Any thoughts on a 2000 Brother TC32A?

Volitan · Feb 9, 2018

We're looking for another machining center here, and we like the idea of a small vertical with pallet changer.

This one caught my eye: BROTHER MODEL TC32A CNC DRILL/TAP CENTER WITH PALLET CHANGER | eBay
And a video of it: BROTHER MODEL TC32A CNC DRILL/TAP CENTER WITH PALLET CHANGER - YouTube

There seems to be a lot of love for Brother here, so are there any known issues with this model? My job would fly me out to look at it so is there anything specific to look for on these?

The control is a Brother A-00, don't know anything about those. Do they come with a decent amount of memory? Can they be drip fed if not? Do they do HSM reasonably well?

We do a lot of small stainless castings and other small steel parts.

Thanks

Volitan · Feb 9, 2018

Sheesh almost forgot a big one, any one know about parts and service for a Brother in the northeast? We're on Long Island.

dstryr · Feb 9, 2018

"Spindle Taper HSK 40A "

Do not buy

2outof3 · Feb 9, 2018

dstryr said:
"Spindle Taper HSK 40A "

Do not buy

Yup..........

Volitan · Feb 9, 2018

Whats wrong with those? This is the first I've heard of their existence believe it or not. I read good things (written by people who sell them!)

We only have Cat 40 here for our Haas's, so we'll be buying holders anyway...

gkoenig · Feb 9, 2018

Volitan said:
Whats wrong with those? This is the first I've heard of their existence believe it or not. I read good things (written by people who sell them!)

We only have Cat 40 here for our Haas's, so we'll be buying holders anyway...

Go find out how much you'll spend filling the tool changer with HSK 40A tooling.

dstryr · Feb 9, 2018

Yamazen support is best in the industry fyi

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

riabma77 · Feb 9, 2018

gkoenig said:
Go find out how much you'll spend filling the tool changer with HSK 40A tooling.

Probably is more expensive, but with the hollow taper you don't have any 'tiny' retention knobs to break like 30 taper.

If HSK was available, I would had a Speedio in my floor since a long time ago.

2outof3 · Feb 9, 2018

Volitan said:
Whats wrong with those? This is the first I've heard of their existence believe it or not. I read good things (written by people who sell them!)

We only have Cat 40 here for our Haas's, so we'll be buying holders anyway...

There were very few HSK machines built. The spindles are expensive and most of those machines were worked hard. If you want a pallet machine, hold out for a 32Bn if you need the tool counts or a R2A if you can live with less tools.

Volitan · Feb 9, 2018

All good info, thanks!

A pallet machine is my preference they just want to increase our capacity a bit.
I have visions of subplates on each table with pinned fixtures where I can swap fixtures for whatever p/n I have to make, and get my operator off and running.
When the quirky old Mazak pallet changer at my last job worked it kicked ass. Even if it was just a vice on each pallet.

They have me getting pricing on new Speedio S500 and S700 as well so they can compare new vs used.

Volitan · Feb 9, 2018

I also priced a new Brother pallet changer in case my employer wishes to surprise me

DavidScott · Feb 9, 2018

riabma77 said:
Probably is more expensive, but with the hollow taper you don't have any 'tiny' retention knobs to break like 30 taper.

If HSK was available, I would had a Speedio in my floor since a long time ago.

I doubt the retention bar force on that machine would ever break a pull stud.

J Gilles · Feb 9, 2018

There is a TC32A with BT30 in Portland that has been up for a while.

CNC Tapping / Milling Center – Model TC-32A – Excellent Condition (Portland, OR) – MD Equipment Services

You can also find it on the local craigslist with a price.

riabma77 · Feb 9, 2018

DavidScott said:
I doubt the retention bar force on that machine would ever break a pull stud.

I agree. The drawbar force by itself won't break a retention knob.

I'm not an expert, but I'm guessing that the retention knob failure is caused by side forces and / or vibration, in some milling operations.

Drilling and tapping only, I doubt you ever will have a failure either.

I'm just saying that I will choose HSK instead BBT30. You wouldn't have to worry about long tools, end mills larger than 1/2", the cost of replace retention knobs, etc...

BROTHERFRANK · Feb 9, 2018

riabma77 said:
I agree. The drawbar force by itself won't break a retention knob.

I'm not an expert, but I'm guessing that the retention knob failure is caused by side forces and / or vibration, in some milling operations.

Drilling and tapping only, I doubt you ever will have a failure either.

I'm just saying that I will choose HSK instead BBT30. You wouldn't have to worry about long tools, end mills larger than 1/2", the cost of replace retention knobs, etc...

You are talking about HSK40A on the older brother machines which is not even close to the capability/rigidity of the the Brother BBT30 spindle connection. I have seen the HSK40A tools break in half right at the thin part of the taper where they clamp with very light loads. Granted I believe those holders were defective though they were top name brands.

Check out these cuts with Brother HiTorque Dual Contact BT30:

Milling test Brother SPEEDIO S1X1 high torque - YouTube

[brother]Machining example of the "S1X1" and "T-2".(steel) - YouTube

I have personally machined with the HSK40A machines and I could take much heavier cuts even with the standard Brother BT30 spindles.

Top that off with the huge selection of BT30 and Dual Contact BT30 holders available compared to HSK40A. I wouldn't touch the HSK40A with a ten foot pole. Retention knobs (literally millions in service) rarely fail and 99.999% that do are due to crashes.

BROTHERFRANK · Feb 9, 2018

Volitan said:
We're looking for another machining center here, and we like the idea of a small vertical with pallet changer.

This one caught my eye: BROTHER MODEL TC32A CNC DRILL/TAP CENTER WITH PALLET CHANGER | eBay
And a video of it: BROTHER MODEL TC32A CNC DRILL/TAP CENTER WITH PALLET CHANGER - YouTube

There seems to be a lot of love for Brother here, so are there any known issues with this model? My job would fly me out to look at it so is there anything specific to look for on these?

The control is a Brother A-00, don't know anything about those. Do they come with a decent amount of memory? Can they be drip fed if not? Do they do HSM reasonably well?

We do a lot of small stainless castings and other small steel parts.

Thanks

The 32A machines were fantastic but getting older now. I wouldn't recommend them as a first brother machine for someone. If a shop already has them and is experienced with repairs and maintenance they can be good for simpler work. They are fast and with the pallet changer can be very efficient. Of course Yamazen can support it but you may end up spending a lot of time and money getting it to a point of production worthiness. The memory on the older A00 control machines is about 90 kb for program size with about 300 kb for program storage. The pallet machines can not be ran with drip feeding using the pallet and older machines may not have that capability to begin with. I think you will find the new Speedios are a fantastic value compared to most used machines of this type. Just think, you get to run it for 17 years before it is 17 years old (read: hammered)! Of course you have much higher capabilities with the new or newer machines too. Pretty exciting to get new (or nice used) equipment in the shop. Good luck and keep bringing your questions.

gkoenig · Feb 9, 2018

riabma77 said:
If HSK was available, I would had a Speedio in my floor since a long time ago.

Breaking retention knobs isn't exactly common (though I know folks who've done it), but you do need to watch out on your speeds/feeds/engagements when doing heavy roughing. You can also put your heavy hitter tools on a more frequent replacement schedule and use Frank@Maritool's high strength studs.

For giggles, I looked into the Kitamura HX-250iG - a mini horizontal BT30 mill. HKS 40E is an option, along with a 30k RPM spindle... HSK40E tooling is absurdly priced compared to quality BBT30 tools; $450 vs. $150 for common ER holders. If Brother did make an HSK Speedio, the initial upcharge plus the extra tooling costs would pay for you to keep a backup BBT30 spindle on hand.

gkoenig · Feb 9, 2018

J Gilles said:
There is a TC32A with BT30 in Portland that has been up for a while.

CNC Tapping / Milling Center – Model TC-32A – Excellent Condition (Portland, OR) – MD Equipment Services

I *think* the two Brothers MD Equipment has listed are from Treske Machine here in Portland. Those are very well cared for machines that have been in-service at a very high-end outfit.

Vancbiker · Feb 9, 2018

gkoenig said:
I *think* the two Brothers MD Equipment has listed are from Treske Machine

They are ex-Treske.

fmari --MariTool- · Feb 10, 2018

I wonder why Brother stopped offering HSK spindle options. Definantely sturdier than BT30. Possibly the cost and complexity of maintaining both types of spindles in stock. 2 types of drawbars,spindles, tool changer fingers, etc etc.

If Brother or Fanuc ( or both) got on the HSK bandwagon that volume would justify me to start make those holders. Price would be inline with my dual contact BT30 tool holders, maybe 10% higher.

Any thoughts on a 2000 Brother TC32A?

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