Rhino + Madcam + RhinoWorks + Scan&solve ???

ishman · Mar 12, 2012

Hello everyone !

I need you people's help regarding my step towards Rhino 3D + Madcam Expert (5 Axis for Cam) + RhinoWorks (for Parametric and Assembly) + Scan&solve (for FEA). All comes under 4k.

I will use these tools for machine development like small Press, Drills and other mechanical parts. Till now I am not experienced with any CAD software. And I can't spend too much time and money. Is it a complete and better choice ? as I mentioned above or there is some better complete solution then this.

Thanks in advance.

sfriedberg · Mar 12, 2012

I am a long-time Rhino user and think it's a great value for what it is. However, it has some real limitations in a traditional CAD workflow. The forthcoming Rhino5 addresses the lack of parametric modeling to a limited extent, but it's still a long way from something like SolidWorks. There is a total lack of database or spreadsheet linkage, which is essential in most product development environments. (Despite its limited market share, IronCAD scores very high in those areas.) On the plus side, the integration with Grasshopper and other tools is awesome.

I tried out the Scan&Solve evaluation recently and was pleased with the ease of use. The price is quite moderate. However, I would want to compare S&S results against another FEA tool carefully before trusting life or property to its results. That's a caution I would have with any new FEA tool, so I'm not being specifically critical of S&S.

I don't have any personal experience with Madcam or RhinoWorks.

If you can work within the limitations of the tools, I think your suggested toolkit is excellent value for the money.

ishman · Mar 12, 2012

Thanks sfriedberg !

database or spreadsheet linkage is essential. I am agree with this.
is there any plug-in or any other suggestion you people may have ?

ishman · Mar 12, 2012

Actually I know that I am going to get much less then SW or Inventor etc. ! And I liked the idea of instant 3D in SW. But in other areas like cam, parametric assembly and FEA it seems you can make things rapidly in my opinion.

OH !!! I forgot to say that there is no need for the S&S FEA to be precise because I will send all of my first design to the real design professionals to validate it on ANSYS. My requirement is to have some real fast and rapid tools to convert my imagination or clients requirement into drawing with rough evaluation. Rest will be done by relevant professionals or by my staff.

ishman · Mar 13, 2012

OK...
IronCAD looks interesting to me.
Does any one suggest IronCAD + 5 AXIS CAM + FEA ? (Under 7k)
OR
Can I go with IronCAD + Rhino 3D + RhinoCAM (5 axis) + S&S (FEA) ? (Will be under 7k) But not sure whether Rhino can import IronCAD file to do the FEA and CAM task. I can have the power of rhino and IronCAD simultaneously By this configuration.

ishman · Mar 16, 2012

Any one please HELP !!!

I have a meeting tomorrow with IronCAD representative in my office. Should I take note to ask him something ? They promise to give me some special deal if I decide to buy their software immediately after the meeting. But I am afraid and confused. Because they recommend me an integrated FEA suit (Nei Nastran) while they don't have any integrated CAM software.

Thanks in advance........

scadvice · Mar 16, 2012

Ishman, in my opinion.

I would call them and cancel the appointment under those terms. If they really are interested in serving your needs there would be no such terms, pressure or constants on the "deal".

They can reschedule for a later date if they wish but at first mention of a deal that is buy now or lose the deal I would end the meeting right there.

Your going to spend a lot of money, and it should be on your terms.

My thoughts anyway.

Steve :codger:

ishman · Mar 16, 2012

Great thoughts ! I decided to go according to you opinion. I'll hold my tongue. But let them come and show what discount they may have for instant buy.

In fact I am still confused how to choose CAD software for mechanical design. I asked for Rhino Because I am familiar with it but I don't think it can do the things needed for Mechanical department.

bryan_machine · Mar 16, 2012

ishman - one thing to try to assess (and it can be hard) is what software others in your network of suppliers, collaborators, customers, regulatory entities, and so on use, or prefer, or are famaliar with, or at least know how to deal with.

one big reason for using solidworks, or inventor, or ug, or catia, is that they have strong positions in various industries or industry in general (so some suppliers of common parts like Reid and Mcmaster have drawings of the parts they want to sell you in those formats.)

You'll note that this "how does it fit with the rest of my world" aspect isn't directly related to the qualities of the software.

Now, if you are going to design things that you build (or outsource based on paper prints) out of basic inputs like i-bream and rectangular tube, then the above might not matter. Likewise if you are an artist.

ishman · Mar 17, 2012

Thanks for opinion.

I agreed that those software you mentioned are not comparable to those I am looking for. But as said I am talking about some combination of a package a layman can learn easily, A common man can afford it, and he can draw and repair things fast. It's not a matter of perfect solution. but for rough evaluation only. Perfection can be made by relevant professionals with hundred thousands of software installed in their systems.

I am still searching to avoid expensive package. Till now my conclusion is mentioned below and I am still confused.

RHINO : I liked it because it was easy for me to learn and draw and they have affordable CAM and FEA as well while they fail to produce good sheet metal feature and bill of materials (BOM).
IRON CAD : I looked into it because it was easy as well but little bit expensive with Nei Nastran FEA. While they don't have any integrated CAM.
ALIBRE : This one is interesting as well. but they don't have integrated FEA.

Maybe I am wrong with my conclusion. And I will appreciate you people's feedback.

Thanks in advance.

bryan_machine · Mar 17, 2012

ishman - I volunteer for a lab where people draw up some concepts in rhino3d, and some of them are then converted to solidworks models so the metal people can produce them. So it may be that what you are trying to do will work. But sometimes, converting from rhino to solidworks is hard - I don't know why, I only heard about it later - but help from experts was required.

you might try to make more specific examples of work you have done or intend to do, and either describe them here, or take it up with the rhino community (which I understand to be large, but have no interaction with.)

good luck

ishman · Mar 18, 2012

Thanks bryan_machine !

After some research and with the help of kind people like you all, I've decided to change the combination.

Alibre Expert + FEMdesigner Pro
This combination haves everything I am looking for. And they have added surface modeling as well for which their software was being accused by designers. Both comes under 2.5k while CAM included in Alibre Expert is very basic and pro version cost around 4k. But I think its better to try their basic version of CAM initially.

But sometimes, converting from rhino to solidworks is hard.

Agreed. I hope it wouldn't happen as my designs will not be as complex.

Dan B · Mar 19, 2012

We use madCAM with Rhino everyday. We program 2D, 3-axis, and 5-axis positional paths with it. It works like a champ. It's my go-to tool when I need a quick toolpath. Our main CAM software is WorkNC, but it is way out of your price range. Is madCAM equal to WorkNC? No way! Does it produce great results with a bit more programming effort? Absolutely.

Hope this helps,

Dan

ishman · Mar 19, 2012

I appreciate your time Dan B.

Exactly what I needed to know about CAM. Great ! that you have experience of both. One quick question regarding WorkNC that it can produce great results. does it mean that MadCAM doesn't mill the job accurately ? If yes then how much is the variation. OR if it means something else then please...please let us know. Because it MATTERS.

Thanks in advance.

ishman · Mar 19, 2012

Also I am eager to know Dan B that how do you manage and save your parts in Rhino in case of machine structure design ? Because I coudn't find any Bill of materials feature or plug-in under rhino.

Dan B · Mar 19, 2012

madCAM is just as accurate as WorkNC when it comes to the quality of the toolpaths. The advantage WorkNC has is the way in which the toolpaths are created. I can produce a toolpath a lot quicker because of the excellent tools in WorkNC (graphical editing of the toolpath, saved sequences, etc.)

I can't help you with the BOM, but I know there are plug-ins available for this. I just don't happen to need them so I can't be very specific. If you post your concerns on the Rhino newsgroup, you will get more useful information on the subject then I can provide. You will need a newsreader like Thunderbird (I can provide the address if you PM me).

Dan

ishman · Mar 27, 2012

Thanks to all the people and suggestions.

I did the deep study as far as I can understand. I installed trial of SW, IronCAD, Rhino with Scan and solve (FEA), Alibre and Inventor. What I conclude is that I need to bite a bullet and go for Autodesk Inventor Professional 2012. It's the only complete, easiest and fastest CAD software I have ever used IMO. It's costing me $7k with all the tools I needed and even more tools that I can use in future. But still lacking CAM !

And still I have one month to invest. I can go for another one if better and cheaper then AIP 2012. No Catia Please ! I am comfortable only under 10k with all the tools. (Mechanical CAD + FEA + 5 axis CAM)

Dan B · Mar 27, 2012

$10,000-$7000 only leaves you with $3000 for CAM software. That's going to be a challenge.

Dan

RobCee · Mar 27, 2012

Ishman,

Thinking back to your pushy salespeople, remember that they all have sales targets!

The prices (and deals) on these software packages are all very time dependent. The salespeople have monthly, quarterly and annual targets, so if you get one at the right time there are fantastic deals to be had on software. Many software resellers can do crazy things with price a day or two before their year end and some pretty good deals at the end of a quarter (like March!).

I'm not saying you'll get anything for nothing, but find out where they are in their financial year and how close to target they are. Sometines you'll get a real bargain that helps you AND them.

Your approach seems to be a good one; CAD system opinions do seem to be somewhat like religion and you just have to try them and see which YOU like the feel of.

Have fun choosing

ishman · Mar 27, 2012

I know Dan ! But my honeymoon started with Inventor. It's difficult to see other side. I am impressed with the speed and quality of this product. It pop's up the next command for me like it knows what i want next. Maybe I must increase my budget in future. for a while I'll go for visual mill IMO. confused with CAM...........................you're right ! it's a challenge.

Rhino + Madcam + RhinoWorks + Scan&solve ???

Plastic

Diamond

Plastic

Plastic

Plastic

Plastic

Titanium

Plastic

Diamond

Plastic

Diamond

Plastic

Hot Rolled

Plastic

Plastic

Hot Rolled

Plastic

Hot Rolled

Plastic

Plastic

Similar threads