Advice making Knife Handles

G-Auto · Feb 19, 2017

I need to cut knife handles out of G10 phenolic sheet on a production basis.

The handles are in halves, pretty complicated shapes with 3D milling. Not just the profile and a corner round.

I have made prototypes on our Brother S1000 but the dust from the G10 totally messed the coolant system up.

I looked at the Datron milling machines since they say they have lots of experience with G10. Unfortunately it has taken 2 months to get a quote out of them and the machine is slower than the Brother and I don't really get a warm fuzzy from the company (only one demo machine in stock, 3 month wait from Germany and they want $900 to cut a sample from our material). Only good thing they had is a nice vacuum chuck that held the parts down well, even when going through on the profile (it used some type of a sacrificial membrane between the part and the chuck)

Talked to our Okuma rep and they don't have anything that is a total solution.

Earlier last fall I talked to AXYZ routers and it was another 2 month ordeal to get samples out of them and they were poor quality and 30 min each half (we are about 12 min on the Brother).

Do you guys have any ideas? Maybe a Haas router? Maybe there is a coolant filtration unit where I can use another Brother or Okuma mill?

B-Mathews · Feb 19, 2017

G-Auto said:
I need to cut knife handles out of G10 phenolic sheet on a production basis.

The handles are in halves, pretty complicated shapes with 3D milling. Not just the profile and a corner round.

I have made prototypes on our Brother S1000 but the dust from the G10 totally messed the coolant system up.

I looked at the Datron milling machines since they say they have lots of experience with G10. Unfortunately it has taken 2 months to get a quote out of them and the machine is slower than the Brother and I don't really get a warm fuzzy from the company (only one demo machine in stock, 3 month wait from Germany and they want $900 to cut a sample from our material). Only good thing they had is a nice vacuum chuck that held the parts down well, even when going through on the profile (it used some type of a sacrificial membrane between the part and the chuck)

Talked to our Okuma rep and they don't have anything that is a total solution.

Earlier last fall I talked to AXYZ routers and it was another 2 month ordeal to get samples out of them and they were poor quality and 30 min each half (we are about 12 min on the Brother).

Do you guys have any ideas? Maybe a Haas router? Maybe there is a coolant filtration unit where I can use another Brother or Okuma mill?

How many are you looking at a month? Are you open to subbing them out? I know of a couple shops that specialize in knife part. A few guys use them for their mid tech stuff around here. I hate working with G10 and is the last thing I would want in my CNCs myself. Totally get wanting to do it in-house, though. If you do them in house I would not cut them from sheet but I would have them cut into blanks and vacuum fixture them. If the moving I would do a first opp. on backside for a couple locating small blind pins and still vacuum fixture them. You may want to shoot Aaron Gough a pm as he is doing what you want to do and is a very nice forum memeber on PM. His machine is all dry and no coolant, though.

plutoniumsalmon · Feb 19, 2017

Hello.
AXYZ is not so good. Or at least the place that I know had one did not like it. The small Haas router (sr 100) is no longer produced. Have you looked at Onsrud Routers or Thermwood?

BROTHERFRANK · Feb 19, 2017

A coolant filtration system would be easy to rig up for the S1000 Brother. First, I would put two baskets, lined with some type of filter media, where the coolant exits the machine into the coolant tank. This will catch the bulk of the fines and chips. Then I would put a canister bag filter (Rosedale type) after the coolant pump and before the machine to further filter the coolant before it is reused in the cut. You can change the media in the baskets and the bag in the canister as necessary.

3t3d · Feb 20, 2017

The vacuum chuck works BECAUSE it is in a sheet.
Don't cut into blanks, and expect to hold against an aggressive tool path.

Total surface area is your only friend with vacuum holding.
Keep the sheet intact, until all the profiling is complete, and come back to gently separate the pieces ... last.

The best machine for G10 is in someone else's shop!

Hazzert · Feb 20, 2017

Most of my bread and butter work is in G10.

The best approach might be to cut the material into blanks and prep the cross pin holes and then fixture the blanks on expanding mandrels on those pin holes if possible. Holding a whole sheet can work, however due to the laid up nature of the material you can get a fair bit of wave to it which can't seal under vacuum.

We use quality double sided tape for a lot of our low production parts but it would be a hassle for you for any quantity and isn't the best choice for holding narrow pieces.

Winterfalke · Feb 20, 2017

How big are the pin holes? Can you tap them undersized, bolt the handle scales to a fixture from the backside, then drill out the threads after?

broke · Feb 20, 2017

I'm curious what brand you're making them for. We are making ours on our Okuma 560 with the door opened with a shop vac, all dry. It works really well and I never have issues with the chips getting where they shouldn't. I also only run about 10 sets at a time. I know for a fact that you can get an Okuma with advanced filtration but the cost is going to be prohibitive. When we were buying ours they mentioned doing special filtration for graphite applications. Makino was offering the same kind of service on the Ps95.

I cut mine into small blanks then thread mill from the bottom between pin holes, fixture from the bottom then machine the top and put pin holes in. It reduces the amount of material being removed in the machine by a huge amount and ensures the profile and pins are exactly where I need them to be.

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