Any Space claim users?

smallshop · Jan 15, 2012

I bought the software over a year ago but have just recently started using it. Having been a SolidWorks and Rhino user for years I didn't think it could get any better than these two.

I like this software way better than SolidWorks for concept work. It is amazingly fast. I still have a lot to learn but am blown away by how versatile this stuff is. (It also works very well with Rhino)

Just wondering if there are any other users here on pm? And....what do you use it for and how do you like it?

John Welden · Jan 15, 2012

What do you like more about Solidworks? anything? I want to try SC.

cmailco · Jan 15, 2012

I saw a demo of this recently and it looks nice. I think it addresses many of the issues we've been asking about since push/pull surface capabilities were first introduced... "why can't we do this with features".

Overall, SC looks like a nice amalgam of push/pull surface CAD as it might be applied to solids.
Verdict's still out for me and I doubt our company will ever use it since we're so heavily dependent on mold-tools and mold add-ons but it looks like a step in the right direction. I'd like to spend some time with a demo.

ewlsey · Jan 15, 2012

Space Claim is a good modeler, it is not a full CAD system.

The drafting package is missing a lot of features. If you need to make drawings for the shop floor or to send out, you will be frustrated. I used it a few years ago, and it could not do detail views, broken views, automated BOMs, custom sections, and some GD&T call outs were not supported.

The modeling side is good for solids and prismatic shapes. It is not good for surface modeling or complex lofted and blended 3D shapes. The direct modeling functions are frustrating on complex geometry. With a parametric system, you can change a value and let the computer chug away and update. With Space Claim you have to try and pull and drag things. When those things take 5 minutes to compute every time you drag them, you quickly lose hope trying to get them where you want them.

Many have also mentioned the lack of a standard hole wizard. That's a big problem for a machine shop.

If you want a direct modeler for machine shop stuff, check out KeyCAD.

cmailco · Jan 15, 2012

ewlsey said:
Space Claim is a good modeler, it is not a full CAD system.

The drafting package is missing a lot of features. If you need to make drawings for the shop floor or to send out, you will be frustrated. I used it a few years ago, and it could not do detail views, broken views, automated BOMs, custom sections, and some GD&T call outs were not supported.

The modeling side is good for solids and prismatic shapes. It is not good for surface modeling or complex lofted and blended 3D shapes. The direct modeling functions are frustrating on complex geometry. With a parametric system, you can change a value and let the computer chug away and update. With Space Claim you have to try and pull and drag things. When those things take 5 minutes to compute every time you drag them, you quickly lose hope trying to get them where you want them.

Many have also mentioned the lack of a standard hole wizard. That's a big problem for a machine shop.

If you want a direct modeler for machine shop stuff, check out KeyCAD.

Pretty much answers most of the doubts I've had about it.

Overall, it looks and sounds like a good conceptual modeler.

john54 · Jan 15, 2012

cmailco said:
Pretty much answers most of the doubts I've had about it.

Overall, it looks and sounds like a good conceptual modeler.

Be careful about the timing of the comments that are made.

The person that previously commented mentioned that he used SpaceClaim a few years ago. It has dramatically improved since then. I today do almost everything thing related to drawings that he he couldn't do. Only thing I've never tried is broken views (I have no need for them)

The fundamental weakness of any of the direct and/or parametric modelers is the editing of very complex swoopy surfaces. It's just plain butt ugly in any parametric or direct modeler. Please note that I'm talking about editing not creating.

Beyond that I at this time find SpaceClaim to be very good for parts, assemblies, and drawings.

By the way I've been at this forever and at one time or another have used almost every CAD and CAM program that is out there.

john54 · Jan 15, 2012

One clarification and another thing I forgot in the previous post.

When I mention the editing of complex swoopy surfaces of course I mean when they were created in another CAD program and edited in whatever program you are using. Even though it's a pain in either parametric or direct I still would rather attempt the edit in a direct modeler. It may take a while but at least you have a chance of making changes. It's kind of a pain to use at times and quirky but there is a very nice tool in SpaceClaim called "Tweak Face" that lets you edit the surface/geometry at the existing control points, control curves, blend curves, or sweep curves.

Also that initial post mentions SpaceClaim not having a hole wizard.
It didn't used to but it now does.

smallshop · Jan 16, 2012

Thanks John. I don't have enough experience yet to discuss much.

I do know that with a "young" system the improvements come pretty fast....so a two yr old opinion is....old.

The reason I like this better than SW is the direct modelling seems to not break my creative process. It also seems bullet proof on fillets and rads. It is very easy to design in assembly though I thought SW was also.

It feels faster to me than SW but this could be how I'm wired. I've tried demos of stuff recommended here and been disappointed. I think we all have our distinct "hard wiring" that clicks with certain cad and cam packages.

I did find on a 3d surface I didn't have enough know how to create the shape I wanted so i imported it to Rhino then back into Spaceclaim.

As far as it not being a complete package I have heard the same about Rhino buy have found very few sticking points.

I think Spaceclaim coupled with Rhino would give SW a run for its money for much less.(depending on type of work) That is why I don't use SW anymore....couldn't afford it. I really liked it and I don't like having to learn new stuff all the time but after using a group seat for free the buy in was too steep.....

I'm happy to have this for the price.

john54 · Jan 16, 2012

very good. I think as time goes by and once you get used to the creation of the complex geometry (along with their needed improvements) in SpaceClaim that you will less and less find yourself needing to use Rhino. Though in your situation when you already have Rhino the reality is that the two work together very well. If your like me and you consider these programs to be tools in your toolbox then you have two very good ones.

behindpropellers · Jan 16, 2012

What does a seat of spaceclaim cost?

john54 · Jan 16, 2012

there are some add-on options including translators, rendering, and so on but a basic seat with subscription included is in the general area of $3300.

cmailco · Jan 16, 2012

John,
Thanks for the additional information. I did indeed miss the fact that ewlsey's review of the software was dated by a couple of years.

Either way, from what I have seen, SC looks like a nice concept. How does it do with surfaces? This is often the area where most lower-end CAD systems fall on their faces, with a general lack of options for creating c0, c1, g1, etc., continuity. The big three CAD/engineering packages do this extremely well but at a premium, leaving the other packages to add-on integration or separate surfacing packages like T-splines.

Regards

john54 · Jan 16, 2012

A very complex question regarding surfaces. Unfortunately there is no "one size fits all" related to surfaces. SpaceClaim does include lofts, sweeps, guide/control curves, splines, control point editing, simple filleting, variable filleting, a nice tweak surface tool, and so on. This satisfies my needs and the needs of most. Needless to say it does not have the very high end Class A robust surfacing tools that you will in the high end packages.

About all I can say is get a trial version and sort out if it fits.

cmailco · Jan 16, 2012

john54 said:
A very complex question regarding surfaces. Unfortunately there is no "one size fits all" related to surfaces.

Heh, well there is... they're called Catia, ProE and UG but again, at a premium $ and I'm not quite ready to make that kind of investment.

About all I can say is get a trial version and sort out if it fits.

I think I'll do that. Got me curious now, thanks.

john54 · Jan 16, 2012

It never ends when discussing surfacing. A guy that I know (an automotive/truck body stylist) quickly rejected Catia, Pro, and UG and went to Alias Automotive.

Dan B · Jan 16, 2012

I have SpaceClaim as a compliment to Rhino. I've had it since 2008. I use it for editing Rhino files, but with all of the new solid tools, and sub-object selection in Rhino 5, I find myself using it less then I used to. It still is a valuable tool for editing fillets though.

I find it sits and calculates a lot, at which point I usually just go back to Rhino and do it while SpaceClaim is locked up.

Dan

smallshop · Jan 16, 2012

HAHAHA! When did Rhino 5 ccome out!? I haven't gotten any emails.....gotta get out more often...

Dan, you were the one that convinced me to try Spaceclaim....and I am sure glad I did.

Spaceclaim "Style" is much cheaper than "Engineer", though I have been itching for those sheet metal tools....(that only come in "engineer")

My total software package to run my shop: Mecsoft Rhinocam Pro, Rhino, Spaceclaim. Not doing any high emd modelling or fussy aerospace stuff (well, sometimes some aerospace....). So these are great tools for me.

John54 thanks for the input.

cmailco · Jan 16, 2012

john54 said:
It never ends when discussing surfacing. A guy that I know (an automotive/truck body stylist) quickly rejected Catia, Pro, and UG and went to Alias Automotive.

Never does.

I figure there are enough companies out there achieving the level of parametric continuity they need from the big three --maybe throw PTC in there too-- that using anything else is just a matter of preference.

Unfortunately, I've never had a whole lot of choice in the matter one way or another. "Here's your tool.. now get to work".

:cheers:

71bsab50 · Jan 17, 2012

I have a real love hate relationship with Spaceclaim.

I bought it when it first came out in 2007 and it became clear very early on it just wasn't ready as it had so many bugs. To be fair it has improved a huge amount since then. My main use for it is for tweaking customers model files to communicate changes to help make their designs better suited to injection moulding & for that it is very good.

Done some original design work with it and it's probably because I haven't invested enough time in it, but it never seems to be as logical to use compared to say Rhino, having said that you always get there in the end, it just seems a strugle sometimes. The 2D drafting is something I've always found a bit strange, it's not very intuitive in my opinion, again it does the job...in a fashion.

Dan B · Jan 17, 2012

Hi Smallshop,

Rhino 5 is still in beta, but it's very stable. If you have Rhino 4 you can get Rhino 5 at no cost (as long as it's still in beta). I seldom ever use Rhino 4 anymore.

SpaceClaim no longer has the 2 separate versions. It's all or nothing now. Although I don't use the sheet metal functionality, I have played around with it, and it is pretty cool! The hole wizard is pretty nice too.

I find SpaceClaim works very well on "blocky" type objects. It seldom fails for me. However, on "swoopy" type objects, the kind Rhino specializes in, it often struggles to find a solution. Don't get me wrong, I don't regret having SpaceClaim, as it has served me well over the years. There has been talk of Rhino 6 being more of a feature based program, with the ability to click on fillets and change the size, but with McNeel's long (or should I say, slow) development process, Rhino 6 probably won't see the light of day until 2017. In the meantime, SpaceClaim will continue to play a key role.

Dan

Any Space claim users?

Diamond

Diamond

Hot Rolled

Diamond

Hot Rolled

Plastic

Plastic

Diamond

Plastic

Stainless

Plastic

Hot Rolled

Plastic

Hot Rolled

Plastic

Hot Rolled

Diamond

Hot Rolled

Aluminum

Hot Rolled

Similar threads