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Post By Bobw

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Post By gbent

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Post By rsegriggy

GD&T  True Position
Let's say you're trying to hit dimension 0,0. But you really hit dimension 3,4. Through the Pythagorean theroem and such you do the formula SQRT(x squared + y squared) to find the hypotenuse and you end up off 5 from your intended 0,0 target.
However, the way true position callout works, the formula is 2*SQRT(x squared + y squared), thus putting you off 10 (even though we just established that you were really only off 5).
Anyone know why they double the number to get true position?

If you bored a hole .005" off center, then indicated it from the correct position, you would read .010" TIR. Somehow, though, that doesn't sound like what you are describing.
Bill

Simple, the true position is within a diameter, and you're calculating the radius.

Originally Posted by CatMan
Let's say you're trying to hit dimension 0,0. But you really hit dimension 3,4. Through the Pythagorean theroem and such you do the formula SQRT(x squared + y squared) to find the hypotenuse and you end up off 5 from your intended 0,0 target.
However, the way true position callout works, the formula is 2*SQRT(x squared + y squared), thus putting you off 10 (even though we just established that you were really only off 5).
Anyone know why they double the number to get true position?
Look on the true position callout  see if the true position tolerance number is a diameter or a radius. If it's a diameter, there you go  a .010 diameter true position is only .005 in radius. So you can either A) half the tolerance when you do the math, or B) just double your number.
So, if the magnetude/hypotenuse of the errors comes out to be 5, and the tolerance is a .010 diameter, you've just taken up all the allowable error.
Edit: Ooops, didn't see bobw's answer.

OK. The diameter reference makes sense. Thanks guys.

Don't forget that the hole tol. can add to or tighten your true postion needed also. i.e. on a hole sized .5" +/ .010" making the hole .510 adds adds that .010" as a bonus to your true postion number.
Steve

Originally Posted by scadvice
Don't forget that the hole tol. can add to or tighten your true postion needed also. i.e. on a hole sized .5" +/ .010" making the hole .510 adds adds that .010" as a bonus to your true postion number.
Steve
A Hole size tolerance can only give you bonus tolerance If and ONLY IF you're given MMC. Boring a hole .5" +/ .010" to .510 with MMC adds .020 to your TP (not .010).
In other words, for a hole .500 +/ .010 has TP of Dia. .010 at MMC (.490) If you bore the hole to LMC (.510) you get .020 bonus giving you a grand total of TP Dia. .030
Side note: +/ .010 on a hole of .500 in my shop is like throwing a hot dog down a hallway. Bonus tolerance is more important with closer size tolerances. (+/ .002 or less)
CEM

Originally Posted by CEM@DELVATOOL
Boring a hole .5" +/ .010" to .510 with MMC adds .020 to your TP (not .010).
CEM
No.
Whatever bonus you get from MMC diameter is added to the diameter positional tolerance, not the radial tolerance. So if the hole is .010 above low limit, there is another .010 on the diametral positional tolerance.
Beware of LMC, where the hole size above low limit subtracts from the hole positional tolerance.

Originally Posted by CEM
Boring a hole .5" +/ .010" to .510 with MMC adds .020 to your TP (not .010).
CEM
In the example above, at .510, wouldn't he be .020 above the lower limit of .490?
Originally Posted by gbent
No.
Whatever bonus you get from MMC diameter is added to the diameter positional tolerance, not the radial tolerance. So if the hole is .010 above low limit, there is another .010 on the diametral positional tolerance.
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