What's new
What's new

5 axis software experts.

5 axis Fidia guy

Stainless
Joined
Aug 17, 2006
Location
Wisconsin
Ok, I am not a complete newbie here in the 5axis department, but I need some feedback. I have been very successfully doing simultanious mold work on several machine here but I currently have a project that is kicking my ass so to speak. Is there any software out there able to do multipencil finishing simultanious toolpaths that will see undercuts from a TOP view, without makes several work planes to reach undercut areas? If so please speak up!
 
Ok, I am not a complete newbie here in the 5axis department, but I need some feedback. I have been very successfully doing simultanious mold work on several machine here but I currently have a project that is kicking my ass so to speak. Is there any software out there able to do multipencil finishing simultanious toolpaths that will see undercuts from a TOP view, without makes several work planes to reach undercut areas? If so please speak up!


If you don't mind me asking, what are you using right now software wise?

And when you say "That will see undercuts from a top view" ... I am assuming 5 axis vertical looking top-down? [I'm trying to visualize if transparency is required or if you are looking through a solid onto a reverse or occluded surface to see an undercut?]... Any chance you can post some pics of what you are talking about or re-made/hacked examples of what's hanging you up? Or what it is you can't "See".

Cheers,
 
I believe Powermill is capable of this. But your choice of tool is important also. Such as a lollipop cutter. Mastercam is supposed to do this also. I use both but have not had the occasion to use it and it may not work in all instances. I think Powermill would have a better chance at success since it's design was meant for these circumstances.

Paul
 
From what I know which is half of nothing, NX, Esprit, Hypermill and Autosuk powermill are the programs to go to. Mastercam, Gibbs, everyone even Bobcat, claims rights to everything, but as we explore it, it gets drown in upgrades and mediocre applications. Undercut with a lollipop mill is very different from undercutting with a articulating Z axis. Speaking of which, we would need to know if it IS in fact an articulating head or are your 4 and 5 on a trunnion(B) and A?

Esprit would be my GOTO, I use it for the Multus which is XYZCS and B as an articulating tool spindle. Not about, but through.

R
 
I really can't post a pic because it is for another shop we are helping out.. Picture a mold core of a twisted spline cut in half lengthwise. I currently use Powermill and have been for the last 17 years or so. Powermill cannot see undercuts from the top view, at least for corner finishing toolpaths.
 
Can you post a picture of what you are exactly needing to do?
I use NX and have done my fair share of undercutting

Funny As I was totally picturing you as the goto-guy on this especially as I know you have done a lot with "Pencil" type/profiled tools. I was hoping you would chime in... As this is something that is relevant to me to... lol
 
I really can't post a pic because it is for another shop we are helping out.. Picture a mold core of a twisted spline cut in half lengthwise. I currently use Powermill and have been for the last 17 years or so. Powermill cannot see undercuts from the top view, at least for corner finishing toolpaths.


So I was kinda hoping you could generalize the problem visually, like make a facsimile of the problem that is not your client's part. And post pics for that?
 
So I was kinda hoping you could generalize the problem visually, like make a facsimile of the problem that is not your client's part. And post pics for that?

Thats what I was thinking as well because I have no clue trying to visualize what he posted lol
 
Funny As I was totally picturing you as the goto-guy on this especially as I know you have done a lot with "Pencil" type/profiled tools. I was hoping you would chime in... As this is something that is relevant to me to... lol

I'm not a master by any means but I have a lot of good people I lean on :)
 
I really can't post a pic because it is for another shop we are helping out.. Picture a mold core of a twisted spline cut in half lengthwise. I currently use Powermill and have been for the last 17 years or so. Powermill cannot see undercuts from the top view, at least for corner finishing toolpaths.

never heard of that, but not familiar with powermill. All i can figure is it might be a surface-normal thing (wherein normals need to be reversed).
Picture's worth 1000
 
never heard of that, but not familiar with powermill. All i can figure is it might be a surface-normal thing (wherein normals need to be reversed).
Picture's worth 1000

Yup... It could be something like that... But not seeing the problem actually being illustrated then its open to many many different interpretations.

So for example in OpenGl and other graphics rendering schemes polygons can be rendered as "single sided" as defined by having a polygon whose vertices are ordered in an anti clockwise fashion to the vector normal (sticking outwards). So indeed for a "Single sided" rendered manifold if you look at it upside down then it becomes "invisible"/effectively transparent... Maybe that's your under-cut (not "Seeing" problem?) One way to cure that instead of flipping the vector normal is to force "Double sided" rendering of your polygons. That can be a graphics card setting, or a setting in your software. Typically double sided rendering of polygons is turned off to literally double the frame rate/ halve the amount of computation (as it's assumed that the vector normals and order of vertices are correct and also are part of an enclosed surface... Assuming that IS the kind of problem we are talking about here, maybe find the means to turn "double sided polygon" rendering/lighting etc. On. On the other hand if it's a volumetric rendering scheme like Vericut or some such then maybe it's a different problem all togther??? Also make sure depth testing/Z-buffer is turned on too (in some cases).

Normally is it not the case that these simulations can be rendered from any position and orientation with a defined virtual camera? [In most CAD/CAM Software)?

Shooting in the dark here ... :-)
 
All these need to go from a 6mm ball down to a 2mm.. They are mostly undercut from the top view and I need a simultanious toolpath to get at just the corners. Not a work a round with a lolipop or making a zillion workplanes. Powermill cannot do it, curious who out there can. MOST corner picking toolpaths only project down in line of sight, which does me no good in this instance.
 

Attachments

  • 1.jpg
    1.jpg
    13.8 KB · Views: 211
  • 2_001.jpg
    2_001.jpg
    16.7 KB · Views: 204
Masterccam's morph (between curves) can probably do that with some geometry creation to denote the difference between 6mm to 2mm
 
All these need to go from a 6mm ball down to a 2mm.. They are mostly undercut from the top view and I need a simultanious toolpath to get at just the corners. Not a work a round with a lolipop or making a zillion workplanes. Powermill cannot do it, curious who out there can. MOST corner picking toolpaths only project down in line of sight, which does me no good in this instance.

Maybe SolidCam, Esprit, and Hypermill? (aswell?)

So you are saying you can't select a linked chain of features to create a sim 5 axis tool path that follows specifically these undercuts which tilts the work piece/tool appropriately (for true sim 5 axis tool path/tilting tool)?

And second the view point or virtual camera you really want is one that is locked down to the tool position and orientation (your asked for "top view"?... So that the work piece is the thing that's tilting and rotating so you can almost get a "tool's -eye -view" ) (sounds odd ;-)so you can effectively look into (and in under) those undercuts?

Maybe I'm way off here lol.

Is that kinda what you mean?
 
Along corner toolpaths only project in line of sight,, means you miss undercuts.

Sorry to be dense; So you mean the tool paths are visually occluded or masked over by "Opaque" overlying features. These overlying features get in the way of you being able to see the specific tool paths for the undercuts. And there is no way to make a chained set of (virtual camera) view points or positions in Powermill to look down into difficult to reach features... And you can't clamp the virtual camera / view point to an off set value relative to the tool position and orientation (so you can't see what the tool sees and you can't select these features to begin with as they are occluded so therefore you can't generate these tool paths in the first place)...And you are not able to make the part/model be semi transparent so you can look through the model's occluded features either ? If I've got that right (more or less) ? And you might not be able to select undercut features even if you can look through the model? And there's no modelling tree/history graph to select features (you want) from either?

It's kind of funny or interesting as the red arrows you marked up on your pics would be the angular orientation of a virtual camera's viewing frustum (perspective projection or orthogonal).

I'm guessing you can't split rendered views into different windows either with different virtual camera positions for each window and custom views (in powemill?) ?

And you can't "smash" the viewing plane into the model so it intersects the model really close up where you want it to?
 
Wow that was a mouthful, lol.. This is harder explaining than making the toolpath.. Looking down the part, there are obvious areas where a tool cannot reach in 3axis correct, Powermill's corner finishing stragegy is simultanious, BUT it projects straight down the view, not the toolaxis, so it misses the undercuts.. There are many ways to get this material out, but they all consist of making workplanes along the views, which is time consuming and very tedious. Curious, what software do you use?
 








 
Back
Top