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5 Axis: DMG Mori DMU 50 CELOS or Mazak Variaxis I-600 Smooth X? Which would you buy?

Mr.Mechanical

Plastic
Joined
Sep 22, 2010
Location
Virginia
Hi guys,

I got the green light to upgrade from our Okuma M460-VE to a 5 axis machine! (We were getting killed by number of setups.)

I have read through all the posts I could find about the Mazak Variaxis I-600 and DMG DMU 50 but wanted to see if anyone was in the same position as me before they bought one machine or another. Plus feedback from any others users would be great.

Two big concerns on the DMU is it's weight (9900 lbs. vs 28,860 lbs. Mazak) and the C frame type rotary table. A plus for the DMG (I think) is that scales are standard and $30-40K option on the Mazak.

A new Mazak is $20K less than a demo DMU 50 both loaded.

Both companies seem to have good support for central Virginia.

Any options would be greatly appreciated! Thanks :)
 
The DMU-50 isn't even in the same universe as the I-600. If you were comparing a j-500 to a DMU-50, or an I-600 to a DMU-65, you'd have a conversation. Just go look at both of them in person, and your question is answered. If you can't see them in person, ask them for detailed photos of the machine without sheetmetal.
 
If I had to spend your money for a 5axis, it would be on a Mazak :)

Some pics were posted here before by members who have them and the reviews were great as well.
 
If I were buying a 5 axis, I'd skip both those and go look at Makino, Yasda, or Mitsui Seiki. The choice between those builders would be narrowed down by the type of work you are going to do on the machine.
 
If I were buying a 5 axis, I'd skip both those and go look at Makino, Yasda, or Mitsui Seiki. The choice between those builders would be narrowed down by the type of work you are going to do on the machine.

Too expensive -- our budget is less than $300K plus not sure about local service availability.
 
The DMG Mori salesman makes a big deal about having glass scales standard of all axis. It's a very expensive option on Mazak but their machine is 3x the weight of the DMG and is a bridge style so maybe scales are not necessary. It was never an issue not having this on our Okuma. :willy_nilly:
 
Too expensive -- our budget is less than $300K plus not sure about local service availability.

That's too bad:( .

My only Mazak 5 axis experience was with an Integrex 1060i. Looked big and beefy, but was really flimsy as a mill. Cat50 big plus spindle yet when a milling tool was more than ~8" gage length, you really had to baby it. Had Mazak factory guys in several times to check it out and they always said it was in spec. After about 2 years we replaced it with a Makino. Parts we were running went from 13 hours to 4.5 hours on the new machine. YMMV

I've always liked Mori Seiki, it was the first CNC I ever ran back in 1978. Never been a fan of the DMG stuff and hear mixed reviews. Some folks like them, others don't.
 
The DMG Mori salesman makes a big deal about having glass scales standard of all axis. It's a very expensive option on Mazak but their machine is 3x the weight of the DMG and is a bridge style so maybe scales are not necessary. It was never an issue not having this on our Okuma. :willy_nilly:

Scales should never be an option on a five axis machine. For $300k right now you have multiple options. From Hermle to Matsuura. Take some time to look at not just the machine but how you are going to program it, tool it and verify your programs.

Good luck.
 
Scales should never be an option on a five axis machine. For $300k right now you have multiple options. From Hermle to Matsuura. Take some time to look at not just the machine but how you are going to program it, tool it and verify your programs.

Good luck.

I expect a Matsuura MX would tick all the boxes? What's a 520 worth approximately? No personal experience, but I'd most likely choose one over the i600 or dmu50.
 
Wouldn't hurt to know what tolerances you normally have to work to, for hole/feature locations to each other.

Might be better to put $40K on temp control/AC for most shops than on scales that might make what, a few tenths difference if its tuned to work properly?
 
Thanks for the valuable input guys!

Wow -- is it possible to get a Hermle CU22 for $300K??? Or Matsuura MX-520?

The problem for us with the DMG Mori salesman is he has not offered any real discount (only 5% off) on their new machines. So a quote NMV-3000 or 5000 -- it will near full retail. They only offered us 17% off on a demo machine which was a DMU 50 without CELOS panel. Mazak on the other hand offered a huge discount and the new Smooth X control which claim is the fastest available on any machine.

Regarding accuracy -- would like to see position accuracy at +/- .0002" or better.
 
Mazak on the other hand offered a huge discount and the new Smooth X control which claim is the fastest available on any machine

Key words there are NEW and CLAIM .

Solid Cam Claims to be the best cam system in the world buy cutting you cycle times by 70%! But that must be compared to windows note pad.

This means your the test subject. I am a MORI/DMG fan and would put the NMV-DCG against the Mazak any day and more so with the MAAPS control since it is proven. However it is just outside your budget unless you can stir up something with the cooperate office.

But since you already know the Okuma control why would you not just consider an MU? Im not sure what the price is but I have watched those run and they are just as good as Mori and Mazak.
 
Key words there are NEW and CLAIM .

Solid Cam Claims to be the best cam system in the world buy cutting you cycle times by 70%! But that must be compared to windows note pad.

This means your the test subject. I am a MORI/DMG fan and would put the NMV-DCG against the Mazak any day and more so with the MAAPS control since it is proven. However it is just outside your budget unless you can stir up something with the cooperate office.

But since you already know the Okuma control why would you not just consider an MU? Im not sure what the price is but I have watched those run and they are just as good as Mori and Mazak.

We love Okuma -- it was out first consideration until salesman quoted us $450K minus some to be determined discount :eek:

I'll ask the DMG Mori salesman for a quote on the NMV-DCG though -- thanks
 
For some reason I get the impression a 5axis where the trunnion/swivelly thing is held on both ends, would be more rigid/accurate long term vs on that just hangs off the back end? no?
 








 
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