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Thread: Online CNC Speed-Feed Calculator

  1. #1
    zero_divide's Avatar
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    Default Online CNC Speed-Feed Calculator

    Hello. This is my first post here, so i ll be short.

    I created an online CNC Calculator for my self.
    And now would like to see what you guys are thinking.

    The idea was to not make any money. The project is and will remain free for all.
    I just needed a reliable tool to balance my cuts.
    And then i wanted to make this tool give the most accurate results.

    Anyway check it out here:
    FSWizard - FREE Advanced Machinist's Calculator

    Please tell me what you think of the idea.

  2. #2
    bevinp is offline Plastic
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by zero_divide View Post
    Please tell me what you think of the idea.
    Looks good. My suggestions are:
    1. Label DOC as radial depth of cut
    2. Label WOC as axial depth of cut.
    3. Expand the acronyms on the results window. Plenty of room.
    4. What does Chip thinning mean? Say so..the units, etc.
    5. What is the calculation of max deflection based upon... ultimate strength or what. Say so.
    6. What does the Chip Thinning calculation mean? Say so.
    7. What does the Chatter calculation mean? Say so and reduce the number of decimal places.
    8. What does Max Torque mean? Say so.
    9. Why list Indexed end mill as a separate tool type? Isn't End mill, Diam and Tool material enough discrimination?
    10. Explain what Effective diam means.

    As I said it looks good as a beta release. It does need a Help feature that explains the terms, variables, and decision criteria that are used.

    Well done.
    Bevin

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    zero_divide's Avatar
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    Thanks for the input. Having spent so mny hours on it, feels everything is self explanatory.

    1-2) WOC/DOC acronyms are explained with popups, but eah i better change it.

    3)I was just trying to make everything re-sizable for mobile devices. the window seems a bit cluttered to me, but i ll try to add some inline help for each field.

    4) Chip thinning is a factor by which chip load has been increased from the chart value. Depends on cutter engagement.

    5)Torque an Deflection show how much force is applied to the cutter, and how much it subsequently bends.
    Max Torque and Max Deflection just show how much cutter can take before it breaks. All results are based on math models, and experimental data.

    6) Indexed mill is a separate tool type because: Tip material is usually carbide, and body material is steel. All this should affect the way cutter behaves.

    7)Chatter calculation is in alpha state. It should show natural frequency of the cutter.
    All the the complex math involved is not done yet. Still working on it.

    8)Effective diameter is for radius nosed tools. shows how much of a tip in in contact with the work piece. This also goes in to chip thinning calculation.

    TY for valuable input. I will try to make it work better and clearer.
    BTW:i physically tested 30% of materials there. and even though sometimes speed/feed values seemed crazy, Never broke any cutters. Just gotta make sure you don't try using a tool designed for aluminum on steel
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    torinwalker is offline Plastic
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    Default Deflection is a little wonky

    Quote Originally Posted by zero_divide View Post
    Thanks for the input. Having spent so mny hours on it, feels everything is self explanatory.
    ... <snip>
    Nice calculator. I am working on one myself in Excel, but I'm doing it simply to have all the calculations in one place and so I can see these calculations in the manner I wish to view them. Yours looks very similar to what I'm trying to achieve.

    I've been comparing notes between your program and CNCCookbook's GWizard calculator. Try feeding in these values:

    0.75 diameter
    carbide
    2-flute
    ballnose endmill
    4.5" length (yes, I'm making moulds)
    DOC .125
    WOC 0.5
    RPM 4000
    Feed 48
    SFM 585
    Chipload 0.006

    With these parameters, I get a deflection of 0.0009" in GWizard.
    In your program, I get something like 0.01" which I suspect would break the cutter.

    Any idea why there's such a discrepancy? Care to talk about it? I can give you some info you might find useful.

    I'm located in Toronto, so PM me with a contact number.


    Torin...

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    I suspect you were calculating for T6061 aluminum.
    The result area on my calculator also shows maximum deflection the cutter will be able to take.

    with theese values i get Feed 34.0 IPM and deflection of 0.026in
    Maximum Breakeage deflection for carbide cutter of that length is 0.0367in. (Those are tested with variety of cabide grades and averaged out. MAY be bigger or smaller by about 10%)

    If i go 140% for feedrate to get 48ipm i get deflection of 0.0363" which is petty close to breaking point.

    My models use physical formulas to predict deflection and breakage.
    Dunno about G-Wizard, but think about it: You are cutting 1/8 deep at 75% radial and all you get is 0.0009"???????????????? Plus in G-Wizard deflection rarely goes over like 0.005" cough-lies-cough.

    Any way. deflection models i am using now do not yet take into account corner radius of the cutter. The forces involved are quite complex.

    If you have some physical data on chatter and deflection and what not, i would love to see it.

    BTW: i am also making moulds. And deflection values in what i am doing seem to match predicted ones

    my ma1l is cnc at zero-divide.net

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    goooose is offline Aluminum
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    Ill be the first to say thanks for doing this. Your off to having something really good here. Keep improving it, keep it free and you'll have a winner. Make it into an app....get some small advertising in it...put all the rest out of business.
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    Thanks.
    A lil update: drilling is more fine tuned now.

    Because i broke my first drill in a 55RC hardox plate. Learned the hard way that 0 degree helix drills have higher torque and thrust values but less strong than regular 15 degree ones.
    Now works fine.

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    CBlair is online now Diamond
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    Wow... 0.2 dia hss drill at 250 sfm and .004 ipr and you get a feed of 42ipm** That is a bit much I fear.

    Charles

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    Quote Originally Posted by CBlair View Post
    Wow... 0.2 dia hss drill at 250 sfm and .004 ipr and you get a feed of 42ipm** That is a bit much I fear.

    Charles
    Material:AL6061
    Drill:0.2 Dia, HSS 30Deg helix (Hi-Helix)

    SFM:250f/min
    RPM:4777
    APT:0.00445in/rev
    Feed:42.49in/min
    MRR: 1.3in^3/min
    HP: 0.3
    Torque: 3.9in-lb
    Max Torque: 8.3in-lb

    The result is totally in line with Helios, OSG and DORMER recomendations.
    You just have to use judjment and use peck suitable for your application.
    And limix max RPM for long drills

    I constantly run my 6"L 30Deg .218Dia Dormer drills at 2300RPM and 20IPM on Aluminum
    This actually gives the same chipload as calulated. I only reduce max RPM so that drill doesnt snap B/C of a runout. and i also peck every 3/8.
    I am drilling through 200Feet of material between drill resharpenings thats more that 1200 two inch deep holes.

    Keep fearing or try it

    BTW its not my fault if someone can not reshapen their drills correctly.

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    Just an update:
    I am now setting up/testing user tool library for my calculator.
    Any registered user will be able to create and save his own tools. It is very helpful. As admin i've been using it for a week and it saves alot of time on recalculating common tools i use

    Also after enough data is collected users would get suggestions based on what other people are running similar tools at.

    I know quite a few people visiting the web page whom here.....

    So i'd like to know what you think.
    Would people have beef with others looking at their calculations?
    Would it be better if the author's name and comment was hidden?
    Should there be an option to "opt out"?

    Or is it best just to make all User Libraries private and only use analyzed data to improve results?

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    gundog is offline Aluminum
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    I tried it for a .125 3 flute mill bit in 6061 4000 rpm and it is way less feed (5.22 IPM)than my other calculators the APT I am guessing is chip load? I use .0015 - .002 and your calculator APT is only .00043 when I use that chip load in my other calculator I get the same as your but why so thin on the chip load?

    Thanks Mike

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    Quote Originally Posted by gundog View Post
    I tried it for a .125 3 flute mill bit in 6061 4000 rpm and it is way less feed (5.22 IPM)than my other calculators the APT I am guessing is chip load? I use .0015 - .002 and your calculator APT is only .00043 when I use that chip load in my other calculator I get the same as your but why so thin on the chip load?

    Thanks Mike
    Yeah i know smaller end mills can take huge chiploads compared to their diameter at expence of poorer surfcae finish
    If you go at 300% on feed there you will see that that 1/8EM in not even close to breaking.
    i ran a 2Flute .5"long 1/8EM a day ago at .001 chipload and when slotting 0.0625 surface looks like crap.

    Honestly i dont believe it would handle 0.002 chipload anyway.

    It is all about how long your end mill and flute are. And how deep you put it into the cut.

    Soo... i dont know....

    What are your parameters? DOC WOC Length ?

    PS: Hanita in its handbook recommends 0.0005" chipload for 1/8 2FL EM when slotting at 0.0625 Depth on aluminum....
    I normally do 0.001" so is my calculator showing at 150% feed (heavy roughing level).
    So there is my data, what is yours?

    PPPS: Did some tests The above mentioned 1/8 EM broke at 0.004" chipload per tooth!! Righth around where predicted by the calculator though. The surface finish became noticably bad at around 0.002"
    I guess i DO EAT MY WORDS. As well as pretty much all literature i've read so far.

    Thanks for bringing it up now i have to change some feed tables...

  13. #13
    gundog is offline Aluminum
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    Sorry if my post came off wrong. I am not an experienced machinist and I am in the learning phase for machining aluminum. I asked the question because I did not know the answer. The calculator I use is very basic and free Whitney Tool I Speed and Feed Calculator I usually use 300 SFM for aluminum but when I did it seemed too fast. Your calculator seems much better than what I have been doing but I was surprised at the result I got compared to the calculator I usually use. The simple calculator I use does not seem to take into account the flex of the tool and the smaller flute size. It seems to work fine if the tool manufacturer gives a recommended chip load.

    I use the simple calculator from Whitney on my plastic machining with my router table and I use Onsrud bits they give recommended chip loads and it comes out great.

    I have started making some parts from aluminum and doing a .125 slot .250 deep and .505 long I did this at 3300 RPM and a 6 IPM feed .050 deep per pass 2 flute EM. Surface quality for this slot is not important it is not a precision fit making the slot as fast as possible with my limited 4000 RPM spindle without breaking bits or premature wear is my goal.

    I am not trying to hijack your post about your calculator I made a post on this subject a few days ago I just wanted to explain myself. Keep up the good work on your calculator it looks like a great tool and I have bookmarked the page.

    Mike

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    Oh c'mon.

    I was actually glad you brought it up.
    I did some tests and figured that chipload of up to 0.002 for 1/8EM is actually safe

    Apparently most manufacturers give chipload differently for smaller diameters of the tool.

    IE: for bigger end mills i think the standard stickout is 2.5 Diameters.
    For smaller end mills they give smaller chiplad because their standard gage length is more than 5 diameters.

    Long story short, you cant trust manufacturer for s**t: they dont specify exact cutting conditions.
    As a result i've updated chiploads for tools under 0.5 inch in dia. Now feeds are a bit more aggressive.

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    Hello guys.
    Just an update for those of you who are using my online calculator.

    I have developed a stand-alone version for Windows XP and latest.
    Feel free to to test it out. Again there are no ads, nagging or blackmailing everything is free.
    It also does not require or use internet connection in any way.

    I would also love to hear some feedback if you care.
    I my self find the results it is giving out very close to optimal.

    FSWizard Standalone
    Laurentian and Keegster like this.

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    When calculating a drill bit, a standard off the shelf jobbers drill, do you define the number of flutes as 2? I've seen some calculators wanting to define the drill as 1 flute.

    Dave

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    Quote Originally Posted by SchneiderMachine View Post
    When calculating a drill bit, a standard off the shelf jobbers drill, do you define the number of flutes as 2? I've seen some calculators wanting to define the drill as 1 flute.

    Dave
    If i defined a standard 2 flute drill as a 1 flute..... than what would we use for 3 flute drills?

    Nope it requires the actual number of teeth. Even for reamers.

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    KMoffett is offline Aluminum
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    Quote Originally Posted by zero_divide View Post
    Hello guys.
    Just an update for those of you who are using my online calculator.

    I have developed a stand-alone version for Windows XP and latest.
    Feel free to to test it out. Again there are no ads, nagging or blackmailing everything is free.
    It also does not require or use internet connection in any way.

    I would also love to hear some feedback if you care.
    I my self find the results it is giving out very close to optimal.

    FSWizard Standalone
    I get an invalid archive file error when trying to open the ZIP file with Winzip in Windows-7/32bit.

    Ken

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    Quote Originally Posted by KMoffett View Post
    I get an invalid archive file error when trying to open the ZIP file with Winzip in Windows-7/32bit.

    Ken
    I have no idea why it doesnt work for you....
    Have you tried to re-download the file??
    I have just checked and everything is working...

    EDIT: Seems like sometimes this problem happens when the archive is created in 64 bit version of effin Windows.
    I have just reuploaded the file so download it again.

    Thanks for bringing this up. Please come back if something doesnt work for you again.

    http://zero-divide.net/index.php?page=FSWizard_SA

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    KMoffett is offline Aluminum
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    Still no luck. This is what I'm getting when I try to open with Winzip

    Ken
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails ziperror.jpg  

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