I whant to make a CNC

fausto · Mar 4, 2003

Hi there gent's, I'm looking to build my self a CNC lathe and would apreciate your imput on what CNC software to use for a PC to be a good CNC control, any advice is greatly apreciated.

johnfly · Mar 4, 2003

check out this site !!!!! I am thinking about doing the same thing unless i can find somthing else.....but still waiting for a deal. lol.... and waiting .....
heres the link.http://www.homecnc.info/

fausto · Mar 5, 2003

thanks for the tip on the site it looks interesting, the mecanics and the motors/ drives/vfd part I can handle just fine, the only thing that is holding me back is the expence of the CNC and my lack of knolege about the options of PC CNC's out there.
What kind of performance/ features are there on the AHA sistem?
thanks

johnfly · Mar 6, 2003

as far as price "my big concern"lol;;;; the dude on home pc.com emailed me and said he built the whole thing for $ 2500.00 and that included the mill!!!!!!so figure 1500.00+- for the interface with servo motors not steppers..... and of course you do all the wiring and fitting. but the way i look at it thats the easy part.To me the big problem is what stuff to get to put it all together! I am no cnc technician!!!!! I am a cnc machinist of many years..20 allmost.. lol, I think what i am going to do is to buy a older cnc mill hopefully in good shape" that way it has ballscrews" then retrofit it with servo motors and a pc control........????? hay it sounds like a plan....huh. old iron + new control= kick butt machine.

fausto · Mar 9, 2003

well johnfly, I used to build cnc's but I also always had a cnc control, the thing here is that a true cnc control will cost me more than I want to spend right now, so the search for the "cheap cnc" is more out of curiosity than of necesity.
I am surprised of how few replys this topic has brought given the wealth of knowledge of the readers in this forum, don't you think?

montejw · Mar 9, 2003

Fausto,
I just put together a Taig mill with servo motors. I built a controller from Camtronics that uses Gecko drivers and any step and dir controller program. I use Mach1 for that.

Doug said 'The problem is, there aren't any reasonably priced "good" PC software controls out there.
The hobby types don't, in my opinion, qualify as "good" controls.' I don't know what he means by that. Maybe he is comparing them to stuff you find on the big commercial shop machines. Mach1 works for me, and many others that use it at home and in their for profit shops. Mach2 is just coming out with many improvements
http://www.artofcnc.ca

Monte

ibewgypsie · Mar 9, 2003

I found out, buying a older Bridgeport with boss style controls and updating is a lot easier and cheaper. I have about 1200 in my conversion to intel (pc) control using gecko drives to run existing nema 42 steppers. This includes the computer and the drives, 3 geckos, one toshiba inverter single phase in 3 phase out. I tried to sell the plans on ebay but had no takers so evidently it is not in demand (tech). I now have about 5k in my machine including purchase. I have over 5k in parts laying around from the last cnc conversions I did.

montejw · Mar 10, 2003

Doug,
I didn't catch the part about his previous experience. I hope you didn't think I was being flippant or anything. I thought you were coming from a point of a lot of CNC experience and that fausto wasn't, thus my suggestion of Mach1. I'm new to CNC, having been bitten by the CNC bug so to speak from running a large (to me) Arboga 5 axis gantry mill at Mississippi St. University. That thing was/is very cool.

I also thought Mach1 would work because there are many users on a Yahoo board that use it in their shops. I'd guess they are running converted and/or upgraded machines, and machines they built themselves.

Anyhoo, you know more about this than I and I'm here to learn. I can't wait to get my Taig's servo drivers tuned up.

Monte

johnfly · Mar 11, 2003

I guess allot depends on its use!!!! and its users background. To me the idea of drawing it on a cad program then putting the file through a post to generate the g,m code would be as easy as "maybe easier" than learning say a siemens?? allthough true it wouldnt be a hurco conversational controll but I know that mastercam has all the bells and whistles one could want. and with it generating the code who cares if the program is 20 blocks long using canned cycles or 200 blocks long using repetative g&m code.....the part looks the same!!! my concern is using servo motors insted of steppers ie I keep hearing that steppers have a bad problem of dropping steps especially at higher feedrates."this is what i have been told. I cant say for sure.Any comments!!!!!!!!

montejw · Mar 11, 2003

I think the problems with steppers losing steps is because they lose power at higher rpm's. If those higher speeds are needed 'I think' you can get around the problem by using higher torque rated motors.

Monte

fausto · Mar 11, 2003

From what you're teling me the mill software seems to be further ahead in pc conversions and the PCcnc's seem to run steppers only, if I'm mistaken please correct me. If I find the right software for a PC-CNC I will be using dc brush servos with tach(to close the speed loop)and encoders (to close the position loop) Is this even posible with a PC-CNC? is there such a thing? if there is, will the $$ be the same for a comercial CNC?
Thank you gentlemen for your help.
Fausto.

Bryan · Mar 11, 2003

Probably shouldn't but in here, but I'll add 2 cents worth. I have no experience with the Mach1 control. I do know the power of canned cycles and custom written macros. The documentation for Mach1 shows that it uses VBScript for Macros. With that, you should be able to parametrically write just about any routine you want. Then if something like depth of cut or step over amount needs to be changed, it can be changed in a parameter and then all else should be fine. Basically what I'm saying is, as long as the control has a way to do logical expressions and use parameters, you shouldn't have to rely on a factory built canned cycle, even though I will admit that the G71 command of the Fanuc 6 is very powerful on a lathe, even though it can't use TNRC.

johnfly · Mar 11, 2003

Yes Doug the frustration,aggravation,threats,and bribery have all been felt or used between me and the 11 programers where i work!!!! I want it this way they want it thatway...but i wasnt thinking of using the machine in a full production shop. More like a home shop in a garage.... ran by one person,programed by the same person. Using a cad program to generate all the code is only an option.
sorry for the confusion...
FAUSTO: I understand that the gecko drives will drive servo motors..and use the stepper software. hows that for compatability

[This message has been edited by johnfly (edited 03-11-2003).]

montejw · Mar 11, 2003

From what you're teling me the mill software seems to be further ahead in pc conversions and the PCcnc's seem to run steppers only, if I'm mistaken please correct me.

[I've seen full closed loop PC based systems, but I can't remember where. Maybe post a message on http://groups.yahoo.com/group/CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO. There is at least one fellow there with closed loop servo system that I think he built.]

If I find the right software for a PC-CNC I will be using dc brush servos with tach(to close the speed loop)and encoders (to close the position loop) Is this even posible with a PC-CNC? is there such a thing?

[I think the developer of Mach1 is working on this right now. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Master5 would be where to ask that.]

if there is, will the $$ be the same for a comercial CNC?

[I would have to think it would be way less expensive. But you aren't buying a commercial controller with all the bells and whistles.]

[Monte]

Don UK · Mar 12, 2003

It would not be impossible to interface a the step/direction signals from a pc based system to live servos. What is required is an up/down counter stepped from these signals coupled to a digital to analogue converter for the servodrive. Signals from the position encoders are gated into the counter in the opposite sense to provide feedback. This is basically the circuit used in an axis board in older nc systems.
(37 years experience as nc/cnc engineer)

montejw · Mar 12, 2003

Don UK wrote:
It would not be impossible to interface a the step/direction signals from a pc based system to live servos. What is required is an up/down counter stepped from these signals coupled to a digital to analogue converter for the servodrive. Signals from the position encoders are gated into the counter in the opposite sense to provide feedback. This is basically the circuit used in an axis board in older nc systems.

Don,
Are you familiar with Gecko drivers? They have drivers that take step and direction input and run servo motors. That's what I'm running on my mill. Rutex is another driver that does the same thing. It isn't a closed loop system, but it is step and dir and servo.

Or maybe I misunderstood your comment.

Monte
(A few months CNC experience.)

Don UK · Mar 13, 2003

What I had in mind was that if you could aquire either an old machine fitted with dc servodrives or, servodrives from a scrapped or retrofitted machine (as in my case) these can be interfaced with one of the pc systems at low cost. I intend using some axis boards from an old nc system to do this initially.
I would not be surprised if there is not something available commercially.

Don UK · Mar 13, 2003

Just checked out the Rutex site. They have the goods. Not worth messing about at those prices.

jh · Mar 13, 2003

you might want to do a search for "www.turnertec.com " They have had an ad in Home Shop Machinist and are sold by cardinal enginering in the states. More money ( around $4000. us) but seem to be full featured being able to run servos and steppers.

[This message has been edited by jh (edited 03-13-2003).]

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