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  1. #1
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    Wink Insert suggestion

    While cleaning out some old cabinets at work today I came across an old Iscar IEM. It has a 3/4" shank and a 1.5" cut diameter. It had some TPG inserts in it that are of no use and can't find any others in the shop. There is a few steel jobs that we may be able to use it on but have no idea what style inserts this will take or what d.o.c etc it would be capable of. Any suggestions would be appreciated.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails iscar.jpg  

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    Quote Originally Posted by GSPdude View Post
    While cleaning out some old cabinets at work today I came across an old Iscar IEM. It has a 3/4" shank and a 1.5" cut diameter. It had some TPG inserts in it that are of no use and can't find any others in the shop. There is a few steel jobs that we may be able to use it on but have no idea what style inserts this will take or what d.o.c etc it would be capable of. Any suggestions would be appreciated.
    TPGs????

    Throw the f'n thing in the trash... Its not even a high end TPG POS.. The inserts aren't even laying back..
    I'm not even sure Shar's sells garbage face mills like that anymore...

    Then the TPG thing.. 50's technology, shitty flat top inserts...

    False economy to even try to make any use out of it..

    I had some and sold some, and then I felt guilty and threw the rest away..

    Its tough sleeping at night while your conscious is thinking about some poor dude on
    his bench top grizzly (that he scrimped and saved to buy), and he's trying to take a
    .01 cut on some hot rolled gummy bear steel, and all you can hear is WHAP WHAP WHAP WHAP WHAP
    as his spindle bearings are pounded into sawdust.

    Right in the garbage, or even better yet, swing by the river on your way home and throw it
    in there so NOBODY can ever use it ever again.. You will sleep much better.

  3. #3
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    Guessing Bobw not so happy with the old TPG-322 zero by zero endmills.
    50s ???
    Bob

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    Lol thanks for your input. While we wouldn't attempt to use it on a bench top machine we were thinking if we could get any use out of it it would be on a Fryer MB-14R.

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    It was in the cabinet for a reason.

    It's not going to be worth a shit on steel.

    TPG inserts, whatever the IC. Measure the old insert. If it's a 3/8 IC and 1/8 thick it's a TPG 32x

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    Quote Originally Posted by jancollc View Post
    It was in the cabinet for a reason.

    It's not going to be worth a shit on steel.

    TPG inserts, whatever the IC. Measure the old insert. If it's a 3/8 IC and 1/8 thick it's a TPG 32x
    I thought maybe it was in there for a reason but I'm still a newbie and thought if we could get anything out of it that we could use it but it doesn't sound that way.

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    Quote Originally Posted by GSPdude View Post
    I thought maybe it was in there for a reason but I'm still a newbie and thought if we could get anything out of it that we could use it but it doesn't sound that way.
    If you need to knock down some aluminum on the Bridgeport you could use it. You can take .100 a pass with it- it will clatter a little bit, but it's okay, You'll get a good finish.

    I've got an old one that I use on my Haas for one job, just cause it's the perfect diameter. But it's pretty much a piece of crap.

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    I have one like it in 2". The only time I use it is for very light cuts when I want a nice finish on a part smaller than the cutter. One pass and no overlap marks.
    After about .01 depth,a little more with a 323 insert,it pounds and forget any depth square shoulder cut.

    Dave

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    Quote Originally Posted by jancollc View Post
    If you need to knock down some aluminum on the Bridgeport you could use it.

    You can take .100 a pass with it- it will clatter a little bit, but it's okay...
    What about SFM and FPT?

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    Quote Originally Posted by jancollc View Post
    It was in the cabinet for a reason.

    It's not going to be worth a shit on steel.

    TPG inserts, whatever the IC. Measure the old insert. If it's a 3/8 IC and 1/8 thick it's a TPG 32x
    How do you measure the IC of this triangle?
    And yes I run these these old POS things in 4140 up to mid 40's hard.
    Not nice, but they work if the insert retention is good.

    This is not a aluminum cutter, it will be much more happy in steel or cast.
    You can use it as so but inserts must be up-sharp and plenty of lube. It will chip-weld fast due to it's geometry.
    It will tend to load and unload as enough force pulls the weld from the face. This gives a very poopy finish.
    Bob

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    Quote Originally Posted by CarbideBob View Post
    How do you measure the IC of this triangle?
    Well, it's gonna be either 3/8 or 1/2. Shouldn't be that hard to figure out? Like hold it up against a gage pin and see if the IC matches?

    Quote Originally Posted by CarbideBob View Post
    And yes I run these these old POS things in 4140 up to mid 40's hard.
    Not nice, but they work if the insert retention is good.
    Bob
    But is TPG your "go to" for steel? There are a lot better geometries with chip breakers...

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    Quote Originally Posted by CarbideBob View Post
    Guessing Bobw not so happy with the old TPG-322 zero by zero endmills.
    50s ???
    Bob
    Not the 50's? 40's???

    Maybe they were designed in the 1600's for a treadle lathe?


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    Quote Originally Posted by Bobw View Post
    Right in the garbage, or even better yet, swing by the river on your way home and throw it
    in there so NOBODY can ever use it ever again.. You will sleep much better.
    I remember seeing a talk by Roy Underhill - the guy that has the woodworking show on PBS, where he uses hand-tools only for his woodworking projects. He was bragging about this one time they scored an "archeological find" of some old woodworking tools - axes or something - from the 1800's. They thought they had struck gold, until they went to use them. First swing..... OUCH! Turns out, they were garbage, and it was quite obvious why someone tossed them down the well...



    Quote Originally Posted by GSPdude View Post
    What about SFM and FPT?
    Seriously, throw this thing in the river like BobW suggested. I would rather use an old HSS corn-cobb rougher every day, and twice on Sunday than that POS, especially if we're talking about using it on a Bridgeport knee-mill. It will be easier on the machine, you can feed it faster, and it will achieve WAYYY more metal removal than any TPG cutter... Honestly, for roughing on a Bridgeport, there's not much that'll top a HSS corn-cobb rougher.

    No way in hell I'd put that thing in my CNC machine either. Maybe for skim facing cuts no bigger than the corner radius, and near full width - but only if it were quite literally the last tool in the shop...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bobw View Post
    TPGs????

    Throw the f'n thing in the trash... Its not even a high end TPG POS.. The inserts aren't even laying back..
    I'm not even sure Shar's sells garbage face mills like that anymore...

    Then the TPG thing.. 50's technology, shitty flat top inserts...

    False economy to even try to make any use out of it..

    I had some and sold some, and then I felt guilty and threw the rest away..

    Its tough sleeping at night while your conscious is thinking about some poor dude on
    his bench top grizzly (that he scrimped and saved to buy), and he's trying to take a
    .01 cut on some hot rolled gummy bear steel, and all you can hear is WHAP WHAP WHAP WHAP WHAP
    as his spindle bearings are pounded into sawdust.

    Right in the garbage, or even better yet, swing by the river on your way home and throw it
    in there so NOBODY can ever use it ever again.. You will sleep much better.

    10-4 good buddy

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    The TPG Milling Insert is an old geometry and there are much better options for higher metal removal rates but we still have guys that use these cutters on knee mills and they do work well at light DOCs. If it is a 1-1/2" x 3 Flute Cutter then it is most likely a TPCN32 insert which has an edge length of .650" and a thickness of 1/8" (double check this). Here is a link to this insert in a general purpose grade:
    TPCN32PPR NCM325 - ToolHIT

    Good starting parameters would be around 350 SFM and .002"-.003" CLPT for this cutter (depending on the material you are running). If you have any questions on this let me know.

    Hopefully this helps!

    Mike

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    Any TPG that is the right IC.. fits the pocket.. Grade is important to choose for the material..perhaps a C4 or higher for steel finishing..c-5 or higher for aluminum.. c-2 or better for cast iron with perhaps bump a negative land at the cutting edge...
    Make a good whacker end mill type cutter..running fast RPM.. watch and duck the red hot chips.. pull/turn insert when having a .020 wear land..think of how a machine gun sounds...

  19. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by michiganbuck View Post
    Any TPG that is the right IC.. fits the pocket.. Grade is important
    Another thing I don't like about TPGs.. They are also a common turning insert (though they shouldn't
    even exist), and a good turning grade can make for an absolutely brittle crappy milling grade.

  20. #18
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    C3 or C4 for aluminum. (C4 is rare)
    C5 and up for steel, these are the mixed grades with additives for steel cutting to prevent chip weld and thermal cracking.
    It is not a linear scale and there is a big dividing line between C4 and C5 where everything changes as you go from straight to mixed.
    A C5 is like a low C2 (soft and tough) but made for steel.
    Al will not like a C5 as these additives are detrimental in aluminum cutting and you are back up into high cobalt content.
    Bob

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    Thanks for all the replies wether for or against this particular tool. After all the input and talking to some other people I think it will just go back into hiding

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    Sell it to a hobbyist on Craigslist for $40, buy some pizza for your co-workers.

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