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Can anyone tell me what tool holder and advice on power?

Steeler

Plastic
Joined
Oct 24, 2014
Location
Alberta, Canada
Hi, New to this site and posting this again - I think my title was too vague to remain on the board. My husband's been dreaming of having a lathe to help with repairs around the farm and he finally got a good deal on a used one. It's been pretty much downhill from there. There's no 3 phase power here so we use a rotary converter that only puts out 208v. The lathe requires 575v. Now we need to switch out the motor to a 5hp 208v 3ph motor unless anyone knows of another option?? The other issue is the tool holder that didn't come with the lathe. He'd like a quick change style but we're having trouble figuring out what will work with this machine. We have friends coming from US next month that could help save on freight if we knew what to buy. The lathe is a Torrent 42 Model 72-42. I've attached a couple pictures that might help with the tool holder question. Would really appreciate any input!! Thanks.
 

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Welcome to PM.

Please reply with the measured (not estimated) diameter and length of the shoulder on that stud.

Normally, lathe compound rests have a T-Slot (not a stud) which allows a custom T-Nut to accommodate any desired bolt.
 
I think a step up converter could be a solution for the voltage but I would change the motor I see 5 hp three phase motors going for $50 to $75
 
Here is some information on the company/lathe as well as a picture that will give you a good idea of what came stock on the lathe. - Page Title In order to fit a modern quick change tool post, depending on the bolt/shoulder size, it may be necessary to do some modifications to the compound slide.

Hope that helps some,

-Ron
 
Welcome to PM.

Please reply with the measured (not estimated) diameter and length of the shoulder on that stud.

Normally, lathe compound rests have a T-Slot (not a stud) which allows a custom T-Nut to accommodate any desired bolt.

I would have thought so too but that machine seems to have a fixed compound..the tool post swivels on the stud. A Goggled pix of a Torrent lathe also show the compound fixed parallel with the ways, at least that's what it looks like!

Stuart
 
I would have thought so too but that machine seems to have a fixed compound..the tool post swivels on the stud. A Goggled pix of a Torrent lathe also show the compound fixed parallel with the ways, at least that's what it looks like!

Stuart

The lathe has two T-slots, running the length of the cross slide, which allows the top slide to be positioned anywhere along the cross slide (per latses.co.uk). There is an intermediate plate between the top of the cross slide and the bottom of the top slide. Notice how the mounting bolts at the base of the top slide are not anywhere near the t-slots in the cross slide. I'm hoping that the intermediate plate is a swivel base for the top slide, making it a compound (not "fixed").
 
Steeler,

While you're at it, how is that stud fixed to the compound? Is there a reasonable chance to remove the stud and replace it with a nut? An appropriate nut, below the top surface of the top slide, would allow you to bolt on any number of easily available QCTPs.

Isn't it strange how a non-standard, relatively trivial component can become separated from its intended application, rendering the machine impotent. I hope you bought it for fair (low) $$.
 
No great worries over tool post fitting save for affording one! Being a European machine the stud is almost certainly approximately 1" diameter i.e. sized to take a European / UK market tool post such as Dickson style, most likely S3 size, or clone (e.g. Rapid), Mutifix, Tripan et al. A DA series Aloris will also fit. New prices will be £1,000 up for a post and two or three holders! If you can find a special offer. Common American practice is to use plain rather than stepped studs so the bore of the tool post is often smaller. Changing the stud for a plain one might let you fit an Aloris CXA which is around half the price of a DA so still not cheap but it won't be tall enough and will need a spacer made. Tool size will be restricted too but that's unlikely to matter as the Torrent is less powerful and rather lighter duty than most machines of that capacity so will be unable to exploit the larger tools anyway.

Probably most economical tool post option would be to obtain some large four way posts similar to the standard one shown on the lathes.co site, load them up with 4 tools and change the whole post when necessary. Four way tool posts of appropriate size were often fitted to old style turret, capstan and similar now obsolete production lathes so can often be found cheaply. Heck I have one or maybe two in the could be handy box under the bench that probably owe me about £1 each if that.

If all else fails adequate four way posts can be made by bolting up two plates of stock size material with a stock size square spacer between. Something like 4" or 5" square by 1/2 or 3/4" thick for the bottom, 1" thick for the top and 2 1/2" or 3 1/2" square for the spacer has the right sort of feel to it. Space for tools needs to be around 3/4" wide by 1 1/4" high. Clamping bolts could be around 1/2" diameter. Home made isn't completely ideal but it worked well enough, albeit on a smaller machine, for me over the decade or so it took to afford something better.
4 Hp should be fine for the intended use as you should be more focussed on getting the job done than setting material removal records.

Clive
 
Another folder on this forum is VFD / Phase Converters, post your problem with the motor there. There's lots of us that run machines on single phase voltage, and swapping out the motors is by far the worst option, and close to the most expensive.

As for the tool holder, if you can find one, old turret lathe tool posts look like they would fit ok. Specifically, one from a Warner and Swasey #3. It's not quick change, but it also won't cost you a couple hundred dollars. The size quick change you are looking for is likely compatible with Aloris CXA size.
 
Switching from 575 down all the way to 208 (or thereabouts)
Is going to raise the current draw thru whatever
Motor starter/relays you have presently installed.

Getting new heaters may not even be available
Anymore.

You can run a RPC and a step up former, feeding the machine
What it is presently set up for.
 
Thanks for the replies, does anybody know where would I find a leeson 5hp 3ph 208v df112m motor for under a hundred bucks? That would solve half my problems. The length of the shoulder on the stud is 57.53mm, the thickness of the shoulder is 31mm, the thickness of the top threads is 20mm, the thickness of the bottom threads is 19.8mm. I have included some more pictures. Appreciate all the input.
lathe 1.jpg lathe 2.jpg lathe 3.jpg lathe 4.jpg
 
31 mm diameter by 57 mm long on the plain part of the stud suggests that the official quick change toolpost option would have been a B series Multifix toolpost which has a 32 mm mounting bore and is 75 mm high. Very good but really, really expensive! Not sure if import clones can be got in that size.

20 mm thread on the stud may be just a touch too big for an Aloris CXA which is bored for 3/4" nominal stud. CA takes a 7/8" stud and will fit just fine. That said there is no reason what you couldn't have a slightly smaller stud above the bottom thread to take the CXA with an appropriate thread for the standard locking nut.

Clive
 
I agree with Clive, I love my Aloris CXA holder. A little pricey at the get go but man what a time saver, especially when the more holders you pick up along the way.

Have one on my Victor 1640 engine lathe.
 
Thanks for the replies, does anybody know where would I find a leeson 5hp 3ph 208v df112m motor for under a hundred bucks? That would solve half my problems. The length of the shoulder on the stud is 57.53mm, the thickness of the shoulder is 31mm, the thickness of the top threads is 20mm, the thickness of the bottom threads is 19.8mm. I have included some more pictures. Appreciate all the input.
View attachment 120218 View attachment 120219 View attachment 120220 View attachment 120217

Magic! You're in great shape because that stud is easily removed. Just purchase an appropriate QCTP (many recommendations already) to fit your lathe size, budget and preferences. Easy enough to make (or have made) or purchase a standard fastener to screw into the existing threaded hole in the top slide. If your new QCTP requires a smaller diameter fastener than that threaded hole, you can make (or have made) a threaded insert to adapt (OD thread to mate with top slide, ID thread to mate with appropriate fastener). If you new QCTP requires a larger diameter fastener than that threaded hole in the top slide, you can make (or have made) something similar to the stud you removed. If the existing stud works with your new QCTP, you're golden.

I'll defer to others regarding the motor related issues. It's actually best to deal with one significant issue per thread. That way, the next guy can read about the QCTP issue without having to wade through the motor/voltage/phase convertor/VFD conversation.

Good luck.
 
I use a Dorian CA quick change tool post on my Victor 1640 lathe. It's really the biggest that can go on this machine. The Dorian holder blocks just barely get low enough to put 1" tools on center, and the import blocks need about 2.5mm off the bottom to do it.

The best thing to do is measure the thread that is in the top of the compound slide, and measure the height from the top of the compound slide to the center of rotation of the chuck. Then you can look at various QCTP options and choose the one that make the most sense. The machine wouldn't have enough power to beat up the 3/4" shank holders of the CXA size, though the 1" shanks in the CA size can have better damping qualities owing to their increased mass.

A MultiFix is quite nice too. Though more money for the base and holders you rarely if ever have to loosen the post to put a tool at an angle. It's got so many positions!

You can make or buy a post to screw into the compound slide which will accommodate any of them.
 
I don't have any more to add to the general discussion but I must say your husband is one lucky guy!

I love my wife dearly but I couldn't imagine her ever posting anything on this site with the exception of "entire shop full of husband's machine stuff forsale" when I am gone. I even showed her this post and she couldn't believe it, and wanted to know if you are a dude?:D
 
The CXA tool post is 3 inches/76.2mm tall. CXA is bored for .75 inch/19.05mm stud. The minimum cutting height with a.500 inch tool in a turning/facing holder is 1.3125 inches/33.34mm. A new stud with a shoulder could be turned. A counter bore in the bottom of the tool would accommodate the shoulder. As mentioned in #15 you may need to remove material from the bottom of the holders to match the center height. Today even the Aloris clones in the CXA size are quite expensive. I'd buy used from highly rated ebay seller.
 
I don't have any more to add to the general discussion but I must say your husband is one lucky guy!

I love my wife dearly but I couldn't imagine her ever posting anything on this site with the exception of "entire shop full of husband's machine stuff forsale" when I am gone. I even showed her this post and she couldn't believe it, and wanted to know if you are a dude?:D

Definitely not a dude - but he's so pitiful when his new toys don't work!
 
Thanks everyone for your input. I feel pretty comfortable now with purchasing what I need for the tool holder. I'll probably go with a phase II CXA but first have to make sure we can power the thing. Thanks again!
 








 
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