Autodesk fusion 360 vs mastercam
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    Default Autodesk fusion 360 vs mastercam

    witch one would you guys recommend better? do they work the same? I'm confused , i thought auto cad was only for drafting , does the fusion 360 let you make actual programming?
    thanks

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    Yes, but it's all in "the cloud". This means that you don't actually own anything, and if Autocad decides to start charging you a fee you can't access your files unless you pay. Or if Autocad decides to discontinue the product you have nothing. Also you can't use it for anything proprietary since you'd be violating your NDA by uploading the files to "the cloud".

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nickvivona View Post
    witch one would you guys recommend better? do they work the same? I'm confused , i thought auto cad was only for drafting , does the fusion 360 let you make actual programming?
    thanks
    Autodesk is a company that provides software products for architecture, civil engineering, product design and development, and many other disciplines. Autocad is Autodesk's first product dating from early 1980s for use in making mechanical drawings. Fusion 360 began as a 3D direct modeling program a number of years ago; then, beginning about 4-5 years ago, morphed into a complete 3D design suite. Currently there are environments for designing parts and assemblies, fundamental stress analysis, sheetmetal, CAM, and some other functionalities.

    Fusion is cloud enabled - the program actually resides on your computer which can be either Windows PC or Mac, but the models are stored in the cloud. You can store models locally which allows you to work offline for varying periods of time (on average 2 weeks or so). Ultimately you need to connect to the net to update projects for long term storage. The ability to work offline is useful for both you (internet connection difficulties) and for Autodesk (they send your machine offline during updates, maintenance, etc.).

    If you are a student, hobbyist, or startup Fusion is available free for a year (need to reregister after a year but remains free last I heard). To purchase a subscription its $300.00 per year. Fusion 360 Ultimate which has (or will have 4 and 5 axis simultaneous machining) is $1,200.00 per year.

    Mastercam has been around for some 30+ years and is a very mature product. It certainly outstrips Fusion in the level of control you have over tool pathing. But much depends on what you are machining. If drilling holes in plates, simple 2D contouring, pocketing, 3D surfacing, and 4 and 5 axis positioning, both products can do it.

    Much of the answer to your question depends on what you want to do. 'Better' depends on type and source of parts, economics, potential issues with respect to customers (such as the already mentioned NDAs). It would probably serve you well to post a bit more about your intent. Are you just learning, starting a machining business, job shop or designing and manufacturing your own products, and so forth.

    Finally, Youtube is your friend. Both Mastercam and Autodesk Fusion 360 (CAM) have large presences on Youtube. As far as functionality is concerned, an hour or so invested looking at some of the videos should give you a hint of what both are capable of. Just make sure you filter the videos for most recent as both Fusion and Mastercam have undergone some major revisions (visually and/or functionally) in the last few years.

    Fred

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    Quote Originally Posted by mhajicek View Post
    Yes, but it's all in "the cloud". This means that you don't actually own anything, and if Autocad decides to start charging you a fee you can't access your files unless you pay. Or if Autocad decides to discontinue the product you have nothing. Also you can't use it for anything proprietary since you'd be violating your NDA by uploading the files to "the cloud".
    While you’re busy gnashing your teeth and fretting about stuff that might happen, I’m busy using Fusion on the cloud (oh the humanity) to get things done and make money. A meteor might fall on me tomorrow, too. Surely you recognize that, if you have a credit card, smartphone, pay your taxes, and fly on a plane, all that is cloud-based.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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    Uhuh. Are you making ITAR parts with it? High IP value proprietary parts? I'll stick with software that runs on my computer with files that stay on my computer thank you very much. And when you land in a legal quagmire and go into debt with legal fees I'll still be making parts and money.

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    Yes both Fusion and Mastercam allow you to create models in addition to toolpaths and code used to cut said models. Which is better totally depends on your needs.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mhajicek View Post
    Uhuh. Are you making ITAR parts with it? High IP value proprietary parts? I'll stick with software that runs on my computer with files that stay on my computer thank you very much. And when you land in a legal quagmire and go into debt with legal fees I'll still be making parts and money.
    You have a false premise straw-man here. Who said anything about making ITAR parts or high IP value proprietary parts using Fusion?

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    Quote Originally Posted by rklopp View Post
    You have a false premise straw-man here. Who said anything about making ITAR parts or high IP value proprietary parts using Fusion?
    OP asked for differences. It is perfectly reasonable to note the uselessness of Fusion for ITAR and some IP as we don't know what the OP wants to use it for.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mhajicek View Post
    Uhuh. Are you making ITAR parts with it? High IP value proprietary parts? I'll stick with software that runs on my computer with files that stay on my computer thank you very much. And when you land in a legal quagmire and go into debt with legal fees I'll still be making parts and money.
    There are plenty of options for ITAR compliant cloud based software, as long as the servers are on US soil and all employees operating are US citizens. Fusion 360 is I believe hosted thru Amazon Web Services, which offers AWS GovCloud (US). So as long as you can spec the use of their US region GovCloud, you aren't violating ITAR. Whether or not this is an option for Fusion specifically I'm not sure, nor am I a lawyer.

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    So at the minimum you need a lawyer on retainer to CYA in case 360 or Amazon decides to host your data outside the US, accidentally sends a file outside, or has a security problem. Are there any cloud services which haven't had a security problem yet?

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    Quote Originally Posted by mhajicek View Post
    So at the minimum you need a lawyer on retainer to CYA in case 360 or Amazon decides to host your data outside the US, accidentally sends a file outside, or has a security problem. Are there any cloud services which haven't had a security problem yet?
    It has an offline mode.

    Working with Fusion 36 Offline | Fusion 36 | Autodesk Knowledge Network

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    Quote Originally Posted by Monomer View Post
    To be fair, I think offline mode is intended for temporary internet connection losses. I don't think Fusion would work very well, if at all, fully isolated. That said, the black helicopter conspiracy crowd will never use it, but I don't view the black helicopter conspiracy crowd as a competitive threat to my business anyway. They're too busy worrying about the black helicopters.

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    Is it "black helicopter" to CYA? Do you operate without insurance? If you're actually a business, a company, rather than a hobby level garage shop, you have to worry about potentially millions of dollars of liability or more. If you're working on high value IP for which you signed an NDA, and it's determined that you were part of the failure path by which a competitor obtained that data, that could be the end of your company. I hear about cloud service data breaches every week; just do a Google News search for "cloud service security breach". The top listing right now is about a RECURRING Amazon cloud service breach which allowed anyone on the internet to access what was supposedly secured:
    Amazon not to blame for S3 cloud storage lapses - Storage Soup

    Of course Amazon is denying any responsibility. And then I presume you heard about Equifax...

    Why take an unnecessary risk of that magnitude?

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    Super cool how cheap fusion is, and how you get likes on instagram for using it.

    Not cool how its cloud based, its like buying a car with wifi. Knowingingly getting behind the wheel when there is about 1 in 6 million chance that one day some pissed off Russian teenager hacks your car and decides to take you on a collision course.

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    It's a little more than that. I'm quite certain that the fraction of companies which have had IP stolen is far greater than one in six million. In addition, Autocad has a history of discontinuing products. If you're locked in to 360 and Autocad shuts it down or raises the price beyond what you can afford, you're SOL and can't access and continue to work on the files that you may have invested thousands of hours into and on which your company may be dependent. With non-cloud-based software you can just keep running the software long past it's official EOL; there are people still using 20 year old versions of Mastercam, it still works, they can still access their 20 year old files, and they can sill make parts with it or load the files in a more recent version of the software if they so choose. How's your Nest thermostat working these days?
    Nest'''s Hub Shutdown Proves You'''re Crazy to Buy Into the Internet of Things | WIRED

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    We've been using Fusion 360 for about a year to draw our parts and program jobs. We use it to program a Flow Waterjet and a SCM router. It took a little work to get the posts written but its a big savings compared to Mastercam.

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    Fusion does require you to break all confidentiality agreements because it forces you to use the unsecured internet. If you read the TOS and EULA that goes along with Fusion360 you will find that Autodesk basically says you are on your own and they guarantee nothing and will indemnify you for nothing. I went to a Fusion360 deal with Autodesk and it was absurd beyond belief. One of their people was excited about the idea that wow, how would you like to have the ability to run dnc to your equipment by Bluetooth. My question to him was OK so the dude stands next to my shop and grabs the signal and off he goes. No answer and the look on his face was funny. If you are just cutting wood signs fine. If you are doing work where you sign confidentiality agreements be prepared to lose everything if you get hacked because you wanted this shiny new way.

    Autodesk does have some really great things to get startups going but once you acquire intellectual property of value only a fool would stay where he can then lose it all from so many different directions to save a few bucks. Autodesk also has a very poor record of honesty where the future and costs are concerned. You buy pay to play software you can't ever just stop and still work. There is a ton of Mastercam users running old versions and doing just fine.

    It is also a generational and philosophical difference in approach here. Lots of young people just hang it all out there with no thought about repercussions and it is funny to see them find out that yes their prospective employer did check their "private" social media then look elsewhere for an employee. So these same people or mindset put their intellectual property online blithely assuming nothing could ever go wrong. The mindset to also rent and never own is here to but the sad thing is that after a few years renting always costs more and you have nothing to take with you when you stop paying.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mhajicek View Post
    It's a little more than that. I'm quite certain that the fraction of companies which have had IP stolen is far greater than one in six million. In addition, Autocad has a history of discontinuing products. If you're locked in to 360 and Autocad shuts it down or raises the price beyond what you can afford, you're SOL and can't access and continue to work on the files that you may have invested thousands of hours into and on which your company may be dependent. With non-cloud-based software you can just keep running the software long past it's official EOL; there are people still using 20 year old versions of Mastercam, it still works, they can still access their 20 year old files, and they can sill make parts with it or load the files in a more recent version of the software if they so choose. How's your Nest thermostat working these days?
    Nest'''s Hub Shutdown Proves You'''re Crazy to Buy Into the Internet of Things | WIRED
    No it's worse than that. With online banking you have a method to check status accurately with your monthly statement and you can contest bogus charges and be made whole. You lose your IP and wont be made whole and find out about it when the knockoff products start showing up. You may never find out that you IP was stolen and never understand why you lost sales to your competitor who swiped your stuff and then made it to sell against you.

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    ugh, these threads..

    Fusion is primarily a product development platform that contains CAM as a tool to aid in that process (along with many others, simulation, rendering, sculpting, etc); it may or may not fit your business model.

    MasterCAM is primarily a CAM platform with a little CAD to aid in the process of CAM; it may or may not fit your business model.

    They're different. If you can't figure out which fits your situation, you have bigger issues than selecting a CAM package.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lapuser View Post
    No it's worse than that. With online banking you have a method to check status accurately with your monthly statement and you can contest bogus charges and be made whole. You lose your IP and wont be made whole and find out about it when the knockoff products start showing up. You may never find out that you IP was stolen and never understand why you lost sales to your competitor who swiped your stuff and then made it to sell against you.
    They will just buy your product and reverse engineer it. Holy shit i cant believe everyone thinks people are doing this.

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