New (to me) Axelson lathe - Page 2
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  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by alskdjfhg View Post
    The 30" Summit I run sometimes at the shop I work in has clutch problems too.
    One of the less justifiable "needs fixed, but has not been" items, machine-tool clutches can be.

    EVEN IF.. the OEM clutch maker has left the building, clutch repair/rebuild/modification capability abounds.

    Aside from the obvious auto/truck markets, there are forklift, ATV / RV, Marine drive, agricultural, construction, conveyor & hoist uses and their various & sundry PTO's.

    "Tedious" to track down or fab the needfuls and rebuild a clutch to proper functionality, perhaps. Rocket-science? Not even close.

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Boatwrench View Post
    Thank you all for your replies. I got the lathe off the trailer and on the ground in my shop okay today. Boy, that thing is all there! I won't have much time to spend on it for the next several weeks, but at least it is inside and will be taken care of. I found the serial number, it is 2440.
    I got a 4 jaw and a 3 jaw chuck as well as a very nice service and parts manual with it, but no other tooling unfortunately. One thing that puzzles me is the spindle speeds, the specs in the manual say 13 to 1137 RPM but mine is 13 to 849. The shift levers are the push-pull detent style, not spring loaded balls, and cast ways. I am guessing it is from the early 50s?
    Thanks again everyone!
    A fixed steady would have been handy. Travelling steady not so much. Good luck with it.

    Regards Tyrone.

  3. #23
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    I found the serial number, it is 2440
    Serial Number Reference Book for Metalworking Machinery says 1944

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  5. #24
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    I spent almost thirty years in a big shop that had three Axelson's, two 16"ers and a a 36" er(I think). After retiring from there, I had the opportunity to run a nice 16" Pacemaker for a few days. Loved that thing. These Axelson's were new about the mid sixties. We also had five new Monarch's, ranging from 20" and two 16" and a 14" as well as a new 10EE. The bigger Monarch's were 600 series. My personal opinion is that, I wouldn't trade a nice Pacemaker for three Axelsons. In all fairness, I will say that the Axelsons had the best ways. After almost 30 years of use twenty four hrs a day, seven days a week, the ways still looked almost new. Not so with the Monarchs.

    JH

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  7. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by James H Clark View Post
    I spent almost thirty years in a big shop that had three Axelson's, two 16"ers and a a 36" er(I think). After retiring from there, I had the opportunity to run a nice 16" Pacemaker for a few days. Loved that thing. These Axelson's were new about the mid sixties. We also had five new Monarch's, ranging from 20" and two 16" and a 14" as well as a new 10EE. The bigger Monarch's were 600 series. My personal opinion is that, I wouldn't trade a nice Pacemaker for three Axelsons. In all fairness, I will say that the Axelsons had the best ways. After almost 30 years of use twenty four hrs a day, seven days a week, the ways still looked almost new. Not so with the Monarchs.

    JH
    Last Axelson lathes were made in 1956. Those after were made by a different company that bought the name and made a cheap charlie version of the lathe and marketed other machine tools under the Axelson name.

  8. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tyrone Shoelaces View Post
    A slight exaggeration but if you said 30 years you wouldn't be far wrong.

    Regards Tyrone.
    I think you forget that 30 years ago is the late eighties! My' modern' dsg is 39 years old and my other dsg I bought when I finished my time in the mid nineties when it was 28 years old is now 50 years old! Time flies!

  9. #27
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    I have boxes of Machinery mag,from 1939 to mid 1950,s and seen Axelsons advertised by some dealers in London. Never seen one over here,though or even heard about ones whereabouts.

  10. #28
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    Good morning all,
    Wow, 1944. When they told me it was old, they weren't kidding. I am going to spend some time reading in the restoration threads as to how best to proceed. The ways and most of the non painted surfaces have various amounts of rust and I sure don't want to cause any new problems. I am in the boat business and interestingly the Twin Disk company that makes most of the transmissions for diesel powered boats made the clutches in these lathes. Heavy duty is the name of the game here I think. With the slow maximum spindle speeds would I still be able to use insert type carbide tools? The versatility and availability of them would be nice. The Pacemakers and others I ran used them and worked quite well. Thank you all for your comments. I am really happy to have this machine and to have joined your group.
    Peyton

  11. #29
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    RPM and stock diameter determine the SFM. SFM determines what tools you use.

  12. #30
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    Any lathe made after about 1935 is optimized for carbide. My 1918 L&S was made when HSS was the latest and greatest cutting tool technology. The spindle speed range is 13 to about 500rpm and it has a 5hp motor. With HSS, that means that it runs at the proper speed for cutting steel (100ft/min) anywhere from 18"-1/2". The HD 20" Pacemaker at work was built in 1944 and designed to use carbide to best effect. It has spindle speeds from 25-1200rpm and a 20hp motor. It can run a carbide cutter at 200-250ft/min, suitable for steel from 20-1/2" diameter.

    Funny thing is that, if you run the numbers on the HP and rpm to get torque at the given speeds they are identical from top to bottom speed. That's why anybody that says these old low speed lathes are useless, has obviously never run one. With 1750lbs/ft of torque at 13rpm, that old 1918 machine can pull a HELL of a cut at a scary rate of feed. Get it running 100rpm on a 4" piece of 4140 or similar high quality steel and it can gnaw well over 1/2" off the diameter per pass at .015-.020/rev feed. That was a first class industrial lathe of the first quarter of the 20th century.

    The Pacemaker is equally impressive and can take that same cut at twice or better the RPMS, so it can work twice as fast... but often you'll find yourself backing off a little to avoid the shower of red hot chips that burn anything they land on, including you, your clothes, your other tools, your workbench, your boots and laces, and any co-workers that get within 20 feet of the machine. Generally what you can do with the Pacemaker is limited more by how well you can hold the work, rigidity of the work, and other factors such as interrupted cuts that hammer the carbide cutter into obvlivion.

    Now, can I use carbide in my old L&S. Absolutely! It is actually the perfect speed range for stainless steels, titanium, and hard materials that must be run slower, even with carbide. Can you use HSS in the Pacemaker, Absolutely! I have taken scary big cuts when turning down 12 and 14" stainless pipe flanges where I had to go through the bolt holes. The interrupted cut was instantly shattering the carbide cutters. Swapped to HSS with a razor sharp high rake hook tool, dropped the speed way down to prevent burning and took 3/4" depth of cut. The high tensile strength of the HSS versus the carbide kept it from breaking, the high rake angle reduced cutting force, kept thrust to a minimum and used less power than the carbide cutter.

  13. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by TedinNorfolk View Post
    I have boxes of Machinery mag,from 1939 to mid 1950,s and seen Axelsons advertised by some dealers in London. Never seen one over here,though or even heard about ones whereabouts.
    I've never seen one over here. A couple of " Monarchs " yes but not many other American centre lathes. The lathes we needed in the 1939-45 war were capstan and turret lathes for semi skilled " War Work " so I did see " Warner & Swasey " and " Gisholt ", " Acme " machines etc back in the day. Most of these got scrapped by the late 1970's over here.

    Regards Tyrone.

  14. #32
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    I will be working mostly stainless steel and aluminum, although I imagine a fair amount of regular steel as well. I found an asset number or whatever you may call it riveted to the headstock for USA C&CCC. I know the CCC was the Civilian Conservation Corps, but C&CCC was something different altogether. It was the Carbide & Carbon Chemical Corporation, later Union Carbide, and they were involved in producing parts for the Manhattan Project and other nuclear projects from 1944 to 1946. Oak Ridge TN is very close to Norris where I picked up the lathe and a lot of early nuclear research and production was carried on there. I wonder what may my lathe may have been used for? I know there is still a lot of secrecy about what all was done at the various labs in the area. Makes you wonder. For what it is worth, the Axelson does not glow in the dark

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  16. #33
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    Very possibly an Oak Ridge machine. As for the materials, it will have no trouble with any of them, but you need to make sure you know what speeds to run for each material or you'll trash a bunch of cutters. Machines like this have so much rigidity and power that they just keep going, no matter what happens to the cutter.

    You'll probably find good razor sharp HSS cutters ideal for aluminum. Just use WD-40 as a cutting fluid and it comes out nice and shiny. Aluminum likes to stick to carbide unless you are running flood coolant and REALLY hauling ass. If it sticks, it eventually breaks off and takes the cutter edge with it. If it sticks to HSS. you can knock the slug loose with a punch and use more WD next time.


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