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Van Norman dividing head identification

paroikoi

Aluminum
Joined
Oct 2, 2014
Location
Jonesboro, AR, USA
Hello all,
Can anyone please help me identify this dividing head? It came with a VN12 I recently bought. It takes VN "C" collets, but it doesn't look like any VN dividing heads I can find in their catalogs.

I'm wondering if it was some other brand of dividing head and was modified to take VN collets. The sleeve (if that's what it is) that accepts VN collets is bigger in diameter than the threaded spindle on the unit, which makes me wonder if it didn't start life taking VN collets. I haven't yet tried to remove that sleeve.

Thanks in advance!

Josh
 

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There aren't very many horizontal swiveling dividing heads, so that's probably a VN! Looks like the 7.5" model for their smaller mills. They made a 10" equivalent, and also a 10" vertical swiveling dividing head that works more conventionally.

You can find a photo of the 7.5" horizontal swivel head in the "Attachments, Arbors, Accessories" catalog stashed at the Yahoo Van Norman group. It's a different side view than your photos, so you might have a look to be 100% certain of what you got.
 
Thanks, sfriedberg! The reason I don't know if it's a Van Norman is that it doesn't have the spindle/drive shaft for attaching it to external gears. Also, it's 5" table to center height, by the way. That would make it a 10" swing, right? It doesn't look like anything the Van Norman catalogs show...
 
The majority of dividing heads are not universal dividing heads. That means you generally don't have any way to attach the head to external gearing for helical milling or compound indexing. The VN 10" heads are universal. The VN 7.5" head is not.

Please excuse the cut-and-pastes from already halftoned scans of catalog engravings...

The first image is of the VN 10" horizontal swivel dividing head. It's clear your photos are not of this head. The second image is of the VN 7.5" horizontal dividing head. Your photo views are from different angles than the catalog view, so there may be some differences, but that looks pretty similar to me.

I don't have a VN 7.5" head, so I can't measure the center height to compare against yours. Possibly VN was being conservative with their nominal catalog size. Monarch was known for lathe nominal swings several inches less than the actual swing.

Possibly you have a rare or very early (non-catalog) model that's larger than the standard 7.5" head. I really doubt it's a custom, but we do know that VN made custom, non-catalog oversize tables for their mills. A scaled up dividing head is a lot more work than a longer table, though. However, from the style, it might be really old.

Possibly this is somebody else's copy of a VN 7.5" head, slightly scaled up.

Please take a look at your head from the same angle as the catalog view, and tell us what (if anything) is different. I do see that the shape of the body is somewhat different. Your head is wider at the ends of the spindle casting, while the VN catalog head is uniform (ignoring bosses) in diameter.

If I had to guess at this point, I'd guess you have a very early VN head where they reused the basic design for the smaller swing 7.5" horizontal swivel head and redesigned the 10" swing horizontal swivel head completely as a universal head. That might place it in the pre-model #6 "Duplex" era. Unfortunately, there's little (almost nothing beyond a few advertisments) documentation available for that vintage of VN stuff.
 

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Mine just doesn't have that spindle (for external gear drive) sticking out of the base. I'll take better photos of mine today from a few angles. It has enough similarities, though, that surely it must be a Van Norman...

Josh
 
I just went through all the catalogs on the Vintage machinery site and although your dividing head has a lot of similarities with a 10" horizontal there are no perfect matches. It is definitely not a 7.5" version. I have one of those for my VN #10 and yours is different. I only wonder if you might have ended up with a prototype dividing head. Sorry I can't be of further help other than to say it shares a lot similarities with the 10" VN but is definitely not a 100% match.
Harold
 
("It is pretty safe to say mine is VN, just not a standard model?")
I can't give any proof to that, All I can say is that it looks like a 10" VN but there are differences.
Maybe a prototype or a limited run of standard dividing heads as opposed to universal or as also mentioned
maybe somebody else made a few that were geared towards VN machines.
Best of luck with your machine.
Harold
 
I have both a 10" VN horizontal swivel and a 10" VN vertical swivel of roughly mid-1950's vintage. They are both universal heads, and neither looks like the head under discussion here. The body on the 10" VN horizontal is quite a bit larger than this head.

If you compare this head with the catalog engraving of the VN 7.5" horizontal head, it's clear that a lot of the difference in center height (5" vs 3.75") comes from the base casting. It looks like the original part, not any sort of added riser.

It's not in the right place for a missing shaft, but what is visible through that black hole in the base casting?

Oh, and how much does your head weight? Is it closer to 100lb or 50lb? My 10" horizontal weights about 100lb.
 
Quite by chance, a VN 7.5" horizontal head showed up on eBay with good pictures, which I'm borrowing for use here. As you can see, it's equipped for both direct indexing (large rear index plate with one circle) and simple (aka plain) indexing (six circle index plate with worm reduction).
 

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Hi all, I found this Van Norman attachment at an estate sale and have had a difficult time learning about its history and identification. Any help would be greatly appreciated. The serial number is 6-4338 if that helps. Sorry about the pictures being up side down. I don't know how to fix that.
 








 
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