Programming Agie Charmilles P350......

Girl23 · Mar 24, 2018

I need some help/guidance on the processes of programming using the old mellinium post in Esprit. I have so many questions I don't know where to begin. We have Mitsubishi and the Agie VP2, and this style programming is not at all familiar. So I am just gonna list the questions.

1. Is there a way to set the I and J for tapers in Esprit so that the values will be correct at the machine when you import the geometries. Ex. Part is 20 mm thick, 5mm land. My part is held above the table. My program still thinks it's on the table. I know I can change my I and Js, but with 15 pockets on a die with 4 straight cuts and 4 tapered cuts that's a little aggravating. There HAS got to be a easier way.

2. How do you only rerun a particular skin cut...Example my die with 15 pockets is not cut size..I need to recut last skim with a larger offset. What's the process? I know there is a better way than dry running through the unwanted cuts. Is there not a G200 code you can use to skip to a line.

3. Does anyone have any suggestions as to hold size, my pockets seem to be a little at the top of the tolerance.

4. How can the geometry be right but the graphics show it wrong. For example my did with 15 pockets is only showing 14 pockets with one of those pockets on top of another. It's like when I verified the geometry is compacted two pockets..lol.

Please if anyone can or will care to answer some of these questions please text me...843-517-3500. We are working 7 days, I need to figure this out.

OffsetLeft · Mar 26, 2018

I'm flying blind here, since I haven't used ESPRIT on a regular basis in six years, and my experience is with MUCH older AGIE machines (think 1985 and older) but some of what you're asking ought to be fairly universal, and if I'm wrong, there are some folks here who ought to be able to correct me.

1. I would think that this is a machine control setting; program in ESPRIT as if the die section is on the table, then use the control to define where your programmed break line is. In other words, you should be able tto use the exact same G-Code to cut your part whether it's clamped 10mm above the table or 38mm above the table or ON the table for that matter, by simply defining some value on the AGIE control as either (z+10), (z+38) or (z+0). This should be similar to the Z1 value on the Mits. By the way, when you say 4 straight cuts and 4 tapers, do you mean that you're skimming the tapers? Is this mold work, where those surfaces mean something, or are these stamping dies, where you ought to be able to cut the taper once and forget it? There are a few differing philosophies on this, but I liked roughing the opening with the taper, then cutting the land to size with a rough and skims based on the height of the land. This method only works if you can keep the taper small enough to pull your slugs in spite of the taper or turn the block over so that the land is at the bottom.

2.Break your program up so that you're stringing together fifteen individual sub-programs with a 'Main'file; that way, you can just rerun the ones that you decide you need to. this should be pretty straightforward on the control.

3. If you find that you're consistently cutting to the top end of your tolerance, adjust your wire offset so that it's not coming as close to the actual radius of the wire; Using .250mm wire, your final offset might be around, let's say, .128 or so, right? Boosting that up to .133 (5 microns) should close up your openings by about .0002" per side. On the oldr AGIEs, all of these offsets had to be input manually at the control - there should be a way to adjust these on your machine. Another possibility, in light of the taper question in #1 above, is are you using skims on a 5mm land that are actually developed for a 25mm height? In other words, if you cut a 25mm block and wind up with 20mm taper, 5mm land, finish your skims on the land with tech for 5mm, which will have a lower power setting than the 25mm tech.

4. I can't even imagine what's going on here, but maybe there's someone on here who has had a similar experience?

Best of luck, and if all else fails, read your manuals, right?

Dan

Girl23 · Apr 26, 2018

Thanks for all your input. We finally graduated to a newer post on esprit. Eliminated the length of the program and we are able to skip around a little. We have found that if you put a value of .002 microns in the CLE then it will offset more. It's a learning curve with this machine. Thank you.

OffsetLeft said:
I'm flying blind here, since I haven't used ESPRIT on a regular basis in six years, and my experience is with MUCH older AGIE machines (think 1985 and older) but some of what you're asking ought to be fairly universal, and if I'm wrong, there are some folks here who ought to be able to correct me.

1. I would think that this is a machine control setting; program in ESPRIT as if the die section is on the table, then use the control to define where your programmed break line is. In other words, you should be able tto use the exact same G-Code to cut your part whether it's clamped 10mm above the table or 38mm above the table or ON the table for that matter, by simply defining some value on the AGIE control as either (z+10), (z+38) or (z+0). This should be similar to the Z1 value on the Mits. By the way, when you say 4 straight cuts and 4 tapers, do you mean that you're skimming the tapers? Is this mold work, where those surfaces mean something, or are these stamping dies, where you ought to be able to cut the taper once and forget it? There are a few differing philosophies on this, but I liked roughing the opening with the taper, then cutting the land to size with a rough and skims based on the height of the land. This method only works if you can keep the taper small enough to pull your slugs in spite of the taper or turn the block over so that the land is at the bottom.

2.Break your program up so that you're stringing together fifteen individual sub-programs with a 'Main'file; that way, you can just rerun the ones that you decide you need to. this should be pretty straightforward on the control.

3. If you find that you're consistently cutting to the top end of your tolerance, adjust your wire offset so that it's not coming as close to the actual radius of the wire; Using .250mm wire, your final offset might be around, let's say, .128 or so, right? Boosting that up to .133 (5 microns) should close up your openings by about .0002" per side. On the oldr AGIEs, all of these offsets had to be input manually at the control - there should be a way to adjust these on your machine. Another possibility, in light of the taper question in #1 above, is are you using skims on a 5mm land that are actually developed for a 25mm height? In other words, if you cut a 25mm block and wind up with 20mm taper, 5mm land, finish your skims on the land with tech for 5mm, which will have a lower power setting than the 25mm tech.

4. I can't even imagine what's going on here, but maybe there's someone on here who has had a similar experience?

Best of luck, and if all else fails, read your manuals, right?

Dan

Waakzaamheid · Apr 26, 2018

Girl23 said:
Thanks for all your input. We finally graduated to a newer post on esprit. Eliminated the length of the program and we are able to skip around a little. We have found that if you put a value of .002 microns in the CLE then it will offset more. It's a learning curve with this machine. Thank you.

Yes, the, CLE is for clearance, whatever value you put in there will adjust all your offsets, positive or negative. Very helpful in a lot of situations.

EIGEDM · Jul 14, 2018

We have several Mitsubishi's and just got a P550. We also use esprit. I don't actually do the programming though but hack and slash it back together at the machine.
1) We declare a variable at the beginning of Main operations that is set to 0.0 and if the operator uses outriggers or something they change it. That variable is added to J in the G92 for all the geometries.
Main Op... VLD, V105,0.0 ;Height off table
Geometries... G92 X2.5 Y2.5 J[1.0 + #105] I-1.0 (I is based off J so it doesn't need to be changed)

2) In the Operations just add an N# and instead of "G200A#" it's "Goto, #" Super handy when someone leaves, turns on uncut or OSP,2 now, and you come in and turn it off and only need to drops a couple slugs then jump down to your skims. Separate Operations for everything. So 15 pockets would be 48 Operations for us Main, a setup, one we don't use for anything currently and 15 rough, 15 cutoff, 15 skim... Or hack and slash it, copy whole program, delete everything you don't want all the way up to the thread you want and run that.

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