Can't run with out cutting lube

4lowie · Nov 15, 2014

Hi everyone

I now have my CNC mill up and running, working great! 2.5kw so enough power, atleast 2000mm / min so plenty of speed!

A lot of the aluminium machine I've see dosen't use cutting lube, how come if I try and run without lube the cutter gets jambed up with swaf?

Is it the quality of the tooling?
Is it spindle speed?
or is it cutting speed?

I have noticed the videos I've seen are very hi speed cutting... Maybe I need to reduce the deepth of the cut and speed up the travel...

What do you think??
Thanks

Jeremy · Nov 15, 2014

Tried using a good stiff air blast right at the cutter? Don't want to be re-cutting chips...that's what'll stick them to the cutter.

4lowie · Nov 15, 2014

Cool, I'll try this method and see how we go... A lot cleaner than fluid spraying everywhere!

Thanks

HuFlungDung · Nov 15, 2014

You can't run as fast when cutting dry, because things get hot, and the chips themselves stick together and jam up the tool flutes. Full width cuts are bad for this happening.

Even if you don't use flood coolant, a misting unit will help a lot, or a MicroDrop lubricator also will work quite well. The MicroDrop dispenser uses a tiny amount of cutting oil blown onto the tool. About all I can say is wrong with it, is hot chips will produce a little bit of smoke, and, it will not totally cool the workpiece. Also, is a tad expensive for a new guy starting out.

PixMan · Nov 15, 2014

You may have been seeing videos of machine tools cutting alumin with MQL (minimum quantity lube) systems. With those the amount of lube applied is so tiny you wouldn't see it with all the chips flying.

shamanj · Nov 15, 2014

Dude with alloy, honestly, a good air blast WITH misting. (I use a soluble oil highly watered down) I had to experiment a crap tonne recently on new setups for parts and learned the following.
Some notes of importance RE tools also.
1: Do not cut aluminium with more then 2 flutes at any reasonable depth of cut in slotting.
2:Faster is better.
3: What is your spindle speed? If the HS Spindles like 24000 max out your feed.
4: Trochoidal is your friend
5: 3 flute cutters are great 10mm Dia and OVER only. Even 8mm don't have the clearance and 5083 gums up on them instantly.
6: Mist is great! I don't know what kind of air blast you have but I suggest this if its not included on your VMC/Router...
Electrical Magnetic Air Pump ACO 016, air pump 520w 450L/min-in Pumps from Industry & Business on Aliexpress.com | Alibaba Group
They are bad ass and I plumb my coolant into its air line. You can also buy cheap mister accessories from almost anywhere to plumb it in. Once I set mine up I can cut at 5000mm/min depending on feed rate and tool choice with no more stick

They draw law power and pump huge air without having to run a compressor and best of all they are really quiet once you plug in their air line

4lowie · Nov 16, 2014

Cheers mate, some good tips.
I'll get one of those air pumps for sure.
I can go to 24000RPM and 2000+ mm/min .

I've only got 2 flute cutters so good there.

I just started with about 1200mm/min travel and 12K spindle because thats what a feeds and speeds app said....

Thanks for your thoughts, I'll get an air blast and misting sorted then see how we go.

Dave

shamanj · Nov 16, 2014

I bought a 140L/min pump but wished I had splurged the extra 100 on a big ass one. Its next in my purchase line.
Even 240/350 l/min might have been a better choice but I simply linked you to the big ass one. Make sure you use a decent ID hose for it too.

Go to 24000 RPM, 2000mm/min will be fine at those rpm in aluminium. What Cutting tools are you using? Defs get carbide at those high RPM. NOT HSS.
Those spindles give shit all torque at less then full bore.
Especially drilling, you'll stall an 8mm drill bit easily. 24000RPM and get a split point stub drill (Cheap as)
The advantage of high speed spindles is you can feed fast with carbide with no chatter, whats your machine?

machtool · Nov 16, 2014

shamanj said:
whats your machine?

You blokes should declare you are talking about those aluiminium framed Chinese CNC routers. I'd hate to think you would be confusing guys with 24K Makino's, on the true end of the field, wasting time with garage talk.

4lowie said:
I now have my CNC mill up and running, working great! 2.5kw so enough power, atleast 2000mm / min so plenty of speed!

No disrespect, but isn't that something you paid about $4k for?

adama · Nov 16, 2014

You want to look for about a 1 hp vane pump, often used as material handling suction pumps too. They will only give you about 7psi tops, but qty is measured in cubic meters not liters of air.

I run a large diaphragm pump similar but different to your link on the Bridgeport for every day cutting. Then theres times when its not enough, i pull out my 1hp ghast vane pump. That moves so much air its ridiculous, but unlike the din of a compressor running or air coming out of a nozzel at 100psi, its not too bad noise wise. Had to drill out a locline nozzel to 8mm though to get the needed flow.

As to mist lube it sucks, you gotta go the MQL route, its amazing :-)

shamanj · Nov 16, 2014

Vane pump hey, I'll look into that. I don't mind my air pump though it makes pretty good pressure at the nozzle for chip clearing, clears pockets up to 150mm deep so far without too many issues.

No disrespect, but isn't that something you paid about $4k for?

I don't care, but the OP may feel disrespected. --- Though forum rules is not to post about cheap chinese machines.
OP- Check out home shop machinist etc. This forum is more for a full time manufacturing base.
I know a guy with a 3d printer and a hand plastic injection molding machine who has retired, employs 4 full time staff, is a global name and spent about 1000 bucks to get started. He is retired now and just lives off the income, infact he just bought a bridgeport for 250 pounds that was going to a scrapper! Amazing!

Anyhoo. I chose a High speed spindle in my setup because it worked for me, (My machine was a lot more then 4K though) kicking myself for not buying one with auto-tool changing ability. But i'm saving for it now.

4K just for a spindle is a lot of dough.

thedave · Nov 16, 2014

For a CNC router table the typical solution is a "dust shoe" and high powered shop vac. Even on the large industrial units. It also is a lot cleaner at the end of a job.

adama · Nov 16, 2014

shamanji, don't take the haters comments personally, 9 & 10 around here they have a has, your spindles a real 2.5Kw, theres has a 2Kw with a 25hp label on it :-) Equally they only have the little automated tool length P cool nozzel hass do. They don't understand the real term swarft removal and that flood collant means more than just 1, 1/4" jet from something with the pressure of a old mans bladder!

4lowie · Nov 17, 2014

My machine is "Home made" but its heavy duty. Built with steel box section so not cheap chinese....

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