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    Smile New Lathe Suggestions

    Hey practical machinists,
    I successfully purchased a Brother Speedio S700 following advise from this forum 2 years ago and it has been a really good machine and great experience having it as my first CNC. I am very satisfied with the built quality and performance and the Yukiwa 5ax rotary table has been great too. I purchased a Mori NLX2000SY lathe as our first lathe and it is now time to find a second one. We just got a big order of turning die casting AL parts and running these parts on the Mori would be silly plus the Mori is kinda busy. I'm thinking of investing a new lathe. The part is quite small 2.5 inch diameter and pretty short. It is a turning only part. I'm not trying to invest a machine only for this part, instead I'd like to have a machine that can be a good match with the Mori. I am debating about whether I should look for one with milling function or not.
    The Doosan Lynx is my first choice but the mill version one takes 4 months to be here so if I get the Doosan it would be a 2 axis Lynx which can be a good choice and good price.
    My Brother vendor has a Genos Okuma L200E-M in their show room for sale so this can be a good choice, too. The machine is about 50% more expensive than the regular Lynx. It has got milling function but power is only half of the Doosan.
    My third choice would be a Miyano BNC which is smaller than the two machines mentioned above, with milling function and price is in between the Doosan and the Okuma. Work envelope is limited and does not come with tail stock. It can be a fast machine and good for small parts.
    I'm more worried about the philosophy of the investment. Should I only get turning centers for my shop because 2 axis lathe are getting less competitive? Should I get the cheaper 2 axis lathe so I can have the machine paid off faster and if in the future I have parts for it that need to be drilled or milled I just put the parts on the CNC mill adding another operation?
    Please give me some suggestion on planning the shop! Thanks a lot!

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    Check out the Samsung SL15
    https://www.samsungmachinetools.com/

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    the okuma's they don't exaggerate. we are not talking haas power here.... what they say is what you get in my experience. no experience with doosan but look at more than hp, look at the torque/ power charts and the times of the ratings. They don't all use the same time output periods....I would not be afraid of any okuma.

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    Quote Originally Posted by WILLEO6709 View Post
    the okuma's they don't exaggerate. we are not talking haas power here.... what they say is what you get in my experience. no experience with doosan but look at more than hp, look at the torque/ power charts and the times of the ratings. They don't all use the same time output periods....I would not be afraid of any okuma.
    I think Okuma makes solid machines. What I'm worried about is that we have no knowledge on the OSP300 control at all. Will it be a steep learning curve as we are currently running Mitsubishi on the Mori? Fanuc should be pretty straight forward for any machinist.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jerry_tung View Post
    Hey practical machinists,
    I successfully purchased a Brother Speedio S700 following advise from this forum 2 years ago and it has been a really good machine and great experience having it as my first CNC. I am very satisfied with the built quality and performance and the Yukiwa 5ax rotary table has been great too. I purchased a Mori NLX2000SY lathe as our first lathe and it is now time to find a second one. We just got a big order of turning die casting AL parts and running these parts on the Mori would be silly plus the Mori is kinda busy. I'm thinking of investing a new lathe. The part is quite small 2.5 inch diameter and pretty short. It is a turning only part. I'm not trying to invest a machine only for this part, instead I'd like to have a machine that can be a good match with the Mori. I am debating about whether I should look for one with milling function or not.
    The Doosan Lynx is my first choice but the mill version one takes 4 months to be here so if I get the Doosan it would be a 2 axis Lynx which can be a good choice and good price.
    My Brother vendor has a Genos Okuma L200E-M in their show room for sale so this can be a good choice, too. The machine is about 50% more expensive than the regular Lynx. It has got milling function but power is only half of the Doosan.
    My third choice would be a Miyano BNC which is smaller than the two machines mentioned above, with milling function and price is in between the Doosan and the Okuma. Work envelope is limited and does not come with tail stock. It can be a fast machine and good for small parts.
    I'm more worried about the philosophy of the investment. Should I only get turning centers for my shop because 2 axis lathe are getting less competitive? Should I get the cheaper 2 axis lathe so I can have the machine paid off faster and if in the future I have parts for it that need to be drilled or milled I just put the parts on the CNC mill adding another operation?
    Please give me some suggestion on planning the shop! Thanks a lot!
    Sometime I swear these are posted by 2outof3 lol.

    Maybe check out MAZAK Primos line.

    They are smaller lathes but very very precise, and they are about $60K.

    They are made in Singapore, Control is Mazak FZ (CNC) based on Fanuc Oi (they claim "Unsurpassed ease of operation" ;-).

    (I think a lot of the time for smaller turned parts that higher tolerances are called for. (Not 100% on thermal compensation but is consistent with other MAZAK machines I would think)... Key thing about the Primos is small footprint, (lower-ish power consumption) and has really decent options for automation.

    Surprisingly accurate single part accuracy "Claimed" "High accuracy Roundness" 0.11 Micron, Surface finish Ra 0.058 micron, Rz 0.389 micron. [Depending on shop environment not sure how part to part accuracy stacks up over the course of the day with the Primos?].

    QUICK TURN PRIMOS 15 S (Singapore)

    QUICK TURN PRIMOS 1 S (Singapore)

    QUICK TURN PRIMOS 5 S (Singapore)

    Mazak QUICK TURN PRIMOS - YouTube

    ^^^This explains it better than I can.

    They only weigh about 4000 lbs (in some cases so you could move them about your shop to create a small cell with your Brother Speedio with Yukiwa 5 ax rotary or whatever you need in the future). I.e. very flexible.

    QUICK TURN PRIMOS 1 S+Quick Loader - YouTube
    ^^^This is kinda cute with overhead part loader.

    __________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ _________________________


    The ones in Singapore can be special ordered into the USA But otherwise this (Primos 100) IS offered in the USA QT-PRIMOS 1
    __________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ __________________________


    Don't know if the Brother M140X2 is of any interest to you, given that you allready have a NLX2000SY

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_8r-qh2VZfc

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r0co5i3B0Eo

    Does Dennis/Dtsryr have one of these? (I don't remember exactly, there was talk of presenting results maybe, or maybe I hallucinated that lol).Was wondering how he was getting on with it, I assume good. Was vaguely interested in the kinds of tolerances that the turning operations could theoretically and practically deliver.

    __________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ _________________________

    Didn't know the Miyano was so reasonably priced?

    __________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ _________________________

    Just to throw gasoline on the fire here... Mori NLX2000SY is about $200K+ depending on options, and not sure what a Speedio s700 works out at (not sure if that is second hand or new) + Yukiwa 5 axis unit. All really nice equipment. A MAZAK integrex J -200 or I-200 $250-$300K (with Sim 5 axis capability) for the latter and 60" between centers (if you need it), is also about the same price (with very advanced and easy to use control) Mitsubishi on back side. Maybe not so well suited to simpler parts at a higher production rates (maybe), but maybe more suitable for more complex parts. Which of course if you don't need or want sim-5axis capability then maybe MX140X2 is worth a serious look (given that you already bought the NLX2000SY ? Two axis lathes depends IMO if you need high tolerance work/ turning as IMO simple two axis lathes can be more accurate than the equivalent "blinged" out Y axis turret with driven tools, but the Mazak lathes and integrex can be very accurate for their "class" of machine.
    Last edited by cameraman; 12-16-2017 at 02:32 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by cameraman View Post
    Sometime I swear these are posted by 2outof3 lol.

    Maybe check out MAZAK Primos line.

    They are smaller lathes but very very precise, and they are about $60K.

    They are made in Singapore, Control is Mazak FZ (CNC) based on Fanuc Oi (they claim "Unsurpassed ease of operation" ;-).

    (I think a lot of the time for smaller turned parts that higher tolerances are called for. (Not 100% on thermal compensation but is consistent with other MAZAK machines I would think)... Key thing about the Primos is small footprint, (lower-ish power consumption) and has really decent options for automation.

    Surprisingly accurate single part accuracy "Claimed" "High accuracy Roundness" 0.11 Micron, Surface finish Ra 0.058 micron, Rz 0.389 micron. [Depending on shop environment not sure how part to part accuracy stacks up over the course of the day with the Primos?].

    QUICK TURN PRIMOS 15 S (Singapore)

    QUICK TURN PRIMOS 1 S (Singapore)

    QUICK TURN PRIMOS 5 S (Singapore)

    Mazak QUICK TURN PRIMOS - YouTube

    ^^^This explains it better than I can.

    They only weigh about 4000 lbs (in some cases so you could move them about your shop to create a small cell with your Brother Speedio with Yukiwa 5 ax rotary or whatever you need in the future). I.e. very flexible.

    QUICK TURN PRIMOS 1 S+Quick Loader - YouTube
    ^^^This is kinda cute with overhead part loader.

    __________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ _________________________


    The ones in Singapore can be special ordered into the USA But otherwise this (Primos 100) IS offered in the USA QT-PRIMOS 1
    __________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ __________________________


    Don't know if the Brother M140X2 is of any interest to you, given that you allready have a NLX2000SY

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_8r-qh2VZfc

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r0co5i3B0Eo

    Does Dennis/Dtsryr have one of these? (I don't remember exactly, there was talk of presenting results maybe, or maybe I hallucinated that lol).Was wondering how he was getting on with it, I assume good. Was vaguely interested in the kinds of tolerances that the turning operations could theoretically and practically deliver.

    __________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ _________________________

    Didn't know the Miyano was so reasonably priced?

    __________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ _________________________

    Just to throw gasoline on the fire here... Mori NLX2000SY is about $200K+ depending on options, and not sure what a Speedio s700 works out at (not sure if that is second hand or new) + Yukiwa 5 axis unit. All really nice equipment. A MAZAK integrex J -200 or I-200 $250-$300K (with Sim 5 axis capability) for the latter and 60" between centers (if you need it), is also about the same price (with very advanced and easy to use control) Mitsubishi on back side. Maybe not so well suited to simpler parts at a higher production rates (maybe), but maybe more suitable for more complex parts. Which of course if you don't need or want sim-5axis capability then maybe MX140X2 is worth a serious look (given that you already bought the NLX2000SY ? Two axis lathes depends IMO if you need high tolerance work/ turning as IMO simple two axis lathes can be more accurate than the equivalent "blinged" out Y axis turret with driven tools, but the Mazak lathes and integrex can be very accurate for their "class" of machine.
    WOW! cameraman, that was a ton of information. Thanks a lot! I will definitely talk to Mazak about my needs and see what they offer. A lot of ppl brought up how convenient the Mazatrol was and I surely believe it. The Celos on our Mori is very easy to use. Editing and posting programs takes no time. I don't think I will go wrong with Japanese brands already having 2 Japanese machines lol. Doosan seems reasonably good and well priced but can take more time to program if I set up a lot in the future.

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    Don't know what you have available locally with good support, but you may want to check out the Takisawa (Japan) turning centers if available. That is the line we support here with the Brother machines. Our clients find them to be solid performers (box ways) and a very good value.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BROTHERFRANK View Post
    Don't know what you have available locally with good support, but you may want to check out the Takisawa (Japan) turning centers if available. That is the line we support here with the Brother machines. Our clients find them to be solid performers (box ways) and a very good value.
    The machine tool business here is super competitive. The major tool suppliers all have pretty good support teams. Brands like Mazak, Doosan, Citizen, Tsugami, Hardinge, Makino, Fanuc, Takisawa, DMG MORI, etc., all have factories around and they have big service teams. Brands like Okuma and Matsuura have smaller markets but service shouldn't be a huge issue. I am more worried about the tool itself being a good reliable easy to use machine and can serve the company for long term.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jerry_tung View Post
    The machine tool business here is super competitive. The major tool suppliers all have pretty good support teams. Brands like Mazak, Doosan, Citizen, Tsugami, Hardinge, Makino, Fanuc, Takisawa, DMG MORI, etc., all have factories around and they have big service teams. Brands like Okuma and Matsuura have smaller markets but service shouldn't be a huge issue. I am more worried about the tool itself being a good reliable easy to use machine and can serve the company for long term.
    Jerry, you should definitely check out the Takisawa machines. Nice line up, hold size, great tool life, super reliable.... We had a number of users come up to us at Westec, the local tool show, saying they had zero or maybe one or two service calls on their Takisawa machines in 20 years! With Brother and Takisawa, our service guys primarily stay busy with new machine installs. Happy hunting. Please post updates when you can and please feel free to ask any questions you may have.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jerry_tung View Post
    The machine tool business here is super competitive. The major tool suppliers all have pretty good support teams. Brands like Mazak, Doosan, Citizen, Tsugami, Hardinge, Makino, Fanuc, Takisawa, DMG MORI, etc., all have factories around and they have big service teams. Brands like Okuma and Matsuura have smaller markets but service shouldn't be a huge issue. I am more worried about the tool itself being a good reliable easy to use machine and can serve the company for long term.
    Quote Originally Posted by jerry_tung View Post
    I am more worried about the tool itself being a good reliable easy to use machine and can serve the company for long term

    I think that's a really interesting question and point.

    It's really hard to say exactly as to how current models will fare lets say 15 years from now.

    Makino in their in depth and lengthy webinars really try to push the idea that your "old machine" is costing you money.

    MAZAK may have deliberately cut some corners on their machines (by design) to provide lowest total cost of ownership and replacement of irritating parts that could have been better engineered in the first place but otherwise really do offer lower total cost of ownership.

    Some if not a lot of Okuma machines really do seem to go on for ever. Spindle replacement is not cheap. Specific example here; New roll out of Genos M-560V 5ax. I'm 47 now (a young 47), but I'm pretty sure If I pull the trigger on that machine it will carry on doing it's job until I retire or die; whichever comes first lol (I suspect the two are closely related). That machine (Genos m460V-5ax) is "rated" for 10 years at two shifts/day (8 hours /shift before you have to replace linear bearings. The Genos m460v is based on the MU400V and 400 V II 5 axis platform (identical) that has a proven track record (for quite a number of years)... I'm never going to hit ten years + two shifts on that machine as we work in a different "Space" . But the machine (at least for my use) should remain pretty high tolerance and be reasonable efficient for many years to come (without any fuss). Also digitally although the OSP control may not be fastest control, strategies like "Super Nurbs" really do compensate for virtually any future "Computational" need. As for more typical use it's definitely not lacking.

    The one thing that sticks in my mind a bit is how machines that use a lot of fidgety electronics and slightly flakey controls (front side) + certain plastics (possibly use of fibre glass, elsewhere in a machine ) How those will fare and look and function and be serviceable ten to 15 years from now?

    I would think the Matsuura's would last a really long time too.


    It is hard to get away from the planned obsolesce business model vs a nearly "Forever" machine. 15 to 20 year time horizon?

    Most of the brands you have mentioned can take a real beating, that was one of the things that did impress me about the Takisawa, they are built like an unsinkable battleship.

    These are mainly impressions (from me),(not hard fact), and hard to know exactly how the newest, latest, and flashiest thing NOW will survive the rigors of shop life 15 years from now?

    @Jerry_tung, Out of interest did the Haas business model work for you guys (at least on paper) Was there anything that made you guys paass on Haas?

    Almost always as a "Financial" sanity check I run the numbers for a Haas based scheme just to compare ( I can't make it work, more to do with tolerance bands of some what we have to do , but I/we are a "small ship").. Some shops do really well with Haas. I think the value proposition is you save hundreds of thousands of $'s up front :-) .

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    Quote Originally Posted by cameraman View Post

    Surprisingly accurate single part accuracy "Claimed" "High accuracy Roundness" 0.11 Micron, Surface finish Ra 0.058 micron, Rz 0.389 micron. [Depending on shop environment not sure how part to part accuracy stacks up over the course of the day with the Primos?].
    Where are they claiming that ? Sounds a bit much to me....

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    Quote Originally Posted by AlexO View Post
    Where are they claiming that ? Sounds a bit much to me....
    I know what you mean but it's a function of short bed lathe and their spindle that uses Direct Drive... Basically it's a linear motor wrapped into a circle or ring (less vibration and machine harmonics), possible choice of higher tolerance "front" spindle bearings in light of that fact that the spindle does not have to endure heavier or longer parts. I.e. typically for larger lathes higher tolerance bearings could be used (with higher built in preloads) but they would not be practical as they would grind themselves into oblivion/NOT have a very useful or long service life. It's always a trade off no matter what.

    Here is where they "Claim"...

    Mazak QUICK TURN PRIMOS - YouTube


    I don't take such numbers literally but I know some smaller form factor lathes that lurk in similar "Tolerance" bands. And other variants of smaller lathes that hit smaller/better / tighter tolerance bands (but are of a special design and construction to achieve that).


    It's a complex subject and those "metrics" are ideal conditions and material (like brass) + technique. Also bear in mind these lathes don't for example swing a part as large as some of the Harding "Super Precision" lathes like a T series. One always has to take into account ideal vs. typical and factor accordingly (but also gives a glimpse of what could be possible given time, and attention and a lot of TLC + skill + technique + know how lol). These days for higher/ slightly more extreme tolerance bands I am somewhat resigned to grinding. Case of preferred random surface structure versus specific surface pattern from turning. I'm still a looooong way off from "Hard turning".

    Such metrics and measurements are an "Indication" of what the lathe might be capable of and again part to part accuracy may be a very different story.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BROTHERFRANK View Post
    Don't know what you have available locally with good support, but you may want to check out the Takisawa (Japan) turning centers if available. That is the line we support here with the Brother machines. Our clients find them to be solid performers (box ways) and a very good value.

    Any info on what's the deal between the Japan and Taiwan Takisawa? I checked a bit into them up here, looks like all we can get is the Taiwan stuff.
    Are they operating as 2 completely separate entities/supply chains or something, and there's just nobody selling the Japan stuff in Canada?

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    Quote Originally Posted by cameraman View Post
    I know what you mean but it's a function of short bed lathe and their spindle that uses Direct Drive...
    Thank you. Well, suppose I'll have to believe them as they must've accumulated a huge amount of progress over the past 20 years or so when last I looked into machines capable of really round turning. It's truly impressive. I can make a 50mm shaft rounder than that but the pain is really not worth the trouble, takes ages and hitting a specific size is plain hit and miss.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SND View Post
    Any info on what's the deal between the Japan and Taiwan Takisawa? I checked a bit into them up here, looks like all we can get is the Taiwan stuff.
    Are they operating as 2 completely separate entities/supply chains or something, and there's just nobody selling the Japan stuff in Canada?
    Where are you located in Canada? I will check with our USA Takisawa contacts tomorrow to see who can assist you. The two companies are different but related. The Taiwan machines are linear guide for the most part, and the FANUC controls are usually lower spec. The Japan machines are still built in Okayama with almost all box way, hand scraped construction. FANUC controls and motors tend to be latest models and higher end spec.. Also the Japan machines offer an extensive availability of gantry loader systems for nearly every model. I was in Okayama a year ago and saw the latest models being built. They were adding another factory on their property that was recently completed to increase capacity and efficiency.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BROTHERFRANK View Post
    Jerry, you should definitely check out the Takisawa machines. Nice line up, hold size, great tool life, super reliable.... We had a number of users come up to us at Westec, the local tool show, saying they had zero or maybe one or two service calls on their Takisawa machines in 20 years! With Brother and Takisawa, our service guys primarily stay busy with new machine installs. Happy hunting. Please post updates when you can and please feel free to ask any questions you may have.
    Frank, I have a friend who has 2 Takisawa lathe and both are performing pretty well. Most of the TAKISAWA machines sold in my area are either assembled in Taiwan or in Shanghai. I believe the box way machines are produced in Japan(not exactly sure) and can mean much longer lead time and more expensive. Just like we bought a Mori lathe made in their Nara factory not their Chinese plant. They only produce the CLX series in China and the good stuff is still made in Japan. I'm currently considering all options so thanks a lot for the suggestion!

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    cameraman, I have a really good friend who runs 17 Haas machining centers running 11/6 and they are actually pretty happy about the machines. They recently started investing in Brothers because they are little faster. Since Haas are imported from the other side of the biggest ocean, the price isn't as competitive. There are a lot of Apple production line fixture companies here that uses Haas and they are in pretty good business too. I'm sure these Haas users can be as good of a company running other machines be it Japanese or European or what not simply because the market is so competitive. Anyone who wants to be in the market needs to have good machines with good service. The higher end machine market is less competitive but on the Haas level, they have big competition. The biggest machine tool company in China is probably Mazak, they are the earliest to open factories. Their salesmen are the slowest to respond because they are the big brother.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jerry_tung View Post
    cameraman, I have a really good friend who runs 17 Haas machining centers running 11/6 and they are actually pretty happy about the machines. They recently started investing in Brothers because they are little faster. Since Haas are imported from the other side of the biggest ocean, the price isn't as competitive. There are a lot of Apple production line fixture companies here that uses Haas and they are in pretty good business too. I'm sure these Haas users can be as good of a company running other machines be it Japanese or European or what not simply because the market is so competitive. Anyone who wants to be in the market needs to have good machines with good service. The higher end machine market is less competitive but on the Haas level, they have big competition. The biggest machine tool company in China is probably Mazak, they are the earliest to open factories. Their salesmen are the slowest to respond because they are the big brother.
    Brother beats the competition with quicker cycle times and better surface finishing all within a small footprint - Yamazen

    ^^^^
    This runs along very much the lines you outline here.

    I have to be perfectly honest there are a lot / a number shops doing (on paper) very high end things, but looking behind the scenes they are running with things like Haas mini mills or larger, slower and older Haas machines, and I have definitely on accession wondered WHY are they not using brother machines (as they are fast/extremely productive machines, with decent surface finishes for the types of materials some of these folks mostly work with). I think in some of those cases it really comes down to the personality and mind-set of the company making the purchase decisions. . If there is a critical mass of employees that feel very comfortable with the Haas control then it's going to be hard to reverse that tendency. That's why new and small and promising shops would be a good target for Brother.

    Takisawa Machine Tool Co., Ltd.

    Takisawa seem to come on in leaps and bounds since I last looked.

    Didn't know they were doing the B axis mill turn machines? I wonder if that is part Taiwanese? No idea,

    TMT-Series|Takisawa Machine Tool Co., Ltd.

    TMX-Series|Takisawa Machine Tool Co., Ltd.


    Interesting as it seems that an incredible amount of the world's manufacturing is conducted in China and elsewhere in SE Asia, and hence seems like folks in China get (in some cases) really good service and response. For some of these companies their focus really is on China, (Even American companies that wave the Stars and Stripes (big time) and yet where I am in Rocky Mountain Region/ Colorado / Denver we seem to be geographically the furthest point from China (either physically or conceptually/for all practical purposes lol).

    __________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ ____________

    Kinda OT, AFAIK Brother is not carried by a specific vendor / reseller in Colorado? (Triad used to, but was acquired by DMG-Mori). No idea who carries them these days in the "Region" ?

    __________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ _____________________________

    Quote Originally Posted by jerry_tung View Post
    The biggest machine tool company in China is probably Mazak, they are the earliest to open factories. Their salesmen are the slowest to respond because they are the big brother

    As far as MAZAK goes... In my neck of the woods (western region USA) ; Yes sales inquiry's initially slow to respond. (I don't have a problem with that at all). What I tend to "Test" a little bit is continued follow through and depth of information provided, and in doing so for mapping out a 15 to 20 year strategy; I found MAZAK to be the most thorough and useful and actually friendly in a very consistent way... That's what I tend to look for is consistency. So in essence the deeper I chose or needed to dig on things the better I found MAZAK to be. Very helpful, very technical and very friendly (as I say). Having visited the Aerospace center in LA I got to meet some of the folks that will actually be the "Goto" guys to help me trouble shoot some of the likely problems I will encounter (especially the applications engineers) AND I got to see a lot of the complex and challenging parts they typically make and the problems they have in the past successfully solved... I was very impressed by that and also gave me confidence in their abilities to help solve real problems). I also got to hang out with key engineers fairly high up at MAZAK and that also gave me great confidence in their products, abilities and knowledge thereof. That's what I look out for is application related difficulties that I am likely to encounter and how MAZAK is able to offer genuine and useful support for some of these likely problems (as we are high mix, low volume/ R&D) + smaller production runs (right now, with an aim to definitely "Scale"). So that also made me explore different sim 5 axis CAM system than what we had been using (for compatibility), so at least the applications engineers are running the same software on the same machine as ME (for sim 5 axis mill turn). [That way we mitigate more typical hard to bridge gaps between CAD/CAM to Post and actual 5 axis machine trouble shooting (a hell of a lot can fall between that very specific gap)].. Hence Switching to Esprit and other related products. Overall I get or got the best "Vibe" from MAZAK west coast (and locally too/Denver). Overall given our applications we are probably much more patient and fault tolerant of a machine being down for a few weeks (if something untoward happens and we need to wait for a very specific tech; MAZAK are improving things in that area).We usually have a million other things to do especially on the software development/metrology front, so even if a machine is down for a while we are not pushing brooms around waiting for a tech to turn up... We have plenty else that needs to be done.]. Having said that I really do like the sales folks at Okuma and also DMG-Mori (really great folks) and Monkton's too :-) , I wish one day we could have sales people as good as they are! Outstanding!
    Last edited by cameraman; 12-18-2017 at 02:54 PM.

  23. #19
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    Mazak and Takisawa are good options. I would now be hesitant to get another Okuma, huge debacle with months of downtime on a new GENOS here. OSP300 is awesome, but if you want Okuma I'd recommend a non-GENOS model (these are belt-driven main spindle, built in Taiwan).

    Now that the issues are sorted with it, I have peace of mind... it is definitely Okuma-built quality throughout. But I wouldn't risk buying another GENOS, no way.

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    Update:
    I talked to Mazak and they have a lead time of 120 to 180 days even with made in China machines. Apparently they have customers lined up wanting to give them money. I think that's because Mazak makes good machines for good prices but my customer wants the project getting started sooner than that.
    The quote for the Miyano BNC42 is 62k USD with 5in chuck and chip conveyor. (6000rpm 5.5kw and hydraulic turret with milling)
    The quote for the Doosan Lynx is 44k USD with 6in chuck and tail stock.(6000rpm 11kw and servo turret)
    Customer has enough work to fill up 2 lathe 24/5 which means I may consider getting both. Run the Lynx only for this job only and use the Miyano for small mill turn parts if there's excess time.
    The Okuma L200E-M on the other hand is 74k which is more expensive and it has an 8in chuck and 5.5kw which is kinda slow. The chuck seems to be a lump for such a small motor. And also the axes drive motors are belt driven. Plus @apoc_101 metioned potential problems with Genos lathe.
    I still haven't made the decisions yet but will soon put the order(s) down.

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