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  1. #21
    Milacron's Avatar
    Milacron is offline Diamond
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    But it does dry to a tacky, almost waxy consistency that holds dust
    the aerosol doesn't...unless you spray it super thick.

  2. #22
    Dead Nuts is offline Cast Iron
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    I have seen notes on drawings from areospace companies that call out to pour a small amout of linseed oil inside a hollow steel part and then plug the hole. But I would not use it externally.

  3. #23
    Norman Atkinson is offline Titanium
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    Moving away from 'eye of newts', linseed oil fatty acids and assorted goos, the automobile industry has something akin to the old product called Waxoyl from the Hammerite company.
    I used it way back in 1963 and it would suggest something of this sort would suffice.

    Harking back to vehicle sprayed protection, my Seat Marbella is now 10 years old. I have sold it on locally but despite living in the salt washed cliffs of Menorca in the Spanish Baleric Islands, there is no signs of rust anywhere but on the bonnet air intake- where there is paint rather than preservative.

    If it can stand that, it can stand most things

    I hope that this helps

    Norm

  4. #24
    Ries's Avatar
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    Its been so long since I have actually seen any, I had to look up Cosmoline- my childhood was filled with genuine Cosmoline coated World War 2 surplus, but that stuff is long gone-

    "Cosmoline is a yellowish, light-amber, or greenish colored ointment-like mass, having a slight fluorescence, petroleum-like odor and taste. It is similar to petroleum jelly in properties, appearance, and thickness. It is the purified residue obtained from the distillation of petroleum oils.
    Chemically, cosmoline is a homogeneous mixture of oily and waxy long-chain, non-polar hydrocarbons. It can range in color from white to yellow, and can differ in viscosity and shear strength. Cosmoline melts at 113125 F (4552 C) and has a flashpoint of 365 F (185 C).
    Its most common use is in the storage and preservation of firearms. Previously, cosmoline was used to preserve other things. Objects the size of entire vehicles could be preserved for future use with cosmoline."

    And if you wanna buy some, here it is-
    http://www.brownells.com/aspx/NS/sto...il.aspx?p=1134

    30 bucks a quart- that means it would cost about 200 bucks to coat a jeep- and since jeeps only cost 50 bucks, in the crate with the cosmoline included, who the heck would coat a jeep these days, right?

    But it sure doesnt sound like it drys, hard or otherwise- its just grease. Yes, its true if you coated something in Cosmoline in 1942, by the year 2007 it might be hard. But if you buy it from Brownells, its grease, pure and simple.


    I gotta agree with the Big D- there are paint companies that spend millions of bucks, hiring real scientists, doing weathering tests, and mixing esoteric stews of expensive and hard to find chemicals, and the result is stuff that works, is cheap, easy to apply, and comes in convenient spray cans.

    Unless you live your life in some kinda Foxfire Ronn-DEE-Vous dreamland, why the heck would you want to spend your time cooking up inferior coatings?

  5. #25
    Milacron's Avatar
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    Judging from below, LPS3 and CRC Marine are not officially cosmoline. It sure as heck isn't an "ointment like mass" ! [img]smile.gif[/img]

    ================================================

    From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    Jump to: navigation, search
    Cosmoline is a yellowish, light-amber, or greenish colored ointment-like mass, having a slight fluorescence, petroleum-like odor and taste. It is similar to petroleum jelly in properties, appearance, and thickness. It is the purified residue obtained from the distillation of petroleum oils.

    Chemically, cosmoline is a homogeneous mixture of oily and waxy long-chain, non-polar hydrocarbons. It can range in color from white to yellow, and can differ in viscosity and shear strength. Cosmoline melts at 113125 F (4552 C) and has a flashpoint of 365 F (185 C).

    Its most common use is in the storage and preservation of firearms. Previously, cosmoline was used to preserve other things. Objects the size of entire vehicles could be preserved for future use with cosmoline.

    ================
    (on edit...d'oh ! Ries beat me by 2 minutes ! )

  6. #26
    Ries's Avatar
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    Great minds, or at least great ego's, think alike.

  7. #27
    Sea Farmer is offline Titanium
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    Until fairly recently, the traditional homebrew method of delaying corrosion on beach buggies, pickup trucks and any other vehicle driven on beaches or boat ramps was to get underneath and rub everything in sight with rags soaked in used motor oil, maybe some grease added. Drive over beach until sand/dust sticks. Repeat a few times to build up the coat. Renew as necessary.

    When enough vehicles do this, parking areas get pretty nasty on hot days.

  8. #28
    Norman Atkinson is offline Titanium
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    Oh well!

    So 1 lb of paraffin wax- or candles in cheese grater.
    Dissolve in 1/2 gallon of mineral spirits/white spirits/turps substitute.

    add 2 pints of clean or sh1tty non detergent engine oil.

    What people forget is that it was made originally in a little pit village just on the other side of the river to where George Stephenson the raiway engineer was born.
    Now how would I know that?

    Will that do?

  9. #29
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    Rick Rowlands is offline Titanium
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    Cosmoline! I've gone through two 25 lb. cans of the stuff and half of a 5 gallon bucket coating Tod Engine parts. I take a gallon paint can, scoop some cosmoline out into the gallon can and place it on my Coleman propane camp stove. The cosmoline melts and once its completely melted and superheated some I then take the can and a paint brush and apply it to whatever surfaces I want to protect.

    It really does work great. I've had parts exposed to the weather for four years now and the cosmoline doesn't wear off. It IS the best rust preventative ever conceived.

    I also have a 55 gallon drum of LPS Hardcoat. Its a thick liquid and I apply it with a weed sprayer then spread out by brush. It doesn't last but a few months in the weather but does pretty good on stuff under tarps or in unheated buildings.

    Maybe I'll give the linseed oil and turpentine a try on some other parts that I have in indoor storage. If it wasn't for Greg Menke and his donation of the cosmoline and a really good deal on the Hardcoat at HGR I would be up the creek when it comes to rust prevention. I have a LOT of metal to keep protected and there is about 200 more tons of it on the way.

  10. #30
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    The Practical sailor tests do mention gummy coatings.

    And their Boeshield results sound right.

    The summary doesn't say what time the good stuff lasted, evidently "bad" was a week or so, which the T9 did. Whatever the "link" mentioned is, is long gone.

    The fundamental diffence is that the linseed acts somewhat like a paint, one that penetrates and creeps well to cover.

    It has theoretically good properties, and one can see why it would be suggested. For that reason I don't classify it as a "foxfire" home remedy....

    And it isn't real expensive per ounce (sheesh.... per ounce on the huge Tod engine? YOW... better a price per 55 gal drum....).

    There's better stuff, sure. But you gonna pay for it.

  11. #31
    solomon63 is offline Aluminum
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    I use no rust bags(yellow).They make them up to 10x10. I bought a couple and they work very well. I think they are a product called Vappro. I cut strips and put in tool boxes to keep out rust. Rustlick works well also.

  12. #32
    spope14 is offline Stainless
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    I have used boiled linseed oil and peanut oil in a perhaps unique way as a rust preventative. This was taught to me by an old blacks smith who maed items such as stair railings and such for outdoor ornamental iron work.

    I brush the linsedd oil or peanut oil, or in a pinch some old motor oil on a metal surface and hit it with a welding torch - rosebud to burn off the excess only - it just flashes off with a quick flame. Then I wipe off the soot and I have a black and very hard finish - kind of a black semi gloss to gloss coating - rather i say it is almost like a gun bluing type of finish for those inclined. Do this three or four coats and the rail, gate hinge whatever will stand up to outside wear and weather.

    It also works by heating the metal up to just above blue and brushing it (the oil) on, hitting it quickly with the torch, then wiping off the soot. This is generally my preferred method when i know the heating of the metal will not weaken the job.

    I have a hammer handle - metal knurled 14 pitch I did this to in 1995, still use it often and the black coating is still intact. Same for a stair rail I made parts for to match a rail for an old refurbished church in our city. The rail was NOT spray painted, it was a black like I mentioned above - hard coated is what i call it. Parts still match and there is no rust. This was a peanut oil burned on finish.

    I tend to use rust lick for normal rust preventative though.

  13. #33
    Forrest Addy is online now Diamond
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    Linseed oil has no preservative ingredients; any rust control properties it may have are due to sealing off the bare metal surface from the environment. Boiled linseed oil is about 1/2 the cost pur unit in gallon containers compared to a thick film proprietary metal preservative which offers a year or more protection in the elements depending on climate.

    Further, boiled linseed oil cures to a tough film that's difficult to remove. Linseed oil poses a real spontaneous combustion hazard if soaked waste acculated in piles or in a confined space.

    Off the shelf preservatives can be removed in minutes with mineral spirits and a cloth even after the film has been in place for years. Petroleum based preservatives pose no particular fire hazard in the cured film and only a mild hazard as the fresh liquid.

    Why anyone would use linseed oil as a metal preservative when so many excellent products are on the market is beyond me. Maybe in an emergency like when exposed machinery is caught in a rainstorm and there's nothing else available.

  14. #34
    Norman Atkinson is offline Titanium
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    Forrest,
    I did try to go down two paths. One was the traditional old 'fart' of which I have trained long and hard and tried to explain what is the beginnings of paint technology. All one needs is a bit of rosin and pigment and a million years of practice to get to the Mona Lisa. Miss the pigment out, and we can have a Stradivarius violin varnish! Unquestionably, there have been notable followers.

    I agree about preservatives but as I hinted earlier, the newer complounds are also pretty cheap and nasty- and if my recipe is fairly widely used, isn't much of an improvement on the past.

    I remain both a sceptic and a septic having boiled enough things in my time.
    I keep looking East having missed the Last Miracle.

    Norm

  15. #35
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    For everyone's safety info:turpentines you can buy are of 2 types.The real stuff used to say "From the living pine" on the can.theother,more common stuff is distilled from ground up stumps.Turpentine is LOADED with oxygen.It is also extremely harmful to breathe,and causes arthritis.Most painters now use paint thinner.Turpentine mixed with linseed oil is very dangerous in terms of leaving rags wetted with the mixture laying around.Turpentine will explode if potassium permanganate (KMNO4) is thrown into it.Real turpentine smells different from the stump made stuff,and will produce turpene resin if left exposed to oxygen.I used to bubble air through a gallon of it for a few weeks and make this resin.I simmered it with linseed oil to make a beautiful varnish.I don't want to go into varnish making here.Takes too long.About linseed oil:It will get green mold on it if used on wooden tools that are left in humid environments for a period of months.Tung oil is better for use on wood as it doesn't mildew.I once saw a trash can actually start to smoke since someone had put rags with turpentine and linseed oil on them into it previously.

  16. #36
    surplusjohn is offline Diamond
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    Kroil sells a perservative coating that I tried a number of years ago. It seemed to work fine but was difficult to remove, kinda like an waxy varnish,

  17. #37
    Milacron's Avatar
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    Why anyone would use linseed oil as a metal preservative when so many excellent products are on the market is beyond me
    Well you know J has inclinations toward that "ol timey" and "natural" sounding stuff. Something esoteric and "fein shui" about slathering liquid made from "boiled seeds" that's hard to resist ! [img]tongue.gif[/img]

  18. #38
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    Nay sir.... If "J" is me.....

    What it's good for is stuff that you would like not to have rust, and that will have things done to it later, or maybe WON'T have stuff done to it..... and that you don't want to/can't afford to pay hundreds of bucks to protect.

    IOW, sheets/pieces of steel.... If your area isn't climate controlled, and you want to store a bunch of steel without it rusting more than it already has, the $2 per ounce stuff is not much help to you.

    But slushing it down with 'solvent" and linseed, or solvent and heavy oil, will get 'er dun without costing a lot....

    Likely whatever you do later to it will remove the surface and the linseed film too... so no harm there.

    If what you want is cosmoline performance, and it is worth that cost to you, then get cosmoline..... That's a no-brainer....

    The point is very much NOT that oil and solvent or linseed and solvent is BETTER...... it is NOT "better".... But it MAY be "cost-effective", because it DOES work, pretty much in the way that paint would work.

    If you noticed, I already mentioned the resemblance to paint, so it was unnecessary for others to repeat that yet again, as if it was something new.....

    (dang... I CAN indeed get to be the way some folks say Don is! )

  19. #39
    Milacron's Avatar
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    J, re boiled seeds and paint like protection, there is this stuff called "primer paint" that's been around awhile....

  20. #40
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    Yes there is, and it works, if you want to paint the surface, or don't mind painting it with 'real" paint.


    The ONE advantage of the "seeds" is that the solvent and lack of pigment means it will "creep" better than paint..... i.e one does not always have to hit every spot with the sparay or brush.....

    At this point we've really beat on the subject....

    But the concept isn't as silly as it seems to some..... once you look at it with an open mind.

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