4 flute end mills for steel and stainless - Page 3
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  1. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bobw View Post
    ME? Curtis Payne, aka Latheinserts.com, aka Exkenna on this site.. They were cheaper than just
    about anything else by 20-30%. That was years ago, I have no idea now. They were decent endmills,
    I just didn't care for the geometry on the lower end.



    My experience with Hanita.. They SUCK!!! This was over 10 years ago and the Hanita Varimill was all
    the rage... I was getting my endmills from a smallish company at the time, and the salesman talked
    me into trying some HTC Hotmills.. The same Hotmills that Maritool sells now.. So I tried 'em, and
    they were F'n AWESOME..

    So.. Everybody at the time seemed to have a raging hard-on for the Hanita Varimill, so I was talking
    to my J&L salesman (remember J&L, MSC bought and KILLED THEM) and he offered to send me out some
    Hanitas, even deeply discounted the price was 60% more than the HTC's, but everybody says they are
    the best thing since sliced bread...

    So, running a part that I still do on occasion, about 150 of 'em... The HTC I was running started to get
    a little loud after 70 parts or so, so I figure I'll try out the Super Duper Hanita Varimill... Of the
    3 I got to test, the best I managed was almost 3 parts on one of them.. Put another HTC in and ran out the
    other 70 or so parts and that HTC lived to cut more metal another day...

    I called up my J&L salesman (Brett Ackerman IIRC, good guy), he got me on a conference call with Hanita tech..
    Apparently for the privilege of paying more for a name and a stupid weak grind, I had to back down my surface speed and
    my chip load... I didn't have to pay for the 3 endmills.

    They took so much meat out of the center of the endmill, it had no backbone, it looked fancy, but
    it was weak as hell.. I have no idea if they have since improved on the design, and for the price
    they want for the damn things, I have no intention of finding out.
    It has been a while since I've run the Vari mills. Vari mill II was what I was using,5 flute. like I said I buy locally now, mostly for real mill work I've gone all indexable. Mits feed mills, Sandvik 790 for Al. It's production stuff so indexable just makes so much more sense. I do like the Niagara 6 flute, they have a totally different grind on them than I have seen.

  2. #42
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    Niagara Multi Flute with or without Chipbreakers
    Chipbreakers reduce the length of the stringy crappy chips, reduces tool pressure for more feed rates, and helps the conveyors stop getting chunked up.
    untitled.jpg
    Call me for pricing.
    800-204-0835
    UPS RED NEXT DAY shipping on ALL Niagara items is only $16.50

    Best for the Money.....no doubt. Made in USA

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    we at our shop are a fan of Garr... excellent drills and pretty good endmills. and cheap.. lol Our shop wouldnt buy them if they were not...

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    what would be an optimal feed and speed and doc for 1.4301 stainless steel in a fanuc robodrill with 12mm (half inch) end mill?

    is there a good online calculator which can "tell me" that?
    I would like one which takes many things in consideration for example how much the tool is pulled out of adapter, or how long it is, the size of part (vibrations due to longer and slimmer parts), etc.

    I was breaking tools in that material like crazy, but at first i used 6mm end mills.

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    Quote Originally Posted by AndyMoon View Post
    For HSM toolpaths in 17-4 - like pmack recommends - the Guhring RF100S/F variable 6 flute is a great option. Guhring, Inc. - Tool List

    If you are looking for a four flute, the Guhring Diver works great in stainless as well as carbon steels.
    Guhring, Inc.
    Their Firex coating is the best tool life I have ever seen in 316ss

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    I have used Widia, Kennametal and Monster.
    All in the same Tialn coated HP 4 variable flute desing.

    Widia performed better than anything else and was actually cheaper. Kennametal OK but did not last as long.
    Monster was cheapest and didn't last at all. I could tell it would not just by looking at its flutes.

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    For the money , I like the garr vrx and v4 series. I think a lot of it depends on a vast combination of things though. Machine, fixture, tool holders, tool paths, controller,operator,my luck that day, etc etc

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    Quote Originally Posted by zero_divide View Post
    I have used Widia, Kennametal and Monster.
    All in the same Tialn coated HP 4 variable flute desing.

    Widia performed better than anything else and was actually cheaper. Kennametal OK but did not last as long.
    Monster was cheapest and didn't last at all. I could tell it would not just by looking at its flutes.
    Why Monster? You had two sports cars with the Widia & Kennametal. Then a used mini van with Monster....

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    Quote Originally Posted by cpifer3 View Post
    For the money , I like the garr vrx and v4 series. I think a lot of it depends on a vast combination of things though. Machine, fixture, tool holders, tool paths, controller,operator,my luck that day, etc etc
    Gorilla Mill will beat Garr VRX any day!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Shop Supply Guru View Post
    Get some Gorilla Mills in. They will beat Niagara, YG (by a lot), & SGS Z Carb in terms of life & speed.
    LOL....I'm sorry but the Gorilla Mills are junk....

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    My recommendation is IMCO M525 series. Their 5 flutes will beat anyone out there. I've tested them all. But you need to run at their speed and feeds and dont plug and play with whatever you're using now.

    Cheers

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    Quote Originally Posted by bsh21wash View Post
    LOL....I'm sorry but the Gorilla Mills are junk....
    Interesting thought. Which ones have you ran & on what? I've never had anyone say they were junk or even a negative comment and I've sold them to about 75 different end users. Are you sure it wasn't Monster Mill? A lot of people get them confused.

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    I launched a buying site last year just for variable helix tools, 4 and 5 flute for steels.
    It also features Zrn coated tools for aluminum, but they're not variable helix. (working on that..)

    End Mill Depot - End Mill Depot Home Page

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    Quote Originally Posted by exkenna View Post
    I launched a buying site last year just for variable helix tools, 4 and 5 flute for steels.
    It also features Zrn coated tools for aluminum, but they're not variable helix. (working on that..)

    End Mill Depot - End Mill Depot Home Page
    On that site it says "SUPERIOR TO HANITA VARIMILL AND SGS Z-CARB"
    That's a pretty bold statement. Not saying it's untrue,but pretty bold.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mtndew View Post
    On that site it says "SUPERIOR TO HANITA VARIMILL AND SGS Z-CARB"
    That's a pretty bold statement. Not saying it's untrue,but pretty bold.
    No its not, Hanita Varimills F'n BLOW... And SUCK all at the same time.

    Many moons ago, before Frank Mari sold HTC's, I put HTC's heads up against
    the Hanitas.. The HTC ran 70 parts before it started to get a little loud.
    Then came the Hanitas.. Of the 3 I got to test, not a one of them completed
    3 parts at the same speeds and feeds, and even the same holder.. Put in another
    HTC and ran out the remaining 70 something parts, and the endmill lived to cut again.
    Hanita tech told me I had to lower my surface speed, and my chip load for the privilege
    of paying more(A LOT MORE$$$$) for their endmills.

    The HTC's, Imco's and Titans, in my experience are all pretty darn close. The times
    I've had enough run time to gather data, they are within 4 or 5% of each other.

    I'll vouch for Curtis's Titans to be vastly superior to the Hanitas. Never run SGS, so
    I can't say. And Curtis is a good guy too, he's helped me out a lot and never steered me wrong.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bobw View Post
    No its not, Hanita Varimills F'n BLOW... And SUCK all at the same time.

    Many moons ago, before Frank Mari sold HTC's, I put HTC's heads up against
    the Hanitas.. The HTC ran 70 parts before it started to get a little loud.
    Then came the Hanitas.. Of the 3 I got to test, not a one of them completed
    3 parts at the same speeds and feeds, and even the same holder.. Put in another
    HTC and ran out the remaining 70 something parts, and the endmill lived to cut again.
    Hanita tech told me I had to lower my surface speed, and my chip load for the privilege
    of paying more(A LOT MORE$$$$) for their endmills.

    The HTC's, Imco's and Titans, in my experience are all pretty darn close. The times
    I've had enough run time to gather data, they are within 4 or 5% of each other.

    I'll vouch for Curtis's Titans to be vastly superior to the Hanitas. Never run SGS, so
    I can't say. And Curtis is a good guy too, he's helped me out a lot and never steered me wrong.
    Maybe somethings changed in the last 10 years, because I really like the Varimills. I pay somewhere around $42 for a 1/2" 4lute and beat the hell out of them.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mtndew View Post
    On that site it says "SUPERIOR TO HANITA VARIMILL AND SGS Z-CARB"
    That's a pretty bold statement. Not saying it's untrue,but pretty bold.
    I was the application specialist for Hanita back in the day. Did some of the field testing on the 1st generation Varimill in 2001 (jeez, hard to think that was 16 years ago) Kennametal has monkeyed around with the product a lot since then. Haven't tested any of the newer versions. But I can say that for a general purpose job shop end mill the Titan Vi-Pro is a nice product with a very wide sweet spot. Truth is.. there's not any really bad tools on the market right now. The niche is saturated so anything inferior probably wouldn't last very long as a brand. It really comes down to what you're comfortable running, what works for you, and price and availability.

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  24. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by AARONT View Post
    Maybe somethings changed in the last 10 years, because I really like the Varimills. I pay somewhere around $42 for a 1/2" 4lute and beat the hell out of them.
    Where are you finding a 1/2" Hanita for $42?.. MSC's price on a 1.25loc is $156. So that means the list
    price is probably about $120, and most sane places will sell them for $75 maybe...

    It also wouldn't surprise me if they have changed... They had tons of stupid reliefs and steps and shit
    in the flutes that served absolutely no purpose in the cutting process.. On the constant occasion that
    you broke them, it wasn't hard to see why, all the fancy "pretty" grinding left absolutely NOTHING for
    a backbone.. There was more meat in the center of a standard 1/4" endmill than in the center of a 1/2"
    Hanita varimill. They sure were pretty though.

    On the positive side of the Hanita Varimill. Back in 2005 or 6 I grabbed a pile of uncoated 1/2"ers off
    of J&L's O-Zone for about $20 each.. Apparently they were going to stop stocking them uncoated.... I ran the hell
    out of those in a ton of aluminum bronze.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bobw View Post
    No its not, Hanita Varimills F'n BLOW... And SUCK all at the same time.

    Many moons ago, before Frank Mari sold HTC's, I put HTC's heads up against
    the Hanitas.. The HTC ran 70 parts before it started to get a little loud.
    Then came the Hanitas.. Of the 3 I got to test, not a one of them completed
    3 parts at the same speeds and feeds, and even the same holder.. Put in another
    HTC and ran out the remaining 70 something parts, and the endmill lived to cut again.
    Hanita tech told me I had to lower my surface speed, and my chip load for the privilege
    of paying more(A LOT MORE$$$$) for their endmills.

    The HTC's, Imco's and Titans, in my experience are all pretty darn close. The times
    I've had enough run time to gather data, they are within 4 or 5% of each other.

    I'll vouch for Curtis's Titans to be vastly superior to the Hanitas. Never run SGS, so
    I can't say. And Curtis is a good guy too, he's helped me out a lot and never steered me wrong.
    What material were you cutting when you did this test?

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    Quote Originally Posted by robert123 View Post
    What material were you cutting when you did this test?
    4140, annealed.


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