New FP2 'Active' owner down under

PeterA · Feb 6, 2014

Hi guys long time reader here just letting you know I have joined the Deckel Club ....Deckel FP2 'Active' delivered to my shed in Melbourne from Sydney...however some poor handling during shipping sees me the new owner of a damaged machine.

Serial numbers indicate it is a 1981 model..

As can be seen the DRO has suffered damage wires connecting it to control box below are severed..

I will post more pics about this machine but was wondering if anyone could point me to where I might source relevant operating manual /parts lists etc..
as I have no such documentation from thte previous owner...

I will be needing these as it seems that the same 'accident' saw the Z axis and X axis indicating wobble when using the handwheels..

Any help would be appreciated there aren't many of these in Australia and I hope to get this beautiful machine back to top working order

Cheers
Pete

Martin P · Feb 6, 2014

Have fun with it!
I find it very curious that it has an Engelhardt machinery dealer sticker. That guy is not cheap and how did it end up down-under?
The DRO is not original anyway. What munufacturer is that? Did you check the "active" function before you bought it? Some of those aftermarket DRO's also did "Active", but most not. I have some Elesta Visulesta IV DRO's that would do "active" if they'd be equipped with that option. Correct Heidenhain boxes are attainable. I bought a spare on EBay reasonably.

TNB · Feb 6, 2014

PeterA & Martin

The DRO on the machine is a Visel Elettronica unit.

VISEL ELETTRONICA

It definitely seems to have the "active" socket at the upper left corner of its back.
It's been discussed here before :

http://www.practicalmachinist.com/vb/newreply.php?do=newreply&p=2221048

Now may be correct Heidenhain boxes are attainable, but only once in a while.
The rest ot the time, they fetch rather high prices and Franz is in ambush.

Peter from Holland · Feb 6, 2014

Yes I have one of those too So if you want a spare you can send me a PM

I checked for their prices but TNB pointed out to me that a unit from FPS was about the same price and looks exactly like the original

Peter from holland

PeterA · Feb 6, 2014

Interesting comments gentlemen.

I had a machine technician inspecting today. Two lead screws bent but the good news is NC/DRO is fixable nothing damaged inside...

as for lead screws I will send an email to Mr Singer to enquire about parts - I note they are a td slow in responding to email -any suggestions? Should I call direct?

Otherwise I will just send these to a leasdscrew specialist in Melbourne and have new ones manufactured...

Cheers
Pete

TNB · Feb 7, 2014

PeterA said:
Interesting comments gentlemen.

I had a machine technician inspecting today. Two lead screws bent but the good news is NC/DRO is fixable nothing damaged inside...

as for lead screws I will send an email to Mr Singer to enquire about parts - I note they are a td slow in responding to email -any suggestions? Should I call direct?

Otherwise I will just send these to a leasdscrew specialist in Melbourne and have new ones manufactured...

Cheers
Pete

Peter

I can see how the end of the x axis leadscrew would have been bent in a shipping woes, but wich is the other one that was damaged ?
It seems to me that it would require very particular conditions for the z or y leadscrew to be bent without any other major damage.
In numerous case, what is bent can be straighten back without too much hassle.

If the trucker insurrance company is willing to pay for new leadscrew, then no problem, but otherwise you may try to repair yours fisrt

PeterA · Feb 7, 2014

TNB said:
Peter

I can see how the end of the x axis leadscrew would have been bent in a shipping woes, but wich is the other one that was damaged ?
It seems to me that it would require very particular conditions for the z or y leadscrew to be bent without any other major damage.
In numerous case, what is bent can be straighten back without too much hassle.

If the trucker insurrance company is willing to pay for new leadscrew, then no problem, but otherwise you may try to repair yours fisrt

Hi TNB,

There are three lead screws on side of the table on below manages the table moving up and down Z axis which is also powered - this 'appears undamaged on forst inspection

Next up is the middle handle and screw assembly which manages the X axis left to right movement of table if you like - this indicates slight wobble when used in manual mode and is the assembly closest to NC/DRO assembly

Finally there is a handle which manages the vertical head movement back and forth further up - this is directly in line with top of NC/DRO and evidences most severe damage

You are correct that one can repair these screws - but they never operate as smoothly as they should - serviceable yes - perfect no.

The damages will be handled by transporter insurance - still a shame that such a machine has had to suffer such damage ...

If you look carefully you cansee the broken bottom of teh pallet where the machine was dropped and onto something else

The second machine on the truck pictured was (thankfully) delivered safe and sound ....

ballen · Feb 7, 2014

Hi Peter,

PeterA said:
As for lead screws I will send an email to Mr Singer to enquire about parts - I note they are a tad slow in responding to email - any suggestions? Should I call direct?

I have had some (very positive) interactions with Franz Singer and his colleagues during the past weeks. I live in northern Germany but am in Munich this week, so I went by there two days ago to pick up some parts.

My experience is that they only read the emails in the afternoon, and then answer them if they have time, which they often do not. So what Franz has told me is that if I need something, please just call.

My advice is (1) send them an email with the model and serial number info from your machine, and a list of the parts that you need. (2) Wait an hour or two and then call them, and ask for a price. At that point, they'll probably look at your email and you can get an answer on the phone (or offer to call them back after ten minutes).

Cheers,
Bruce

AlfaGTA · Feb 7, 2014

PeterA said:
Finally there is a handle which manages the vertical head movement back and forth further up - this is directly in line with top of NC/DRO and evidences most severe damage

Peter:
The upper handle is not a screw. It is a shaft with bevel gear that rotates the nut on the screw ("Y" axis lead screw does not rotate, the nut turns to move the screw/axis).....If the handle wobbles when rotated it is just a bent shaft....or hand wheel.
Most likely no damage to the lead screw.....

Re the photo of the machine on the truck....Terrible way to tie it down. Stupid lazy ass trucker ought to be flogged! Sorry about your troubles. The use of the "Active" part of the machine will be unique to that control box...suspect it is somewhat different
from the Heidenhain TNC 112 or 113.
The operation and parts of the machine however will be the same as all last gen FP2's with or without the "Active" setup.
"Wrench" who posts here has a fine DVD chuck full of user and parts info that covers most Deckel manual mills. Suggest you contact him for a copy.

Cheers Ross

TNB · Feb 7, 2014

AlfaGTA said:
Peter:
The upper handle is not a screw. It is a shaft with bevel gear that rotates the nut on the screw ("Y" axis lead screw does not rotate, the nut turns to move the screw/axis).....If the handle wobbles when rotated it is just a bent shaft....or hand wheel.
Most likely no damage to the lead screw.....

In any case, make sure to carefully check the bevel gears that drive the y-screw itself. The chances that they were damaged are rather low but these gears have a very specific ratio of 1,6 and you won't find replacement parts off the shelf (translate : $$$$$).

PeterA · Feb 7, 2014

Thanks Ballen - sounds like a sensible approach!

All the best
Pete

PeterA · Feb 7, 2014

Thanks AlfaGTA - I have no manual or parts list to refer to - so flying totally 'blind' here - very useful information.

All the best
Pete

ballen · Feb 10, 2014

PeterA said:
Thanks AlfaGTA - I have no manual or parts list to refer to - so flying totally 'blind' here - very useful information.

Peter, you can find some manuals online here:

https://skydrive.live.com/?cid=547fe296ecfd561f&sc=documents&id=547FE296ECFD561F!865

Cheers,
Bruce

PeterA · Feb 21, 2014

Thanks Bruce - a pity the link has no FP2 manuals ..

Cheers anyway
Pete

Gentlemen Lathes UK has them.

ballen · Feb 21, 2014

Hi Pete,

PeterA said:
A pity the link has no FP2 manuals ..

Sorry! I thought there were manuals. Looking at the link I see an FP2 parts manual, as well as other documents labeled FP2A and FP2NC and similar.

Cheers,
Bruce

PeterA · Feb 26, 2014

No Worries Bruce,

A minor update for anyone interested. Repair assessment has been done and now probably off to insurance to see what they want to do.

In the meantime - the right cable has been sourced (from Germany) and should arrive in about a week's time. Once the NC controller is reconnected - the machine can be tested to see if it works as it should or wether there is more damage than just a couple of bent shafts. Here is crossing fingers time..

meanwhile I am am also 'mucking around with a very nice Hardinge HLV I have picked - deciding wether I should strip it down enough for a new paint job....

the Heidenhan DRO it came with needs fixing or replacing ...

nothing worthwhile is easy it seems -

Cheers
Pete

AlfaGTA · Feb 26, 2014

Pete:
Thanks for the update...keep it coming.
Cheers Ross

PeterA · Mar 4, 2014

Will do Ross!

Thanks for your interest - I don't give up easy -

Cheers
Pete

wrench · Mar 7, 2014

I think I have the manuals and schematic for a similar FP1 version on my DVD. I don't have one specifically for the FP2, though... that much I am certain of.

Alan

PeterA · Apr 19, 2014

Thanks Wrench

All with insurance company at teh moment - and (of course) they are dragging their feet...

Pete

New FP2 'Active' owner down under

Plastic

Attachments

Titanium

Stainless

Diamond

Plastic

Stainless

Plastic

Attachments

Diamond

Diamond

Stainless

Plastic

Plastic

Diamond

Plastic

Diamond

Plastic

Diamond

Plastic

Titanium

Plastic

Similar threads