Unusual Way to Turn A Journal!

This is a twin tandem compound reversing engine in the erecting hall of the William Tod Company in Youngstown.

Clever idea Rick, a portable in situ turning rig, Wonder if they were truing up a slight warp, which had shown up, The clearances on the other two bearings must have been good to get a good finish & no ovality, considering the inertia forces from the big cranks.

Are they rebuilding that engine? With all the dirt and other assorted $hit all over it, it looks like a used engine. Not what I'd expect for an assembly area

Valid point Scott, The wee guy at the front seems to have collected plenty on his overalls, I never noticed all the crap, ( Especially on the bearing caps), till you mentioned, Wouldnt it have been super fun getting all those shrunk hoops out at the bedplate joint line! Would make sense for the machining rig on journal, In use i bet it had hell knocked out of it, as the blooms or girders etc. hit the rolls

It is a new engine, going together for the first time on the erecting shop floor. It doesn't look any dirtier than I would expect it to. Those would be unpainted castings as the paint wouldn't go on until after its assembled.

The William Tod Co. was the first to build a commercially successful twin tandem compound engine. They later became the standard for steam driven blooming mills because of their sheer power. This engine was probably 10,000 to 15,000 hp as built.

The reign of the heavy duty stationary engine for rolling mills was extremely short. They started to get big and powerful around 1900, then electric motors came about and the last engine was built in 1920.

Rick,
I'm intrigued by your comments statiing Tod were the Ist successful builders of twin tandem steam engines. Does this apply to rolling mill engines or to any application ?


Mac,
Of all the tasks involved in my experience dismantling large machinery, removing shrink links and hoops is the most unpredictable. Sunk ones such as those in the photo are the most challenging - the last ones I tackled (6 off )were extracted by drilling and tapping 3/4 Whit. holes through each end of the link and jacking them out so they could be welded up and reused upon reassembly of a Stott of Haslingden ( Lancashire ) tandem compound.
Flywheel hoops are quite often drilled and / or cut through by enthusiasts - I prefer the traditional method of forcing them off with wedges. This took 14 man hours for the flywheel of the engine mentioned above !

They built the first successful twin tandem compound rolling mill engines. This statement was made not only by Tod but but a consulting engineer at Mesta Machine, their chief competitor. If their competitor say it I'm more likely to believe it!

A couple of days ago I printed out the drawings of the large Mesta crankshaft posted by Rick on another thread.
http://www.practicalmachinist.com/vb/showthread.php?t=112325&page=2

I happened to be reading the "Method of Machining & Assembling Crankshaft" and I think it offers an explanation for the turning operation shown in the photo above.

The Mesta crank is assembled up with the centre main shaft, crank pins and crank arms (webs) all finish machined. The main shafts on each end of the crank shaft however, are not finish machined except for the diameter that is fitted to the crank arm. The final machining of the outer-most main bearing journals is done with the crankshaft resting in the inner main bearings. I am guessing that there is no bearing shell fitted while that finish turning operation is taking place. I wonder if that is a bar between the crank arms to keep them from flexing while this operation is taking place? There are 6" diameter holes in the Mesta crank arms which might have been used for this (sheer speculation).

I believe you have figured it out! That makes sense to me. It is easier to line up two bearings than three, and if you can turn the third journal while the other two are in their bearings the third will naturally be aligned with the other two.

Rick, What year was the Mesta Consultant referring to in his statement that Tods built the first succesful twin tandem mill engine ? I would expect he was referring to rolling engines and his statement only was regarding the American sub Continent? My reasonfor saying this is in 1878/79 Messrs Miller & Co of Coatbridge Lanarkshire, built a twin tandem compound rail mill engine for The Hallside Steelworks, Cambuslang Nr. Glasgow, This works was owned by the Steel Co. of Scotland Sounds a reasonably early twin compound rolling engine.

An old plant engineer, i worked beside told me an interesting story of an experience he had in that plant, in the mid 1920/s. During the tea break he was down in the crankshaft pit, tightening up a loose crank bearing bolt, on the big cogging engine when the big steam hammer in the forge dept. in the next bay started early, pounding a heavy forging, Old Thomas had by the grace of God, his hand resting on the big crank web, when he felt her starting to creep round, He just managed to fling himself out the crank well before she took off, it would seem the vibration from the hammer had crept the throttle lever forward, A lucky escape!

Rick you mention that by 1920, the days of the big rolling engine was over due to the onset of the big electric motor, Although, occasionally in Europe one was built, The Beardmore engine at Parkhead in Glasgow, was built in 1942, as a replacement as the war was started, She wasnt a really huge engine compared to the big Todd, Although she was a powerful armour plate mill engine,

I also believe the Rhur steelworks, had a couple of engines built after the war, (the 1950/s) But as you rightly say , the days of the Leviathens was over by 1920, sadly.

You know how us Americans are! If it didn't happen over here then it didn't happen!

I believe the Mesta engineer was referring mainly to US practice. However, what was the horsepower of that Miller & Co. engine? I'm genuinely interested in researching the validity of this claim, since TTC engines were in use well before '05. Perhaps the earlier engines were not of the same horsepower range that these big bloomers were.

Hi Rick, Bear with me, I am busy looking for data in the old Miller engine seems not a lot is known, however i am certain she might only be half the horse power of the big Tod However this little item of Millers history may be of some interest. It is amazing how frequently one looks at an old factory building, and it doesnt dawn on one what it originally was, until years later!
In Coatbridge until about 1987, on Stobcross Street, was a very large building, which looked like a large erecting shop, huge tall establishment, much bigger than the factory buildings of its competitors Lamberton Brothers, or Murray & Paterson, This establishment stretched the whole length of Stobcross Street, and was Miller & co Engineers, Vulcan Foundry, Apparently they had begun in the Stobcross area of Glasgow prior to the 1850/s, and removed to Coatbridge ( hence the street name) For some reason, in the mid 1890/s they withdrew from engine building all together and concentrated in the production of rivets, bolts & nuts, ( Becoming The Rivet Bolt & Nut Co.) Up until the late 1960 period one could hear the pounding of the rivet machines, when one passed the end of the street
With the huge size of that building i am led to think on what enormous engines could have been turned out, had they stayed in engine and steelworks plant & why did they change direction?