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Wire guides...

Jay Cee

Hot Rolled
Joined
Apr 24, 2006
Location
North East Ohio
Has anyone wore out a set of V guides on the new Makino's yet (SP-43)? Do they really make it to 10,000 hours?? I just change guides on my Charmilles 6030 at the beginning of the year. Parts have same issues now as what had me change the guides then. Running stratified wire. Do you think I really could have worn out a set of $1300.00 guides in a mere 6 months???
 
Jay Cee,

Makino's guide configuration has been exactly as it is for a number of years. Going from experience gained through operation of thousands of WEDM machines over the years, the figure of 12,000 hours guide life is based on real world operating conditions. The primary reason that Makino's guides last so long is that there is a full 5mm of land, as compared to about 1mm in other guide systems. Secondly, the vee-type guide also lets debris pass around the wire, rather than let it accumulate in the lower guide. The Charmilles machine that you mention can realistically achieve between 1,000 and 2,000 hours between guide changes, depending upon the wire and cutting conditions used. Stratified wire will cause more wear on all components of the transport and guide system, but 5 months on a set of guides sounds awful.
 
Ya know what's even worse. I have not run any taper on that machine and don't even run 24/7. I would say I have around 560 hours on those guides. Not even aftermarket... Came directly from the big orange company themselves... I need some V's... Wonder if anyone makes a retro-fit??
 
TMD:

Do you have the old Agie 315 with the saphire guides, little flip over pressure pad inside the flushbox? The company I worked for had one and it was super. The guides never did show any wear. They had T-Star (at the time) come in and change it over to the Mitz style guides and their own power supply upgrade. That sweet little machine was never the same after that!

Dana
 
EDM AE, I hear ya on the "It's still a 6030..." I tell you what, I have never run a more tempermental and high maintainence machine. Big $$ for a big pain... Don't get me wrong, I've run worse machines, but they didn't cost nearly what this thing did. It's funny that Agie came up in this string. Those were the first WEDM's I ever ran. The 315 with a 110 post processor and the 100 with a 200 post processor. Hmm, not sure if that's right. That was 17 years ago. What ever they were, they always made a perfect part. The only problems I ever had with them was bumping the earth filters, changing those belts (still doing that now on a $200,000 machine), and flipping that toggle switch from G42 to G41 when coming back across on the skim. Man, offset toggle switch's... does that mean I'm old or was it just the machines??
 
I don't recall the model Agie I ran back then, but it also had weights on pulleys which would hang on the wire; you would switch them for rough and skim passes. Yes sir, I think we're getting old. :S
 
Dcrouch,

My Agie came with the cone pointed diamond guides and the originals are still going strong. I have a Agie Vertex however that runs .00078 tungsten wire. The tungsten is very abrasive, even on the diamond guides. Looks like I am up for replacement about every 800 hours (4 indexes) or 200 hours/side and then there are upper and lower guides so my guide cost on this machine is going to be in the (800 hours @ $3200) $4./hour range...just for guides. I don't see any way around this no matter who makes a machine like this (super fine wire). It is one of the casualties of making things smaller and smaller.


Offset switch? Before my time. Also: a toggle switch for G41/G42? Guess I wasn't alive then...
I am glad I never had to deal with that.

TMD
 
I'm looking at the old set of guides out of our AC-100 machine. We changed them out with 55,700 cutting hours on them. Changed them out but still holding on to them for a "just in case" situation. Might be able to get 1 index out of them with some luck.
Mark
 
Makes you wonder why other companies don't use a guide system you don't have to replace like AGIE's. They'd rather ding ya for a $K than build the best machine they can.
 
Still waiting to hear from you Makino SP-43 users... Are the guides as good as the salesman says?? Is the fact that they split for cleaning and then close again without need for re-squaring the wire a fact or fiction?? Are there components under or above the guides that need regular maintenance and thus still forcing you to remove the guides and square the wire on a regular basis? That guide splitting ability and the longevity of guide life had me looking real hard... I have yet to hear a complaint on those machines.
 
Jay Cee, These things are true. The guides split during threading and for cleaning, etc. and do not need to be re-aligned unless you change wire diameters or make some sort of mistake resulting in a crash. (Although, the crash protection on this machine is excellent) The split guide system also helps to make threading highly reliable even with very small start holes. Naturally, there are other maintenance items in the heads which will need periodic maintenance, but none of these necessitate the removal of/or any interference with/ the wire guides. This machine also utilizes some of the most advanced generator and servo technology in the industry, resulting in straighter cuts, reduced cycle times, and arguably the lowest maintenance and wire consumption in the WEDM market. There are many SP-series machines in your area; why not google some of those users and contact them directly to get some first-hand (un-biased) feedback on how well they like their Makinos? You'll find that most shops who own these machines are more than happy to take a few minutes to talk with you about them.
 








 
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