Someone posted a topic in the general forum asking "what did you do while the forum was down?" Well, I discovered Craigslist. Until Saturday I had never seen it.

Last night just home from work I found a local add for an "old metal lathe" with a crappy photo, but one leg was recognizable.
More photos web page web page web page web page web page

I know very little about these old lathes. I can see that the Y feed knob is gone and I don't know what's up with the spindle. Is that the spindle nose? I am currently burried in a CNC retrofit project so it may be some time before I touch it. I know it's kind of a taboo subject, but is this worth more parting out or selling whole? I have been looking for a 13"(ish) Clausing type lathe for awhile, I would be putting the money toward that. -Mike

Its a 5C - that is where the collet got its name, having been made originally for this lathe. Yes, modern 5C collets fit right in.

The nose is the old Hardinge standard taper nose. You will find stuff on Ebay from time to time that fits this nose, like chucks.

John

Actually, I have a chuck that fits this, although I mounted a backplate on it to fit my lathe.

It has a fairly shallow taper and a locating pin that it appears fits into that grove in the nose to lock in place.

I got mine from www.plazamachinery.com . You might want to check with them if they have any more (they had mine listed as a plain back, though).

Steve

It looks like a Cataract 57, which means 5C collet and 7" swing. The serial number is on the flat surface of the headstock below the spindle nose. It will probably be something like 5-7-NNNN. There will probably be a different number on the right hand end of the bed. Sometimes there is also a number on the top of the slide rest, in front of the t-slot. You might have to get through some paint and rust to find the markings.

The 57 and 59 Cataracts are more valuable than the 37, 47, 49 or 67 models because the 5C collets and chucks are much more common than the smaller or larger sizes.

Tony's site - Cataract

Larry

It appears that over the years someone thought to pour something on the top of the exposed metal parts in order to protect them from rust. There is a heavy layer of grime filled oily substance on the tops of everything and the typical orange rust on the underneath. If this will take 5C collets and the through hole is >1" I might have a use for it after all (if a Clausing lathe falls through). I just saw a thread of Jim Rozens over in the hardinge forum that shows his apart. I'll have to uncover the serial number in the morning. -Mike

Holescreek:

May we ask how much you paid for this lathe?

The rust has gone past the "surface" stage, with significant loss of metal, but with a lot of TLC it might yet be restored to functionality if not beauty. I've seen things rusted worse than this be made to work.

I'd suggest a good dousing with Kroil to start. Then start in with the electrolytic process.

John Ruth

Nah, I am going to want to sell it to help finance another purchase. While I do enjoy restoring old machinery (including my grandfathers Atlas lathe that I have never posted on the PM board). I just do not have the luxury of space for yet another old flat belt drive lathe.

I don't know what "kroil" is, but I was planning on using the electrlytic process to de-rust it.
I'll have to google Kroil here in a little bit.

I kind of winced when I saw the Craigslist photo but when I saw it in person it sure looked salvageable to me. I had to hand scrape a .025" bow out of my grandfathers lathe bed and it turned out better than new. This lathe wouldn't prove to be any more challenging I think. My problem is being torn between wanting to restore it and wanting to flip it for a profit towards a larger lathe. Now to discover Kroil... -Mike

This could be an operational machine with some
fairly large amount of effort. As to the question
of, should you part it out, that sort of depends
on what you are into it for.

You will not get too much for it, parted out on
ebay. The compound slide would be the single
most valuable part and that is honestly in rough
shape.

The entire lathe could make a winter project for
you.

I cannot tell if it is a seven inch or a nine
inch from the photos but a quick check with
a ruler will answer that one. The s/n as
mentioned is right under the spindle, on the
front of the headstock. If painted over it
will be tough to read but it will be there.

Because it was made in chicago rather than
elmira, that puts it before a certain date (that
larry would be best to declare for certain)
which is around 1930 or so.

Jim

Jim

Kroil,

Works like magic, and smells good too! Kroil Link

Andy

Now if it was made in Buffalo NY, you would really have something.
EvapoRust is fabulous stuff, by the way.

--Doozer

[ 11-01-2007, 09:49 PM: Message edited by: Doozer ]

I googled Seifreat-Elstad Machinery and oddly enough hit a PDF of the Cornell University Alumni Assn from Jan 14th 1926 and 1929 which lists Seifret as an ME graduate class of 1921 as the Sales Engineer of the company which was located at 205 South Canal St. in Dayton. I have an early hand drawn map at home (that I'll have to dig out) which shows the locations of all of the companies downtown on all of the streets that no longer exist. Don't you just love the history of these old machines?

Andy, What's the diff between Kroil and PB Blaster? I have used it since it was suggested in another thread a few years back. Have you tried both? -Mike

I guess it was just curosity that made me stop everything else I had going on and start disassembly. As L Vanice stated I found both of the serial numbers easily enough. The scraping under the headstock is nothing short of artwork. -Mike

I wouldnt mind one of those flat belt machines..
Suprisingly, both my own bench lathes (forum logo and an esm) look in much nicer condition than your first photo, however, neither look anywhere near as good underneath the headstock. Bet that was a nice sight [img]smile.gif[/img]

J Grainger

I guess the number with the 4-7 is the one
on the headstock, the other one is on the
*right* hand side of the bed?

My 5-9 does not use that convention:



I've never actually checked the side of the bed,
will do so tonight.

Jim

Is there a list of serial numbers and dates of manufacture? I searched the archives at lunchtime and was surprised at how little there was said about these lathes.

Here are some comments on serial numbers and dates of Hardinge machines. Serial number discussion

Larry

I did look at the cataract bed last night, and
indeed the right side was stamped with the
obround hardinge logo, and underneath that was
a serial number, preceeded with the typical
N_o. stamp. The end of the bed had been quite
battered in its former life so that made it
tough to recognize, but the number is probably
2702 but there is a slight possiblity it is
2792 instead.

Because the numbers were stamped by hand there
is a fair bit of vertical displacement in the
digits.

If *all* the serial numbers are preceeded by
that N_o stamp then the headstock for this
machine is serial number 182. But it does not
have the 5-9 stamp there the way the others
do. Maybe that convention took a while to
catch on?

Jim