HAAS lathe model line-up Q?

I just have to ask...

I don't follow HAAS all that much - but I stop by their booths usualy at the trade show hoping to find "just the ticket" as I am always looking to find a Yankee Doodle machine to make widgets...

To date I have not bought anything other than a cpl rotaries...

Now I understand them starting with the VMC. It is of course the most generic (widely used?) machine known to man. Then the two axis lathes and the HMC's.

They have taken the HMC line-up to great lengths from the looks of it! I saw the one feller posted a few months back aboot his new HMC HAAS. I remember one comment in that thread stating that the bigger HMC's are built more rugged than the commonplace HAAS machine. (Ultimately to give long life confidence of product.)

But then they go off on these tiny things that second as night stands in the bedroom or a flat spot in the office. ??? Then the big TL series large flatbed CNC lathes. Not to mention the router and bridge mill lines....

My Q is that with all these - why on Earth doo they not offer a real honest to goodness subspindle machine? I know that they have a pr of them available - but come on - a 3" bar machine with a 5C (proximately anyhow?) sub-spindle?

I just have to think that there is a LOT bigger market for a real production lathe than some of these other markets that they seem to chase after?

Any insight from Die-Hard HAAS owners / opperators?

Think Snow Eh!
Ox

Ox:

I hear there are people making teeth on some of the office machines. Doesn't need to big for that function.

.

If I had to guess, I would say it's the natural progression of things. Most of the early sub spindle machines by any other builder were like that. The reasoning being that with just one turret you can do most of the heavy machining on the main spindle anyway and just use the sub for a little light boring, chamfering, deburring, and whatnot.

Once you start putting a second turret on the machine, then you have to get serious about making the sub spindle strong so that you can overlap front and back side cutting for quicker cycle times.

But to add a second turret you need a dual path control. And while Haas controls might be wonders when it comes to user freindliness, they are a ways away technology wise from being able to run multiple programs simultaneously.

Who knows? All that could change tomorrow. It isn't like they don't have other builders lathes in their factory that they could "study". And I don't doubt that they could pull it off if they wanted to. But their business model seems to require a lower price point and some volume. And you can't argue with their success in sticking with their business model.

Haas tends to use mature proven (and less expensive) technologies, shared components, and volume to hit the price point where the value for the buck is almost a no-brainer. So right now it's the mid to late 90's at Haas technology wise. Which is about the time real sub spindles started making the scene with the leading edge builders (the bleeding edge had them in them in the late 80's early 90's). It probably won't be long until you see one from Haas would be my guess.

Good point on the dual path...

Think Snow Eh!
Ox

Actually Swiss, I'd rather see them developing a few machines that aren't based on their low-cost business model.
Twin turret is nice for sure, but to make it useable it won't be cheap anyway, so why not use their existing know, combine it with someone else's knowhow and make a few versions of the best sellers that can compete in rigidity, speed, accuracy instead.
The control is easily capable to handle a better iron, and while it may not be top of the line in mucho axis control, it certainly can drive 5 axis and the accompanied accessories as good as any out there.
While I would not trade my Mori in for a Haas, I also would not trade in my Haas SL10 for a Mori.

Haas, if you're listening. We'll give you an honorary crown for being a builder with the most models in conventional CNC equipment.
Now please go out and copy, steal, knock-off or do whatever you have to and build a monster Japanese-alternative, so some of us Haas-fans can make a real choice. Hell, buy whatever is left of Hitachi Seiki so it can be re-invented, paint it white, stick the HAAS control on it and sign me up for one.

Hitatchi was absorbed by somone right outta the gate wasn't it?

Multiple axis capability is not the same as dual path.

Think Snow Eh!
Ox

Hitachi was purchased by Mori Seiki.

I read somewhere Mori isn't doing such a great job of maintaining parts for the Hitachis.

Those 90 degree-bed Hitachi lathes sure are interesting. Having the cutting tool in the "down" position would take some getting used to. The turret tools would be easy to reach.

Ox

Yes, that's correct, the point was that the Haas control isn't up to that challenge anyway.
Use what you've got that's sufficient and build a stout machine around it.
And yes, I think Hitachi's remains were absorbed by Mori. It wasn't bought outright though as I remember, which is why it actually went under and only the existing equipment maintenance and cust. base belongs to Mori.
Either way the point was to build a better line of machines while keep the existing ones at the current price/value level. I don't care how, just do it.