naval parts depot in Tacoma that makes the mothballed ships seem insignificant.
12-14-2011, 09:19 AM #30
When I was running a public works department on Long Island, we bought a number of items through the Federal Property Disposal Program, in fact at least one 1986 International flat bed truck acquired for $1200 is still earning its keep in Sea Cliff. We bought items primarily stored at Lakehurst and Picatinny Arsenal. The huge blimp hangar at Lakehurst was a vast indoor storage area however, large precision machinery was left unprotected outside. As a public official looking to conserve tax dollars and get the most for my budget money, I appreciated the program but couldn't help question the waste involved by not protecting useful equipment. I'm not talking abut combat items that had to be demilitarized, but high quality commerical maintenance equipment that had broad application in small local minicipalities.
12-14-2011, 12:37 PM #31
Trying to get this wide-ranging thread back on track: Looking at this lathe makes me almost itch to try out the John Oder technique of pushing off rust with oil and a carbide machinist's scraper. Maybe, John, you could either re-issue your description of the process or point us at the thread where you described it?
Did you use a scraper you made in your shop, or one of those Anderson scrapers with the replaceable "business end"? (IIRC, you make your own scrapers by brazing.) Did you sharpen it any differently for rust removal than you would sharpen it for scraping to flatten? Does rust removal duty dull the scraper quickly?