Upgrade rpm? Cincinnati no4 vertical

I've found a 1941 Cincinnati no4 vertical mill that looks to be in good shape and I would consider buying
BUT it only has a max rpm of 450!!!

Is there any way to boost those rpm's?
Toss in a different rpm main motor, change sheaves and belts?
I have access to literally piles of motors (electric motor repair facility, all hp)
There great iron but that's just too slow. Even 900rpm would be way better

I'll mostly be using it to cut keyseats in heavy shafts and boring holes.

Any insight or concerns with these mills is welcome too. Thanks!!

Any insight or concerns with these mills is welcome too

Click to expand...

If you don't mind wearing out the guts

The 2A (Medium Speed Dial Type) did not become the 4A (High Speed Dial Type) until great improvements were made to such things as OILING SYSTEM

Look at your serial - starts with a 2A

Plain bearing equipment is capable of high revs with pressure lubrication, perhaps "total loss" lubrication.

Early Indy cars were total loss.

Not saying that's your remedy, just bringing it to your attention.

Doesn't have to be what is commonly known as "oil", either. Just needs to be slippery.

Not sure if a floor covered in Dawn dishwashing detergent would be preferable...

On a related note, those huge "Heavy" presses don't use hydraulic fluid, just water with additives, IIRC.

"Easy" would be an output speeder.

Bear in mind, it got the job done when it was new at that speed. Speeding up will shorten the life, and it'll probably make A LOT more noise running faster.

I've got a K&T 5CK horizontal, made in '53 I think, top speed is 1200 RPM.

johnoder said:

If you don't mind wearing out the guts

The 2A (Medium Speed Dial Type) did not become the 4A (High Speed Dial Type) until great improvements were made to such things as OILING SYSTEM

Look at your serial - starts with a 2A

Click to expand...

Serial number: b4106/16
Cincinnati no.4 vertical mill


I'm not looking to run the snot out of it, but 900 rpm would let me run a selection of carbide face mills, bore a wide selection of holes and run smaller endmill a for keyseats.

Anyone have a typical price for what a well cared for machine goes for?

Your "1941" threw me. Serial says prior to 1933 - may even still have plain spindle bearings

Here is 1926 catalog

See if yours looks like pdf page 85

http://ozarktoolmanuals.com/wp-content/uploads/pdfcatalogs/Cincinnati_Catalog_1926.pdf

If plain bearing machine you do not want to go faster

Add scan from 1931 showing upper and lower drip feed oilers for spindle bearings. Is your prospect so equipped?

Stirling said:

Serial number: b4106/16
Cincinnati no.4 vertical mill


I'm not looking to run the snot out of it, but 900 rpm would let me run a selection of carbide face mills, bore a wide selection of holes and run smaller endmill a for keyseats.

Anyone have a typical price for what a well cared for machine goes for?

Click to expand...

http://www.lathes.co.uk/cincinnati/page2.html

The 4th photo down, first vertical shown in this page is identical to the machine.


Wow, that is a fantastic piece of sales literature you posted!
Might have to sit down with a coffee Sunday and read it. Very neat!

Stirling said:

http://www.lathes.co.uk/cincinnati/page2.html

The 4th photo down, first vertical shown in this page is identical to the machine.

Click to expand...

Real early medium speed dial type - when serials were revised in 1933 it would have been given a 2A serial

Grease lubed bevel gearing and vertical spindle bearings

As to faster, new longer belts and larger motor pulley would get you there. If it drives you nuts with more noise and hot spindle housing, you can RETHINK what you have done

As to value, I'll let you decide on something pushing 85 years

Somewhat later Parts and Service book M-786 on VM

Stirling said:

Serial number: b4106/16
Cincinnati no.4 vertical mill


I'm not looking to run the snot out of it, but 900 rpm would let me run a selection of carbide face mills, bore a wide selection of holes and run smaller endmill a for keyseats.

Anyone have a typical price for what a well cared for machine goes for?

Click to expand...

I think you are trying to mis-apply this machine. It was designed to remove a lot of material fast with a decent sized face mill using HSS.

I do not think that you will ever be satisfied with this machine for what you want to do with it.

If you want to cut a keyway fast in a long shaft, use a horizontal not this machine.

If you want to bore holes, then a vertical is probably better. As bad as a Bridgeport is for as rigidity, I think you would find it more usable than this machine for what you are trying to do.

Do not under estimate the cost of tooling for this machine. I'm pretty sure it is NMTB50.

As far as the value, your rigging and moving costs will be more than the value of the machine. You really need to re-evaluate this choice.

And yes we used to a large newer one of these at work. It was very good at making large chunks of steel blocks flat but not much else and that is why we got rid of it.