Hey everyone,

I am currently working with all 3 of these packages, in the evaluation stage and planning on upgrading to one of these from our current Onecnc package. All, I believe, will be a big improvement I can already tell. However, I am having a hard time breaking down what is actually better in each package.

So far I believe the easiest to use is Gibbs by a long shot. Mastercam and Edgecam both seem very overwhelming with all of the menus and toolbars. It seems as if there will be a longer learning curve for both of these packages. Even doing simple things such as contours seems to take a couple tries to get it right. It is just not very intuitive in comparison to Gibbs.

If anyone else have used all or some of these CAM software packages I would appreciate your thoughts and opinions on them.

Thanks in advance.

Graduated from Bobcad to Mastercam starting with version 6 in mid 1990's and have been using it ever since. It was important to me to have one system for mill, turn and wire EDM. We did not make the jump to version 10 because we don't need support and didn't see the need. Apart from an occasional tweak on a new post, we don't need help. The re seller who will give you training and support sould be a big factor. I can't comment on the other packages, but they are probably all very capable. Master cam has been bullit proof for us and the reseller in my area has been great to work with for applications when we needed them. RJT www.progtool.net

Hi jolson

Just outta interest what is it that is lacking in Onecnc that these 3 have in particular. ( I can then put it on the onecnc suggestions forum )

Cheers Kev

Here's a good place to research Edgecam.

http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/EdgeCAM-users/

I'm also curious about what you don't like about Onecnc - I've never used it either, but I see heated arguments about it here on PM.

I have Edgecam. I have not used Gibbs or MC so I can't compare them. I dropped my maintenance on Edgecam last year, because it it $2500/yr for production milling and turning and Solid Machinist, and all the advances for the last several years have been in the high end packages, not for me. Plus my VAR can't understand my code generator. In a couple more years I'm going to comare it to NX Express and decide whether to change. If you are looking in the price range you are in, I'd suggest looking at Siemens NX Express also.

As RJT stated, THE VAR IS AS IMPORTANT, AS IS THE SOFTWARE!

Do they offer classes, free train for so many hrs, do they have a good user base, will they give you the names of their customers so you can see how they like the software and VAR...makes it alot easier during the transition.

if you do alot of prodution work or removing of alot of material, check out SURFCAM Velocity 4, with truemill it blasts away material. go to youtube and check it out, been using it for almost 4 yrs and i love it. i believe your oncnc has the same type of toolpath, i've seen in other posts.

Have you considered HSMWorks? It is seamlessy integrated inside of Solidworks. The interface seems very intuitive, their adaptive clearing strategy works quite well, and the program architecture processes toolpaths quicker then my Mastercam eval. I believe their owned by CIMCO who developed the HSM toolpaths that Mastercam used to sell as an option. I don't have any affiliation at all, but I've been evaluating Mastercam, Camworks, HSMWorks and have found HSMWorks the nicest to use by far. Your mileage may vary

the only CADCAM I've used is Gibbs..but I've been very happy with it..user friendly and not too hard to learn

One thing nearly every new CAM buyer overlooks is the ability to write or modify the post processor. This costs a lot of money if you have the VAR do it. It is also a PITA to make small changes to the post as you become experienced with the software.

Starting around 1998, Mastercam slowly took away the ability to write your own post by obfuscating the post language (and they weren't entirely honest about it either). I've never upgraded and cannot recommend Mastercam for this reason.

I have no experience with Edgecam or Gibbs but this would be the first question I asked before even trying the software.

FWIW, Featurecam makes it easy for you to modify your own posts. I have limited experience with Featurecam but it looks to be user friendly.

How come you're not looking at Surfcam?

Edgecam's code wizard is nice to use and fairly easy. I wrote a code generator from scratch for a Milltronics teach lathe, with zero experience with the code wizard or the machine. The complexity of the code generator will affect the complexity of the job writing it, most normal machines have a CG available or can modify an existing one in the Code Wizard.

But yes - MAKE SURE that getting a code generator to suit your machine is part of the deal. I was burned twice with assurances that I would have no trouble doing it or getting one and then being badly disappointed. I finally found a 3rd party to write a complicated one for me and get us working - took several years -.

What's your definition of "small changes"?

The MPMaster post available for free from emastercam.com is pretty simple for making small changes. Most of the common stuff is a simple "Y" or "N" switch.

We have OneCNC xr2. There are a few things we think it is lacking.

First, the ability to rotate/move toolpaths. It would be very nice to be able to set up a program to make multiple parts in more than one orientation.

Second, helical bore and helical toolpaths. All of the others have this ability.

Third, is thread milling. I found it extremely easy in Gibbs to produce a thread mill program that worked out perfectly. It could also be done in OneCNC, but it was like jumping through hoops to modify the diameter of the helical path (resizing the helix in our CAD package, then reloading the pattern in OneCNC and redoing the toolpath). I have not tried this in the other packages yet, however I'm sure it is easier than how we have done it with OneCNC.

I looked at several before I bought a CAM system. I looked at MasterCam when V7 came out, I looked at SurfCam, Pathtrace, FeatureCam and several others. The current version of Gibbs was 4.0, and then it wasn't called GibbsCam it was called Virtual Gibbs.

I took the same drawing for each of them to draw and post. GibbsCam was by far the fastest, and easiest to use. I did not have the sales person draw the part, I had them stand behind me and tell me what to do.

I bought 2 seats of GibbsCam in September of 1999 and never looked back. I have both the mill and lathe packages, and I am very happy with it.

I heard a story one about two friends who had shops, and one bought MasterCam and the other bought GibbsCam. Both started taking a class to learn to use their respective software, and after the first class the Gibbs user was already making parts.

You have to buy what works best for you.

I looked at several packages and decided on Gibbs. I let the sales-guru do his thing and as he went step by step thru the process and it just made sence to me. It seemed to be the same key choices with variations, made over and over again cutting down on my learning curve.

I watched other sales-guru's program the same part and I knew they knew what they where doing, but there seemed to be very few re-occurring steps with lots of options. All very nice but I just wanted good parts, programmed easily and quickly.

So I choose Gibbs, for me it was the right choice.

As far as Post Processors, Gibbs had a library of Posts for my machines at I believe 250ish each, or I could write my own using the included Post-Haste. I went with the library and was issued several for each machine. Some worked well, others did not. I had to find the best of the lots and then still required a bit of tweaking which they did very quickly without charge. It was a pain, but got it all worked out.

One thing I do not like about Gibbs and that is you have all the geometry and part rendering but cannot make a real Print from it. That would be very nice.

One thing with any CAM package, it is not a drawing package! it's for making parts not really drawing them like Acad or a package that has GD&T capabilities for poduction, also if you are not the designer of the part how can you make a print? you don't know their design intent or tolerancing.

FWIW, Edgecam now allows you to dimension your models, and make prints from them. They also sell a solid modeler. It does not have all the features of a fill blown CAD program, they are trying to not cut their noses off with the CAD vendors.

Hi Jolson

I have to say these things have been mentioned on the Onecnc forum quite a bit especially the thread milling (which there are whispers this might be comin soon due to us all continually posting about it ) Which i assume could be similar to the helical paths you require too.

The multi workpiece coord stuff isnt something id personally need too much as normally low quantity stuff for me but for production i can see this would be very useful.

By the way have you demoed XR3 lots of new gizmos there that might help (Templates , HS toolpaths , Repick and lots more!! )

Cheers Kev

Another vote for HSMworks.

No Cam system can touch a Cad moder like Solidworks for getting work done on the drawing, modeling and design side. Then when you integrate a slick package like HSMworks into it, the results are devastating. No importing, exporting or keeping track of files, because everything is kept togther in one place. Changes and updates are instantaneous. This is not to mention that HSMworks is a really nicely laid out Cam package that's powerful and easy to learn. I did try Camworks and Solidcam and did not like them nearly as much.

For example, I mostly machine parts that require 3-4 setups to complete. The first setup can be machined with standard vise jaws, but the rest the setups often require softjaws. I design all my part softjaws and setups and toolspaths in a solidworks assembly. If I have to make a design change to a part, all the vise jaws and toolpaths are parametrically linked to the part and everything will update in seconds. This saves me hours of work reworking softjaw design for simple change. Then of course if the part is used in a machine, everything is tied togther along with the other related parts.

I've worked with other Cam packages like Mastercam and Visualmill, demoed others and it's not a contest. The other day I was at my buddy's shop helping him with some design work and watching him work on some toolpaths in Gibbs importing, exporting, and trying to get things to work. It was painful for me to sit through and made me feel sorry for him.

A cam package that integrates into a good cad program is the way to go if you think you will need to do any designing or modifying at all. But learning two software packages well is not a simple undertaking. If you already know Solidworks, then it will go really fast.

For my situation where I design and sell my own products it's the only way to go.

Shop i couldn't agree more! had a 30day demo of HSM and it was quite nice.

but we have Surfcam here at ASU and it talks with SW, so if i make a change it ask if i want to update and will bring in the changed geom.

surfcam has had dims since i started using it in 1992, but again it's not a drafting package, as most CAM are the same.

"also if you are not the designer of the part how can you make a print? you don't know their design intent or tolerancing. "


Has nothing to do with it.....If you have an operator running a job and you want specific amounts of material left for later operations it is nice to generate a print that can be saved as a file for each time the job is run. It is a nice way of complementing the route sheet.

Nothing beats SolidWorks print making ability (imo) but simple shop prints don't need that level of ability. I make simple prints all the time to remind me not to do something stupid.....