History of Taig Tools ?

Was reading the saga of Sherline tools recently and it made me wonder if Taig ever had any connection to Sherline or just started completely independently. Unlike Sherline, Taig's website has no history and no obvious "president" or "ceo" presence on the site. Anyone know the scoop ?

I can't remember where I heard this and I cannot verify it, but I recall hearing that TAIG Tools was launched by an Aerospace Master T&D maker who had a dream of making his own tool line.

General G

Seems to me that what Sherline lack over Taig as regards size and quality they make up for with bulls**t

I started to read some of the Sherline site but had to leave it and go throw up.

Tony Jeffree, a long time user and modifier of the Taig lathe had published a book on the lathe.

The Taig Lathe by Tony Jeffree ISBN 0-9543493-0-x
These is no history in this either, it just gets down to the basic uses and then expands into various practical sections.
His whole idea was to publish a practical book on these small micro lathes as non has been done so far.

The Sherline book is nothing but a high priced glossy advert for Joe and Sherline in that order.

What I did notice missing from his very successful "How to run a small business"
was the part where you get people to part with $40 to buy your advertising blurb.
Something other companies give away to generate sales. Nice one Joe.

John S.

Well.... I guess I have to disagree fairly strongly with what you wrote, John....

I have a Taig 2019 mill and a lathe. I had them Next to the coffemaker where I could work with them while the coffee was cooking, as well as the rest of the time!.... I can't say enough good about the 2019.... I will buy Tony's book fairly soon, as well... So I am a very satisfied customer & will probably end up with *everything* Taig makes - except my own CNC brew.... I have been to their company twice - They are a good outfit and deserve more business!!!

I also bought Joe's book... I have read it about 5 times so far. I am reading it again. I read it when I knew absolutely nothing about machines, and every time since I have learned more. It is skewed to Sherline, but that's fine by me. Great tools for what they do.

The good part about Joe's book is that it very visual. Filled with color pictures, stories of what people do, and lots of "how to" information. If commercial, and aimed at increasing the Sherline auidence, I hope that happens. I don't think it is that biased, though. Joe talks about what he knows.

Have you noticed Tauton Press's books.. the pictures are works of art!... Color pictures, extrememly professional shots, and masterpiece drawing art.... Metal working magazines, no offense to anyone, are not full of the same pizaz. Pizaz and promotion are good things, John. Gets people interested in the art.

As a real master (you should look bashful here), Joe's book is not aimed at you. It it is aimed at people like me..... A frustrated computer designer that keeps getting stopped from making what I want. There are lots of people out there now who have never SEEN a machine tool - not in school, work, or anywhere else. Don't you think it somewhat worthy of some color pictures.... $40? - That's nothing compared to what we all have dumped in this stuff... And that $40 is key to helping unlock the Vision thing... As George B. Sr, would say....

By contrast, the Machinery's Handbook at $100+ won't persuade anyone to start making things. Tony's book is a real bargin (Raise the price Tony!!) as well and I hope it sells like mad! You never know how these things are going to work out, though.....

In the battle for hearts and minds, which is what it is really about, metal work has been losing ground for a long time.. I would like to see that changed. When you can't make the things you want to, you are poor. Lots of poor in America. Lots don't even know it, either. May be Joe's $40 book and Tony's book will counter some of that.....

Jerry Robinson

I agree with John on the advertising part. I also with dvideo that it's good for getting people interested in metal working. I'm sure if a 3rd party was to do the same book, there would be Grizzley's, Taigs, Harbor Freights, ect. in the book. But Sieg, Grizzley, and Taig aren't the marketeers that Joe is. The hobbisits that Joe has in his book are true artists and IMHO deserve to be in a book. I own a copy of Joes book but none of his tools. The coolest books that I've found that are also fairly discriptive are old JR High and High School texts from the '50's. They have cool pictures but not the fancy color stuff in Joe's book. I don't think Joe was trying re-invent the wheel or tell vocatinal machinists how to run thier machines.

I have Joe's book. It is definitely feels like a Sherline ad, but then again he basically says that right up front. Over all I think it is a good book just for the work featured in it. Some of the models are amazing. In my mind it isn't worth $40, but I think $25 would be a good price.

Question to ponder for those annoyed at the Tabletop Machining book for covering only Sherline machines- If you manufactured a product and wrote a book on the subject your product is used for, would ~you~ include all your competitors machines in the book ?

I used to manufacture a line of tapping machines and in pondering this question, I don't think I could bring myself to include my competitors machines in the book either. But I would mention that fact in the book right up front, which according to Z he does also.

While the price is a bit painful, it would be interesting to know how much the actual profit over printing/dist. cost is. Due to the relative small size of the potential market for the book and the color seperations and such, it could be that it cost much more than similar books due to small print volume runs. It could also be that someone decided it needs to be expensive to sort of solidify it's value of content. I'll bet if one of us asked Joe, juding from the frankness of his writings about the company, that he'd tell us exactly the scoop

If you just write about your own products, you can say pretty much whatever you want. If you include a competitor's stuff, then you litterally have to "walk on eggshells" in the whole book, because you have to be very careful about what you say. Joe could not, for example, talk farily and honestly about the shortcomings of a HF 7x12 lathe. Sticking to his own stuff let him say what he freely wanted, so I assume he did.

On they other hand, a third party person could write what they wanted to about the various machines, what people are doing, and what is useful... You could talk about SEA 4x6 metal bandsaws and how useful they are - when the tweaks are put on too. You could also talk about biker billet art and English Wheel Gas tanks... Tony's book has that freedom - he is third party.

There really is a need, and there really is an opportunitity for this kind of thing. You don't have to limit yourself to $5 books with corresponding limits of quality and color. Might do some DVDs, it is not too hard. It would be possible to work a lot of topics in and show what people are doing. Generate interest and so forth. I think there is a demand for such, but you won't get rich.

Truth is, years ago you could "apprentice" or go a voc schoool, or find somewhere to learn the trade. Such opportunities are disappearing fast. I could not afford the time, either. So like a lot of folks, I work it in to my schedule. Like a lot here, I go through as much material as possible between 11pm and 3am.. It is just the time available.

Whether you think $40 is too much and 15 is ok.... I bet the thought there was "really go all out for color imagery" and stories - and take the increse in price. Increase the sales price, reduce the possible sales numbers - but the better paper is worth it.

If you aim this book at the target newbie audience thinking about some machines and learning a hobby or home shop, then $40 is darn well worth it. If you are hairy shop-ape vetrean, then the book is not aimed at you and you can buy one used on Amazon for 15 some time....

Considering Joe, I know it was carefully thought about. I think he was right on: Charge more - get better art/paper.

Remember what things cost.... $40 will get you two interesting "things" at Sams Club. $46 will get the tax paid, two interesting things and two combination hotdogs with drinks. You will immensely regret the $3 for combo hot-dogs and drinks for about a day. 3 months later you will even have forgotten that you went to Sam's Club, much less the stuff you bought. Bad Hot Dog memories dissipate slower. Or you could have this really good book....

I guess I am opinionated, huh???... I hope that fits right in.... ">

- jr

John:

I had another comment, that is really a whole different thread....

Small machines....

I is really important to understand the basic physics and metalurgy in making small things...

Feynman said "there's lots of room at the bottom". Extreme vision again.... Doing ICs at 100 nM is really just a point on the curve... There is huge, undeveloped, unexplore world out there bigger than the Americas ever were to Columbus. Much bigger. A world of u-Machining, motors, systems, controls, and so forth.

Joe's book, while may be not aimed this way, goes towards a hearts and mind battle here. Those pioneers of the u-Machine technology are still children. If they are going to go this way to a techinical skill and "get bent" to this area, it's going to happen when they are children. Not when they are in HS or college. It happens now. As a child, that is when I got bent this direction - how about you.... ?

I would suggest that most people here got interested in this machining and making stuff thing when they were kids. It's hearts-and-minds thing.

Well you have to compete for hearts-and-minds now. There is a lot of useless crap out there that grabs those hearts-and-minds. We could all make a long list. I have kids. I see them from the old-guys perspective now. Other side of the coin.

So in an objective comparison, Joe's $40 versus $100+ from Machinery's Handbook, which do you think is more important?

Robert Ballard put his finger on it as well. We all know he is genius of the first order but accute perception also is there. He observed one time that as the sub they were in was nearing the very bottom of the sea, the fellows with him could look out the porthole and see everthing. Instead, they were clusterd around the video monitor for the camera mounted externally.... Hence the extreme application of ROVs....

For uMachining and the like, it works the same way as the ROV concept. We do it on CNC now, anyway, don't we?

Today the UK has a real leg up on these technologies... All of the Robotics clubs. The Model clubs. Think of Nick Parks' work and Star Wars photography aspects. Whether they choose to dominate this even non-existant or not-even-thought about industry is totally up in the air. This is where a good piece of humanity will be making a living, if we live at all, in 50 years. Long to us old people. Short in reality and to the future of little ones.

It's a hearts-and-mind issue, I think.

-- jr