Lathes aren't just for round parts anyore

RJT · Feb 22, 2018

Not the most optimized tool paths, but it shows what is possible. Not my video, but we are doing this kind of stuff. I would transfer to my sub spindle and finish the second side, maybe use a drill mill to deburr all edges too. We are finding ways to use this machine we never thought of when we bought it (I have the identical machine with a sub spindle). 20 - 30 run parts like this are being done like this instead of in a machining center. The right software and fool proof posts can make it happen.

Doosan Lynx 22LY live tool milling - YouTube

Eric U · Feb 22, 2018

Here’s one I did last year. Same concept. Doosan bar fed lathe as a machining center - YouTube

Ox · Feb 22, 2018

This is one of my most "lightened" parts.
From 2" solid round barstock.

Been making non-rounds ever since I got a Y - back in 2002. It is better as far as fixturing, accuracy between features, and handling is concerned, but the spindles and finish aint the same.

Eric - I would spin the chuck in your cut-off the other way so that you are climbing. Or better yet - turn your saw around and cut down.

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Think Snow Eh!
Ox

Eric U · Feb 22, 2018

Ox said:
Eric - I would spin the chuck in your cut-off the other way so that you are climbing. Or better yet - turn your saw around and cut down.

Thanks Ox. Will try it the next time I run these parts.

cnctoolcat · Feb 22, 2018

I saw an article one time about Renishaw's factory in England.

Instead of using lathes for lathe work, they were mounting material blanks in Cat40/50 tool holders, and using machining centers to turn the probe bodies!

They had various turning tools mounted on the machine table, and with a tool carousel full of blanks, the machines were running unattended for long periods.

The higher spindle speeds available as standard on modern VMC's facilitated fast metal removal on the probe bodies, at high accuracy.

It was the most unique use of VMC's that I had ever seen!

ToolCat

litlerob1 · Feb 22, 2018

Ox said:
Been making non-rounds ever since I got a Y - back in 2002.

It is noteworthy, the video in the OP is without a Y. Not crazy new but...interesting. OTOH I almost wrote notworthy instead of "noteworthy" which would have changed the whole context eh

R

I just watched it again the Machine is an LY, so it has a Y, but it never comes off origin.

Ox · Feb 22, 2018

litlerob1 said:
It is noteworthy, the video in the OP is without a Y. Not crazy new but...interesting. OTOH I almost wrote notworthy instead of "noteworthy" which would have changed the whole context eh

R

I just watched it again the Machine is an LY, so it has a Y, but it never comes off origin.

Not sure which vid you were watching?

2:37

Not only can you see the tool move in Y, but you can see that it has a wedge, and not a true Y.

Sure, I was running C axis work prior to the Y, but you don't doo much more than flats and cross holes w/o a Y.

------------------------

Think Snow Eh!
Ox

Kaszub · Feb 22, 2018

RJT said:
Not the most optimized tool paths, but it shows what is possible. Not my video, but we are doing this kind of stuff. I would transfer to my sub spindle and finish the second side, maybe use a drill mill to deburr all edges too. We are finding ways to use this machine we never thought of when we bought it (I have the identical machine with a sub spindle). 20 - 30 run parts like this are being done like this instead of in a machining center. The right software and fool proof posts can make it happen.

Doosan Lynx 22LY live tool milling - YouTube

Where have you been for past 20 years?

garyhlucas · Feb 22, 2018

cnctoolcat said:
I saw an article one time about Renishaw's factory in England.

Instead of using lathes for lathe work, they were mounting material blanks in Cat40/50 tool holders, and using machining centers to turn the probe bodies!

They had various turning tools mounted on the machine table, and with a tool carousel full of blanks, the machines were running unattended for long periods.

The higher spindle speeds available as standard on modern VMC's facilitated fast metal removal on the probe bodies, at high accuracy.

It was the most unique use of VMC's that I had ever seen!

ToolCat

They also built an automated pallet changer that delivered both materials and tools to the machine, and removed finished parts as well.

We don’t have enough work for a cnc lathe, but we do have a 5” chuck on a Cat40 shank, an Aloris tool post on a table mounted bracket, and Cat40 Socket on the table for drills and boring bars. Tilt your head to right and you see a CNC chucker style lathe! We do 12” diameter gasket molds too on an arbor.

wheelieking71 · Feb 22, 2018

cnctoolcat said:
I saw an article one time about Renishaw's factory in England.

Instead of using lathes for lathe work, they were mounting material blanks in Cat40/50 tool holders, and using machining centers to turn the probe bodies!

They had various turning tools mounted on the machine table, and with a tool carousel full of blanks, the machines were running unattended for long periods.

The higher spindle speeds available as standard on modern VMC's facilitated fast metal removal on the probe bodies, at high accuracy.

It was the most unique use of VMC's that I had ever seen!

ToolCat

I've occasionally done some odd-ball, and one-off "turning" in the VMC. But, never thought about doing it in a production situation. I would love to see that!

Mechanola · Feb 23, 2018

When I look at the finished part I must say that it could be made faster as cast blank and finished with simpler apparatus. Almonst ridiculous how uneconomic CNC machining can become. Two thirds of the material turned into chips.

machtool · Feb 23, 2018

cnctoolcat said:
I saw an article one time about Renishaw's factory in England.

Greg

Possibly this? Turning On A Machining Center

Regards Phil.

adama · Feb 23, 2018

Mechanola said:
When I look at the finished part I must say that it could be made faster as cast blank and finished with simpler apparatus. Almonst ridiculous how uneconomic CNC machining can become. Two thirds of the material turned into chips.

Yeah but have you priced casting and looked at the time in it, generally i can machine 1-2 parts in the time it would even take to go talk to the casters, over here in the uk for any say fist sized or smaller part its generally a lot lot cheaper to just machine than cast in anything but large qty's. Castings then have to still be machined too.

Paying even £5 for a casting makes little sense to try and save time on a part that has less than £1 of material in it. The lead times on castings are generally weeks, materials avalible next day off the shelf. its just a different world these days.

SeymourDumore · Feb 23, 2018

Mechanola said:
When I look at the finished part I must say that it could be made faster as cast blank and finished with simpler apparatus. Almonst ridiculous how uneconomic CNC machining can become. Two thirds of the material turned into chips.

Thank you for chiming up before I had the guts to do so...
As far as I am concerned, Yes, that part can be done on a lathe, but for the sake of the almighty: WHY!!!

I mean ( unless of course you ain't got a machining center ) why on earth would you ever want to machine away that much material when you don't have to?
( and to boot, using C instead of Y when we all know you have it .... ??? )

And then, What are you gonna do with the cutoff tit?
File it away by hand or face it on the Bridgeport???

Obviously there was no show off of a subspindle pickoff and back facing, and yet, there WAS a completely useless motion of facing off the "raw" stock before
the endmill, which removed all resemblance of it.

Come on people, there are lathes and there are mills.
They both have their place, they both have their purpose.
and,
As far as I am concerned, that part in the OP should have never been introduced to a lathe.
Period.
The End.

gregormarwick · Feb 23, 2018

SeymourDumore said:
Thank you for chiming up before I had the guts to do so...
As far as I am concerned, Yes, that part can be done on a lathe, but for the sake of the almighty: WHY!!!

I mean ( unless of course you ain't got a machining center ) why on earth would you ever want to machine away that much material when you don't have to?
( and to boot, using C instead of Y when we all know you have it .... ??? )

And then, What are you gonna do with the cutoff tit?
File it away by hand or face it on the Bridgeport???

Obviously there was no show off of a subspindle pickoff and back facing, and yet, there WAS a completely useless motion of facing off the "raw" stock before
the endmill, which removed all resemblance of it.

Come on people, there are lathes and there are mills.
They both have their place, they both have their purpose.
and,
As far as I am concerned, that part in the OP should have never been introduced to a lathe.
Period.
The End.

What's the alternative in the machining centre? Sawn squares? Pieces of bar? Still going to require a second op.

Transfer to the sub in the lathe and op 2 is done in cycle.

The difference in lost material is pretty negligible. Aluminium is cheap. Labour is expensive.

Load up the bar magazine and go and do something else.
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SND · Feb 23, 2018

So, I guess most of you would say adding the Y-axis capability was worth the added cost?
I didn't think to ask how much more the Lynx with Y-axis is, but I got pricing on the 2-axis for now.
I don't currently really do any work that Y would be any use for, but perhaps it would come if I had it, not many buying plain 2-axis lathes anymore it seems.

ripperj · Feb 23, 2018

It’s it really a lathe anymore if the tool is turning in relation to the work?

The lathe has now by definition been converted.
As to whether it makes sense on any particular machine... well that probably depends a lot on what else(if anything) you have available.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

BSCustoms · Feb 23, 2018

wheelieking71 said:
I've occasionally done some odd-ball, and one-off "turning" in the VMC. But, never thought about doing it in a production situation. I would love to see that!

Check out Avantmfg on Instagram. He has pushed the envelope of running lathe parts in his spindle. He is even single point threading! pretty slick set up.

I followed his idea and made a gang block holder with multiple turning stations and drill/boring holders. It is nice to have 8k spindle for "lathe" parts.

aj · Feb 23, 2018

Ox said:
Sure, I was running C axis work prior to the Y, but you don't doo much more than flats and cross holes w/o a Y.

Really?

WT 15 Live Tooling - YouTube

RJT · Feb 23, 2018

Where have I been the last 20 years? Making quite a bit of money building custom tooling, metering pumps, and gages with CNC mills, CNC lathes, CNC sinker and wire EDM (actually for the last 46 years, the last 34 in business for myself). It's not like I don't know CNC, been doing it since 1974, the second year of my apprenticeship. Most of the time I don't make more of 5 of anything, so have not jumped on board with multi spindle y axis until recently. Starting to get more 20 - 30 piece orders so it makes sense to think this way. At 63 I'm still learning new tricks.
Progressive Tool @ MFG. INC. Greensboro, NC

Lathes aren't just for round parts anyore

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