Shizuoka CNC Turret Vertical Milling Machine

[outbackmatt]

I have a small fabrication shop, we are currently moving to a larger 50 x 75 commercial building and the extra space will allow for upgrading equipment. I'm looking for a milling machine for the primary use of production drilling.


What are your thoughts on this machine? IE brand quality, parts availabilty and overall value.

My other question is does it have a manual mode(for simple hole drilling) or do you have to program every move the machine makes?
Thanks

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Shizuoka-CN...694?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2a226d2ce6

 

[outbackmatt]

I must add that all our parts are currently drilled on drill presses. Looking for a more industrial method and also would be interested in a mill for the purpose of notching round tubing ends.
Can a basic machine such as a manual bridgeport be used effectively as a robust drill press? Industrial grade drill presses run in the price range of some used bridgeport mills and it would be a better value for us to get a milling machine. I have never used a mill before so want to make sure it is the right choice for us.

 

[outbackmatt]

This is a machine I am very interested in. No idea about the brand though.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Long-Chang-...467?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item27c332fa03

 

[rklopp]

With an admitted busted control, that Shizouka is worth its weight in scrap minus the cost to haul it to the scrap yard, which could easily total to a negative number.

 

[kpotter]

I have a shizouka just like the one in the pic. The controll is ancient mine was 1978 it worked for awhile but was difficult to use. I gave mine an electroectomey and now it is full manual. I love it the iron is awsome, you can still get one from shizouka in Japan they dont import them they are real expensive. They were never cnc that was added on in the US. They convert back real fast I had mine done in a few days. The beauty of these old cnc mills is they were tough to use so people didnt use them so they are usually mint, mine is like new.

 

[outbackmatt]

I have a shizouka just like the one in the pic. The controll is ancient mine was 1978 it worked for awhile but was difficult to use. I gave mine an electroectomey and now it is full manual. I love it the iron is awsome, you can still get one from shizouka in Japan they dont import them they are real expensive. They were never cnc that was added on in the US. They convert back real fast I had mine done in a few days. The beauty of these old cnc mills is they were tough to use so people didnt use them so they are usually mint, mine is like new.

I might offer 1200 and see what happens but the max I'd like to go while not knowing how much the conversion will cost is 1500.

Do you have a write up on how you converted yours? Do you still use the motors for power feed and what are you using as a DRO?

 

[kpotter]

I wouldnt convert it to cnc that is a big pain I would just use it as a manual mill. I dont have power feed on mine I just pulled the motors off and put handles on. The way the machine was converted they just used couplings to attach the motor. I removed the motor and the mount and put standard BP style handles on the thing. They came factory with ball screws. My machine had a tool changer and power on everything. I can put a power feed on it and will do so at some point. I have 5 other mills that I use along with this one so it is not a big deal. You could put a dro on it if you want but the dials are still on the machine and are very accurate.

 

[outbackmatt]

Having not used one I may be dreaming up a function for the machine, say the controller wasnt broken... does it have a CNC override where you can literally control the machine manually? I mean to say is there a feature where you can press a control button to power feed the x and y axis manually without having to program the machine to do it all on its own?

I wonder if the display on it can still be used as a DRO or no because the c broken?

 

[KIMFAB]

I also have the same machine that also came with the same broken control.

The bandit even in its working state is probably not worth much and is certainly not worth fixing.

I went with a Shadow control which was an almost bolt in replacement. Got about $3000 in the control.
Here is a quick summary.

http://www.kimfab.com/shiz/shiz.htm

Two grand for a busted control is a bit high tho. Also keep in mind that this is a heavy machine

 

[outbackmatt]

I also have the same machine that also came with the same broken control.

The bandit even in its working state is probably not worth much and is certainly not worth fixing.

I went with a Shadow control which was an almost bolt in replacement. Got about $3000 in the control.
Here is a quick summary.

http://www.kimfab.com/shiz/shiz.htm

Two grand for a busted control is a bit high tho. Also keep in mind that this is a heavy machine

Very cool. Way over my head!

How do you like the setup?

 

[KIMFAB]

The new control works fine, as stated it has a few things it doesn't do that the fancy machines will but for just plain work it's fine.
There is capability in the control for backlash compensation and servo tuning among other things.

It's plenty beefy for heavy cuts so you don't have to be shy with it.
If you are interested put it in jog mode and try moving the table in each direction to insure proper operation.
The servo amps and servos are a bit pricey.

Edit: forgot to mention that it holds lots of code and has the capability to load from an RS232 port.

 

[kpotter]

When I first got the mill I would use the jog buttons to move the table, it worked ok but was a pain. I learned some basic g code and was able to program it to do simple tool paths. the bandit controll only holds 28 lines of code and the minute you turn off the mill the program is lost so you need to do it again. When the controll finally died I didnt try and fix it I just took it all off and now have a great big heavy mill that cuts beautifully. It is like a giant BP. If I ever get another cnc it will be a VMC totally enclosed with tool changer and modern controll, and a big heafty payment every month.

 

[outbackmatt]

Ok I have to decide either upgrade the control or convert it manual. Are there any problems I would run into converting it back to manual? How is the Z axis operated? Kpotter is it difficult to find new handles for it? Where did you get handles from?
Would the broken control display still function as a DRO?

On the other hand I am very interested in upgrading the CNC control like Kimfab did. Just have to remember that I am an untrained monkey when it comes to CNC. lol Would this make a good machine to retrofit considering it already has the motors? Where can I get a new control for it?

THANKS!!!

 

[KIMFAB]

Kevin, do you still have the servos and amps? I might be interested for another project.

OOps spoke too soon. Thought matt had given up.
Outbackmatt if you are interested in the Shadow get hold of Len at:

http://www.shadowcnc.com/

I should mention that a good electronics background helps a lot in the conversion but it is doable and when done you will be ahead of the game in case of problems.

 

[kpotter]

Retrofitting is not that easy the parts are old and trying to get them to talk to modern parts is hard. It is easier to just pull all the stuff off and start over with parts that work together. I had the same thoughts as you but after talking to people who fix cnc for a living it was explained to me. It is a good deal as a manual mill not as a cnc. But if all you need is a light mill just get a BP. I got this mill because it was a heavy duty mill I do lots of hogging in steel. They are real heavy and very large they take up alot of floor space. The handles were purchased from mc master carr they have tons of them in all styles. I gave all the parts to a friend who does cnc repair for people and he put them on a BP cnc.

 

[outbackmatt]

I know the Bandit 1 is ancient, however, should I try to find one and just replace this control with another bandit ... did they work good in jog mode?

 

[KIMFAB]

No

Let me repeat that.

NO

The bandit is a severely outdated control using severely outdated technology with hardware that is expensive to fix.
Also replacing the control is harder than putting in a newer, better unit and swapping the cards will be problematic.

 

[Garwood]

I had one of those Shizzys with a toolchanger too. PITA to use, sold it without using it much at all.

You have a drill press right now that does the work you need? A drill press?

Jesus, get a BP type mill with a DRO. You use the mill for whatever you can, it beats the shit out of a drill press and is probably all you need to a notch a tube. Sounds like you don't need a CNC at all, just an upgrade from a drillpress.

If you're in business, if this is more than a hobby DO NOT WASTE YOUR TIME CONVERTING SOMETHING. A CNC conversion isn't a viable money making tool unless it's something huge/special like a planer mill or HBM.

If you buy a CNC mill get a VMC. Even the cheapest they pay you to haul it off hammered shit 1980's machine with 10,000,000,000 cut hours on it will blow the doors off that Shizzy.

Also, handles don't go on a CNC anything. I know the tiniest little bit about running these things compared to many, but know as soon as you get your programming training wheels off you don't want anything to do with handles.

Handles are a crutch. You can key in MDI as fast as your fingers move exactly what you want the machine to do without even thinking about it after a few months. If you can't, keep the drillpress.