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New vs Old

bsumrall

Plastic
Joined
Aug 12, 2010
Location
Texas, USA
I go to hundreds of shop through out Texas and have seen all types of machinery,parts,etc. I have noticed alot of companies getting rid of their old BOX way machines and replacing them with Haas machines. Now some people would think that is ridiculous, but here is a little something for ya to think about.

I have a customer that sold 4 of their 1980's box way machines and they purchased a VF-11/50, a VF-8/50, and a VF-7/50. All machines have 1000 psi thru spindle coolant. The customer is making bop's and the parts starts out over 1400 lbs and ends up around 800 lbs. With the new technology of tooling and work holding they cut their cycle times from 80 hours to 45 hours per part. How? Well its pretty simple, the Haas is much more faster than the old ones. They will not take a big of cut as the box machines but can take a lighter cut, and feed way faster. The thru spinlde coolant helps them tremendously when drilling a 3.5 in drill 10 inches deep!

Now all of the old school box way loving guys in the shop are loving their new equipment. Alot of people down Haas for being light weight, well here is just a little fact for you. This isnt the 1950's anymore, get with technology and you'll see why every loves Haas machine.
 
It's all relative. As a very happy Haas owner, I would say that shop could have dropped another few hours of cycle time by going with a higher end Japanese machine, still applying modern light/fast cuts.

By the way, what the hell is a "bop"?
 
Seem to me that has little to do with it being a "haas" but just plain catching on with the times, somewhat...
Iron quite surely wasn't the big improvement here. Take a new boxway machine with a new/fast control and fast tool changer and see where that Haas gets left behind chewing something heavy, or well, anything for that matter. One difference being they perhaps wouldn't have bought 3 of those higher end machines for the price of the 3 Haas, maybe 2 though... then the question is if 2 higher end machines would outperform 3 Haas machines, assuming same total investment cost in each scenario, then considering life expectancy of the machine mostly if it is doing heavy hogging work all day long, and tooling cost as rigidity affects that quite a lot, but hard to figure out unless you have the 2 machines side by side...

Also, cutting cycle time isn't always "everything" although that is a big improvement, and assuming they kept the same part price(aka didn't lower their price to match a new shop rate for that new equipment, or perhaps had to increase part price?) ROI can be a funny thing to figure out. They could very well be making less money on each part they make now, or making more, or also possibly have gained the ability to produce twice as many of them assuming the demand is there, and getting their extra $ from that. Or do they have people sitting around half the time now doing nothing, or just cut the work force in half?

Always so many things to consider.
 
They have a huge demand for their product and as in any business related to oil field the price of their product did not drop a penny. I was just simply stating a fact that every down grades a Haas machine for being light weight and not rigid enough.

If you were to purchase "High end" machine and could do the work faster, then go right on ahead. I was just saying that Haas is the bang for the buck machine. It can and will do the work of a $500,000.
 
It can and will do the work of a $500,000.
You're a fan, we get it. I'm a fan too, but you have to be realistic! Comparing ANY Haas to a mill that costs 1/2mil is downright silly. Yes, a Haas machine can be made to do just about anything...that doesn't mean it is necessarily the right tool for the job.

Did you have a question, or are you just padding your post count?
 
By the way, what the hell is a "bop"?

Blow out preventer

Seems I have been seing somthing about these Not working so well in the gulf. I wonder if BP's BOP was made on a haas or a jap machine?.

Haas does make a decent machine and has service second to none but damnit, They cant buid an enclosure for SH$$$. as soon as the facemill comes in contact with coolant im getting a bath.

That being said. we ran a VF3 ss against a vf3 Gearbox machine and the 2 speed gearbox wipped the ss's A$$. the gearbox " I know this topic was about box ways" pulled twice the depth of cut and the spindle stopped faster from high speed than the SS. The gb machine was already in toolchange mode before the ss spindle stopped.

Just thought I'd through that out there to you guys thinking about ss machines in the future.
 
You gotta compare Apples to Apples...Old machines to a New Haas is not a good comparison. You could pretty much compare the Old machines to any of the New machines today and get similar results.

Today we cut quicker with lighter cuts...the process just takes less time. Now if you can cut even faster utilizing more aggressive feeds, while still holding accuracy you would slash the time down even further. That's where the higher end machines come into play...at least in my book.

Haas, good bang for the buck.
 








 
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