Just got a nice SIP MP-3K !! Would like more background info...

OK, so although I have heard on here that Jig Borers are essentially being given away because they are so obsolete and useless... Well, I never found one for free.... So while some may say I spent $3,000 I didnt have to, I am now the proud owner of a magnificent Societe Genovise d'instruments Physics MP-3K jig borer. The attention to detail with which this machine was engineered and built takes my breath away. Craftsmanship meets artwork, meets no regard for how much it costs..... Wow.... What an incredible piece of machinery.

This machine saw very very little use. The ways still look amazing, the backlash is absolutely non-existant, even with the backlash snugging levers, totally disengaged. The handwheels have a feel..... really, I have no way of quite explaining... absolute glass..... Just an amazing machine made by an amazing company....

So, what I would like to find out, is first of all, what year my little lady was built. She wears serial number 485. I gather that is a pretty early model, and I notice that she lacks some of the changes I see in newer models, like the 'window' in the gear shift lever so you can see the numbers behind the lever....

I would also love some additional information on the company, SIP. I have the info from lathes.uk, but was wondering if anyone has old factory pictures of machines at their works, advertising material etc....

I do have the owners/operators manual, but would love to get a shop manual for it, or even some exploded views of the guts of this divine little girl...

Below are some pics of her safe and sound in my home shop... Any help members could give me regarding info on it would be most appreciated.

Kevin


IMG_8804 by Zinopower, on Flickr


IMG_8805 by Zinopower, on Flickr


IMG_8808 by Zinopower, on Flickr


IMG_8811 by Zinopower, on Flickr


IMG_8814 by Zinopower, on Flickr


IMG_8829 by Zinopower, on Flickr

If you never throw the juice to her Bruce, it will still be well worth the investment!
However, I thought we already had a thread on porn in the shop?
Absolutely beautifull!


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Think Snow Eh!
Ox

Lovely ! If it was over here I'd gladly pay $3000 for it too.
How many HP does it have ? And does is specify a maximum drilling capacity ?

Truly lovely machine, as you say it's a work of art both in design and execution. I worked on a bigger one than that, MP 4K ? Regards Tyrone.

Kevin,

What a beautiful machine! Regarding year, I have a book Jig Boring published in 1963, it shows this model, but nothing about year of introduction.

Is this the one out of Cleveland? I'm at work now but tonight I will post more
Todd

THanks for the kind replies.

Panza, it has a 1 HP motor, and is rated only 3/4" drilling I believe, but with a low spindle gear of 75 RPM, Im sure you could go larger than that, but the limitation is the Morse #2 internal taper. That is a really small taper for attempting to drill large. The way they were able to specify boring up to 4" on this machine, is that the SIP boring heads actually secure to the OUTER of the spindle nose taper, which is quite large and extremely stiff. THe internal morse taper, was just for convenience for small drill chucks, end mill holders etc....

Tyonne, I think the next size up was a MK-4G if I am not mistaken.

Peter, I found another one on the internet with a serial number of 440 which was 1966... So Im thinking mine (#485) is probably a 1967 or so ??? I am sure they didnt exactly make hundreds of these a year or anything... Id be surprised if they made 30 a year....

Yes SIP6A it came from outside of cleveland, Aurora Ohio to be exact. .. Would love to hear more from you Todd/SIP6A, as Im guessing you are a SIP expert !!!!!

Kevin

I have a moore and it looks like a chinese mill drill compared to that. I really need one of those that is sweet.

"The attention to detail with which this machine was engineered and built takes my breath away. Craftsmanship meets artwork, meets no regard for how much it costs..... Wow.... What an incredible piece of machinery."

Rankin Cycle:

That is one of the best desceptions of SIP machinery that I have ever heard.

Send your mailing address to [email protected] and I will send you a copy of a 3K catalog.

Your estamation of the year 1966 - 1967 sounds about right.

SIP over the years published 3 historys "As Seventy Years Went By" (1942) "As eighty Years Went By" (1952) and "SIP 1862 - 1962" thease can be found on the used book sights from time to time.
In the 100 year history it's stated that SIP up until 1962 built 6000 jig boring machines. I don't know for sure but I would guess that fron 1962 - 2012 they built at least that many more.

There were several versions of the #3 machine built there was the 3K like you have there was a 3KA which had a NIXI tube readout ant the was a NC machine called a 3K-CN

You can go to this link and read about a SIP MP-1H that I have been working on.
http://www.practicalmachinist.com/v...ene-mills/working-sip-mp-1h-jig-borer-254276/

If you ever want to sell it (somewhat reasonably) I would love to put something like that (or several somethings like that) in my new (not built or aquired just yet) office.

Was down to Mohawk many yrs ago and they had iron in the breezeway and office. (and an old armored suit too I think)
I really like the feel of that.



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Think Snow Eh!
Ox

Rankin Cycle-- Wowww! What a beauty

Thanks for posting the pics

Markus

Just wondering will that machine handle milling of any sort or is it drill and bore only? I see what look to be power feeds on the machine, or are they just rapids for moving the head?

Would you use a Rolls-Royce to pull a plough ( or plow ) ? Regards Tyrone.

You wanted a manual? Tony has them (part # SM560L)

http://www.lathes.co.uk/manuals/

Would you use a Rolls-Royce to pull a plough ( or plow ) ?

Click to expand...

DNV - Samson Goes Ploughing



smt

Hah !! Now thats pretty funny right there...

Well to answer the question directly.. Of course you can mill on a jig borer. Regarding power feeds, the only controlled feed is on the quill, for boring. The 'X' and the 'Y' have no power feed at all, its all hand crank. The bridge 'z' axis has a power feed, but it is for re-positioning, not machining.

Now, that being said, you dont want to mill on a production basis, nor even occasionaly in a very aggressive fashion. You want to go easy on those leadscrews. These machines are extremely heavily built, and milling will not damage the machine as a whole. In fact, boring exerts far greater loads on the machine than milling. THe difference is when you bore, you are not moving the X and Y axis, your not moving the precision lead screws with load on them. You are just sitting there, with the table and head locked, and the quill is feeding down, putting the tremendous loads right into the meat and potatoes of the machine.

But when you are milling, you are moving the table and thus, the work, with its machining reaction forces, with the leadscrews and putting that load, as thus wear on the lead screws.

For a home shop, with occasional milling, with taking your time and well lubricated lead screws, I doubt you would do too much wear. But remember, a jig borer's greatest asset is its immaculately machined leadscrews... Literally, 10 times more precise leadscrews that the finest Bridgeport.... So you really want to be careful with those leadscrews...

Kevin

I bet I've looked at this thread half a dozen times and I'm still not over the beauty of this machine, what a gorgeous specimen.

Thanks for sharing.

Not pulling a plow - BUT....

That is one beautiful machine. Plant I retired from has a larger one (as far as I know it is still there) in the tool room, and it did not see a lot of use. Has it's own separate room with glass walls - kind of a work of art from the hall, in a way. Twenty years ago I remember we were having dimensional stability issues on some of our layers (multi layer board product that the rest of industry would call a detail, or sometimes and inner layer, but our weird part of a big blue company had our own language). Some of the engineers were having issues trying to measure locations so my boss, who ran the whole board shop (I had half the engineers, not the ones with the issues) and had started life as a tool maker, yells at me come on, we're going to go figure this out. He had also managed the tool room and was probably the only person in the whole plant who had the respect (and nerve) to walk into the place and use anything he wanted, any time, no questions asked. So we basically used the SIP as a precision measuring device, using a tool makers microscope to dial in on our registration system and do some measurements. Ten minutes we had the answer we needed. Only time I ever touched one - but in addition to being pretty, had to be the smoothest mechanical device I have ever used. I am sure the developer never figured somone would use such a machine for such a screwball application. Now if I was only smart enough (and had one in the shop) to use for boring!
Dale

Seeing those pictures is kind of like going to the "Smithsonian"-- that is one gorgeous machine!

I am sure the developer never figured somone would use such a machine for such a screwball application.

Click to expand...

Actually, as someone already mentioned, one of the primary features of jig borers was either "perfect" compensated leadscrews, or a method of using gage blocks for absolute position. Moore's #3 jig grinder actually morphed into an early version of the cmm.... just as digital scales were appearing on the horizon.

The other essential feature of a jig borer is that it be designed and constructed to make holes round and perpendicular to the ways, "everywhere" within the total travel envelop. (or IOW, every hole anywhere parallel to every other). Also that the X & Y axes are really at 90° to each other.

A BP with a good DRO will now do about as good with the measuring if the tables are locked at each move and easier to keep track, no need to be sure of leadscrew reversal, etc. But it won't bore holes with the same level or perpendicularity & "linearity". The tables on a BP yaw as they are cranked around, the quill rocks as it extends, and due to the famous table "droop" the X axis on a BP with any use tends to travel in a (very large radius, admitted) arc. So holes on work mounted to table tend to be somewhat radial rather than parallel especially if they are far apart.

So yeah, despite me posting the Rolls picture, bore on the SIP, mill on the BP

smt