Enco 12X36 lathe contactor box needed

Tim Wells · Apr 22, 2007

This is my first post and I'm desperate. I bought a used (1999) model# 110-2079 gap bed 18 speed lathe with an American motor on it. I didn't realize it at the time but the entire contactor box that goes behind the headstock is missing.

I contacted Enco about it and they are looking into replacement costs but they have yet to be much help. I can make the box easily enough.

What I need is a parts list of the contents of the box, better yet a nice bright closeup photo of the opened box and what's inside taken by one of you good gents that have one of these things.

I feel certain that I could get the transformer, fuses, relays and such off the shelf somewhere rather than having to order it from China for petes sake. There is a crappy B&W photo of it on the manual I downloaded but it's so poor you can't tell what any of it is or what numbers are on each component so you'd have something to go by when looking for a replacement.

Can someone bail me out? :confused:

surplusjohn · Apr 22, 2007

no reason to get it from enco. go to any industrial electronics outfit, Grainger, etc, and give them specs on your motor plate and a wireing diagram of the lathe if you have it. I assume this is reversing. You should be able to use a compact reversing starter, maybe 100 bucks for a small one like this [guesstimate]

Tim Wells · Apr 22, 2007

I don't know anything about what it's contents do so I'm ignorant on this particular subject. (compact reversing starter) for instance, I've no idea. The crap photo has a parts description lists the 3 contactors as simply contactors but no part number, voltages, nothing.

There's a couple of fuses and a transformer for the control circuit supply but no detail at all on it. Also a heating device relay. No idea what that's for either.

I just tried to convert a pdf photo from the manual to a jpg so I could post it to help clarify what I'm after but I couldn't make it work. I feel if I had a good clear closeup photo of someones box innards I'd at least have a place to start in finding the parts locally or through MSC, Grainger, McMaster-Carr,ETC...

Tim Wells · Apr 22, 2007

By the way, it is reversing and it also has an "inching" button.

Mike Burdick · Apr 22, 2007

Tim,

What size motor does the lathe have and is it single or three phase?

If removal of the existing switches won't look too ugly, another option (if single phase) is using a drum switch. A 12-inch lathe is small and a drum switch (around $40.00) will work if the lathe is at or under 2 hp - 230V (single phase) or 1-1/2 hp - 115V (single phase). Since everything is missing this may be a good (and inexpensive) alternative since all contractors, transformers, and enclosure won't be needed.

As for the "inching" feature, I'd just forget it. On a small lathe you'll probably use that very little and most likely not at all.

Here's an example... Grainger has others, just search for "Drum Switch".

http://www.grainger.com/Grainger/items/2X441

Chris Attebery · Apr 22, 2007

Tim,

Is this the belt drive lathe? I have a Rutland tool Taiwanese version of this lathe. I could proably take a couple snapshots for you.

I also have the transformer that I ordered and took too long to realize that it was the wrong voltage or wouldn't fit in my machine, I forget the exact problem. It's brand spanking new. I'd give you a good price on it as I have no use for it right now.

I'll go take a look in the garage...

Chris

Owen McGee · Apr 22, 2007

Tim:

I gotta go with Mike on this. I have bought two of those Grainger switches - one on my Van Norman, one on my Warner & Swasey. E-Z to wire in, mount, and use. Oh yeah....they're cheap too.

Good Luck
OMcG

matt_isserstedt · Apr 22, 2007

An "inching" button might mean the same as what I would term a "jog" button, i.e. one can "jog" the motor by bumping the pushbutton, the motor starter will pull in as long as the pushbutton is depressed, as opposed to the start pushbutton, where once depressed, the motor will run until STOP is selected.

[A true "inching" feature in my book would be something like 2Hz applied to the motor thru a VFD's control system to allow a "creep speed"]

Here's a drawing of just that feature...I'm sure we can concoct a control system (relay "ladder") using what you already have.

What kind of pushbuttons or selector switches do you have existing on the headstock of the lathe??

Skeeter · Apr 22, 2007

Hey Tim,

You can go to the Grizzly web site and look at the manual for their 12 x 36 lathe and see the layout of the relays and transformer. I would think if you want you could get the parts from them. I did not see a wiring diagram.

The drum switch will work, you will not have the indicators lights working on the switch panel of the lathe. Not a big deal, one of my lights stayed burned out for months.

One other note, the selector handle (switch) could possibly be, wired, to operate the lathe just as the drum switch.

Some one had to be operating this lathe, I wonder how they energized it? Must of had a external switch.

Good luck on this.

Mike Burdick · Apr 22, 2007

Tim,

Okay, here is one more option you might consider. Get a 3-phase motor and a VFD. I know this sounds expensive but in the long run it might not be.

If you go the "replace contactor route" you will need an enclosure, two contactors (maybe three depending on setup), a heater for motor protection, a transformer, and terminal strips. If these items have any quality at all you will spend around $250.00.

If you go the "VFD route" you won't need any contactors, transformer, heaters, or enclosure since all these features are included in the VFD. Also, you can wire the VFD to use the existing switches, including the "jog" or "inching" feature, and emergency stop. Matter of fact, you'll never know the VFD is there except that you'll have variable speed if needed, ramp up and ramp down control speed, jog speed selection, as well as a number of other helpful features. The VFD will cost around $230.00 so all you'll be out is the cost of a 3-phase motor (if the existing motor is 1-phase).

If you have time, price everything out and see which options fit your budget.

Tim Wells · Apr 22, 2007

It is a 1.5 hp Marathon motor belt drive. I would like to put it back to original if possible. If that fails I'll go the drum switch route.

Here's the story: A house was forclosed on and the owner left the lathe jerry rigged to the breaker box with a piece of romex so it was hooked up 110. They boys that were hired to clean the place out said it worked and then took the wires loose to move it and put it in the paper for sale.

I bought it and that brings us to the present situation. He must have got it that way too or junked the box I don't know.

I really, really appreciate all of you that have posted on this. Thank you!

JoeFin · Apr 22, 2007

Tim

Look in the yellow pages in your area, I am sure you will have a wholesale- open to the public electronics supply house. The guys who deal NEW and USED surplus is what you want.

Here we have HSC electronics which has a web site.
HSC

They have every thing you can imagine to rebuild you’re your control box.; I know there are more then a few well seasoned engineers who regularly post on this forum who would be glad to help you out.

Try starting out buying just the owners manual from Enco. They will definitely have a wiring schematic in there

matt_isserstedt · Apr 23, 2007

This would be a fun project (for me

), scrounge some NEMA starters from ebay, an ice-cube relay, and hopefully you already have the pushbuttons and lamps installed, if not Al Bradley's 800T series.

This is a modification of above to include reversing starters, looks intimidating at first but it's really not.

matt_isserstedt · Apr 23, 2007

Here's a little change I'm proposing...

If the motor starters come with auxiliary contacts, or can be fitted as such...I'd recommend adding normally closed auxiliary contacts to both sides. In English, the motor starters (with different phasing) are "interlocked" (electrically, there exist starter pairs that have a mechanical rocker linkage that performs the exact same interlock function, but those are typically found in older equipment)

The reason is, if the contacts stick (unlikely but possible) on one side and the other direction is selected, there will be a phase-to-phase short circuit with guaranteed spectacular results.

The little change below prevents that

Tim Wells · Apr 23, 2007

Matt,
I sure wish I knew as much as you guys do about this stuff. My push buttons are intact. The contactor box was merely disconnected and removed. I have 3 seperate wire harnesses laying there waiting for action.

This lathe can be seen on the Enco site as the 12X36 gear head gap bed 18 speed. Grizzly has one that looks the same as except the levers are a tad different but I bet the same place made them.

The Grizzly site has better specs and manual but only because where it says in the parts list "contactor" it gives a part number where Enco's manual does not. Unfortunately, the Grizzly manual for the near identicle lathe has 2 contactors and mine shows 3. What to do...

matt_isserstedt · Apr 23, 2007

I searched Grizz for useful information and I haven't found any 12x36 lathes with 18 speeds...perhaps post a link to the one in question...??

John Madarasz · Apr 23, 2007

Tim, You might want to try the Enco 1236 group at Yahoo for a solution also...maybe even some parts

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/12x36importlathes/

Tim Wells · Apr 23, 2007

The grizzly model closest to mine:
http://www.grizzly.com/products/G4003

The newest version of my actual lathe at enco:

http://www.use-enco.com/CGI/INSRIT?PMAKA=510-2584&PMPXNO=9033434&PARTPG=INLMK32

I'm gonna call these guys and work on them some more.

matt_isserstedt · Apr 23, 2007

I think the controls are simpler than above. I don't think there's an electrically selected "reverse" since there's no way to actuate it.

Did you say that the lathe is/was running on 110vac...the manual states 220vac...the only difference this would make would be the lack or presence of a control transformer.

wippin' boy · Apr 23, 2007

i hate to be a wet blanket here
but
matts drawings are plain as day
if you got a clue

if you don't
buy a reversing starter.... any one the right size will do

call a machine tool guy or any electrician
(he can size the starter for you)
and tell them to do what matt said

this ain't a place for
"i can do it if i got a picture"

that's why enco ain't much help
they got a clue....
that you ain't

$.02

Enco 12X36 lathe contactor box needed

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