Horizontal Bandsaw: Need help aligning long pieces of Ti for cutting.

Hello,
I have had a 4x6 Horizontal bandsaw for a little while now so I could cut out piece of 6AL-4V titanium to use as handles for knives. The length of cut is around 5.5", and I've got the saw cutting pretty well at this point, but I'm not able to repeatedly cut alongside the line I want to cut. I've spent hundreds of hours now trying to build different jigs or systems to cut the line I want, but I have not been able to get a fully working solution. I'd like to have almost no material to sand off after I'm done sawing because it takes so long to sand stuff down, and I always end up burning myself.
I've tried drilling holes in wood just to hold the knife handle while I manually try to position it for the cut, and I'm just unable to be accurate with that system. I've tried many, many variations of jigs that I can bolt my handles to to account for the angle and such (so I can just leave the saw vise in the same position every time). Here are some pictures of the closest I have to a solution, but it still seems like it only works sometimes.




I added those tabs on the first picture so it wouldn't somehow change the alignment when I put each piece on, but it still doesn't work. The pictures after it (showing the Ti on the Jig) include those pieces now, but I don't have any more test pieces to put on.

As you can see in those pictures, the jig can function perfectly and allow a nice, accurate cut. However, it seems that something is not working right because right after I did that cut, I put another scale on (same exact hole locations and dimensions) and it left way too much material (almost 1mm).
Does anyone here happen to have advice for me regarding how to make repeatable and accurate cuts? Every time the saw messes up, it ruins quite a bit of work, and it's really starting to frustrate me.
Literally any solution to this would help immensely.

Thanks

Your problems are inherent design deficiencies in the saw. You can either try to get a better saw or else you need to greatly modify the blade guide system.

This will be a lot of work.

Unfortunately, there is a reason why HF can sell stuff cheap. It is only partly there.

A blade can make all the difference, I found Starrett 99102 cuts Ti very well: Intenss PRO-DIE Band Saw Blades

Better read the sticky at the top and take the "unmentionable" out of your post, otherwise it's:

Sounds like you need a wire EDM not a bandsaw lol...

The fact that a hf saw does not work is a surprise to you? It is a useless POS of a imitation saw, it will never work properly as it is not a saw. It is a saw shaped object designed to be built as cheaply as possible with function taking a back seat to all other concerns.

moonlight machine said:

The fact that a hf saw does not work is a surprise to you? It is a useless POS of a imitation saw, it will never work properly as it is not a saw. It is a saw shaped object designed to be built as cheaply as possible with function taking a back seat to all other concerns.

Click to expand...

Now now, it probably​ works ok in pine or balsa

Terry Keeley said:

A blade can make all the difference, I found Starrett 99102 cuts Ti very well: Intenss PRO-DIE Band Saw Blades

Better read the sticky at the top and take the "unmentionable" out of your post, otherwise it's:

Click to expand...

Which locks are those?

Those are the famous "Milacron Locks"!

Capt. Oblivious

plastikdreams said:

Now now, it probably​ works ok in pine or balsa

Click to expand...

He wants to cut Ti on a hf toy saw! Spew coffee on the keyboard - R O F LOL!

moonlight machine said:

He wants to cut Ti on a hf toy saw! Spew coffee on the keyboard - R O F LOL!

Click to expand...

yeah its pretty outlandish lol

I have zero experience with a hf saw, so I won't flame you for it. Everybody starts somewhere. Saws can be very illusive to get cutting straight. If you are sure that the pivot isn't sloppy, it is set up at 90 degrees in travel and the rollers or guides keep that blade where it needs to be. Get yourself a good blade and tension it properly. If you don't, even the best of saws won't cut straight. The are a ton of you tube videos on these lower end saws, that have good tips and modifications. Once again a good blade and tension it properly.

What's the cost difference between the saw you bought and a decent one? What's your time worth per hour?

Assuming $75/hour and 200 hours ("I've spent hundreds of hours") messing with jigs that don't work ($15,000), you'd be ahead of where you are now with a $10k saw that could cut reliably.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Ziggy2 said:

Which locks are those?

Click to expand...

Brentford Lock, London.

But I think the "Milicron Lock" is more accurate here.

Good tooling can improve your odds on cheap machines. If you are using a HF saw , I hope you are not using a HF blade.
Call a real tooling supplier and get a high end blade with the correct geometry and TPI for what you are trying to do.
Make sure that you are using conservative speeds and a lot of coolant. If you do all those things and it still doesn't work, probably time for a better saw, or maybe get somebody to waterjet them.

Weasel said:

Good tooling can improve your odds on cheap machines. If you are using a HF saw , I hope you are not using a HF blade.
Call a real tooling supplier and get a high end blade with the correct geometry and TPI for what you are trying to do.
Make sure that you are using conservative speeds and a lot of coolant. If you do all those things and it still doesn't work, probably time for a better saw, or maybe get somebody to waterjet them.

Click to expand...

I used to cut 718 Inconel on a Carolina Tool bandsaw and it did OK.
M42 blade made all the difference.

Actually, it cuts the Ti fine, I just am having trouble positioning my Ti to be cut.

I'll have to check about the tensioning. I've got a Lenox Diemaster 2 that does a pretty good job cutting, and much fewer TPI for the longer cut.

Terry Keeley said:

A blade can make all the difference, I found Starrett 99102 cuts Ti very well: Intenss PRO-DIE Band Saw Blades

Better read the sticky at the top and take the "unmentionable" out of your post, otherwise it's:

Click to expand...

Thanks for the advice on the blade! I'll have to give that a try whenever my current one dies.

For what they cost, those 4X6 bandsaws are actually a bargain. But they are NOT a really professional item and they do have more than one source of inaccuracy/non-repeatability. The advice of others about getting a better saw is good, but I can understand if you may not want to go that route.

They don't call the imported tools "kits" without reason. You need to do some work on them to get good results. You saved the money but you pay it back in labor. Things you can look into on your saw include:

A better blade. Those saws are generally shipped with the cheapest blade available. Those blades can cause many problems, including wandering while cutting. The general advise is to get a bi-metal blade from a good manufacturer. Starrett has been mentioned and they are one such, but there are others. DO get a better blade.

These saws have adjustable guides. You should bring those guides as close to the work as possible if you want the best repeatability.

Look at the hinges that the upper part of the saw pivots on. Chances are they will have a lot of end play in them. You can add shim washers to tighten them up. This will make your saw a LOT more repeatable.

When you change the saw blade, pay particular attention to the blade tension and alignment. Generally they need a lot of tension and the alignment must be correct. If the manual that came with your saw does not have good instructions on blade installation, you can get manuals for other brands for free on the internet. Download two or three of them and read them all.

I have a 4X6 from an importer that I consider better than HF and I can make accurate cuts with it.

I hope I got this in before the lock. If you need to discuss this more, try here:

http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net/forums/3-General

I'm a knifemaker, and I like to help other knifemakers when I can. It does not appear that anyone has really addressed your issue with suggestions that will solve your problem other than get a better machine or blade. Those might be the answer, I don't know, because you have shown virtually no methodology to your process. I cannot make sense of your jig and how it works. I might be missing the entire point, but it sure would be helpful to know how you are doing what you are doing. If you could post some photos of your saw and setup, the way you are making your cut, ie, horizontally, vertically, whatever it would sure give me (us) a better concept of how you are making your cuts, and how to help with your problem. How thick is the material you are cutting, what finished size are you trying to cut, are you cutting end length AND width? And, how are you cutting the excess when it is oversize, you say you get burned I don't mean something like "I sand it", I mean what are you using to sand it, info like that.. Do you have any other machinery at your disposal?
Thanks,
Ron