How do you lube Surface Grinder

AlexKu · Aug 25, 2007

Guys, how do you lube a surface grinder?
I have Abrasive Co 1.5 grinder. Table slides on flat and V-type ways. Do I need to take table off and clean, lube ways or just apply it where I can accesses it(a couple of inches on both ends).

During transportation the table was taken off temporarily so abrasive dust could have gotten on it.
My concern is that if some abrasive grit got onto sliding ways and might interfere with precision and also will damage ways.

BTW This surface grinder has a bunch of holes for oiling. Is it OK if I use light motor oil everywhere including spindle?

Thanks,
Alex

aboard_epsilon · Aug 25, 2007

You are going to have to source a manual from somewhere ...
name the machine, perhaps someone can help ...
spindle bearings will require the right type of oil ...no other ...
most are sealed for life or have oil reservoir.

mine, a Jones and Shipman 540 has auto-lube ... hydraulic oil is constantly pumped to the ways and any grit that gets in the way, is flushed away and settles in containers each side of the table ...or the bottom of the oil tank.

crude but works very well.

All the best..mark

Kevco · Aug 25, 2007

Not familar with your machine but I'll try to help. Are the holes big enough that 90 degree flap cups could have been there at one time? That is pretty common on older ones. Reids use that then have "pockets " inside with spring loaded rollers that lube the table when moved. Some Parkers have the same thing with a wave groove for the oil to go through.
Any oil is better than none but I'd use way lube. Taking the table off is always a good idea when first getting something to see if anything is messed up. I'd suggest doing that and cleaning up and oiling everything when reassembling. Kevin

AlexKu · Aug 26, 2007

On the top of the spindle shaft there is a glass container that drips oil into spindle shaft. Label says to use light spindle oil. There are more oil
"inputs" covered with caps. I assume they need the way oil.
Attached pictures of the grinder with the table removed. I'll probable also will remove cross table so I can access cross ways to clean them.

aboard_epsilon · Aug 26, 2007

would guess at Mobil dte light in the glass container for the spindle and Mobil vacoline 1405 for the ways.

my shipman uses Mobil vacoline for the ways and all hydraulics ...

i would if i could replace the way oiler cups with similar glass oiler as on the spindle ...so you got constant oil supply washing away crap from grinding

all the best...mark

Kevco · Aug 26, 2007

aboard_epsilon,
He doesn't need to replace the cups. If you notice where they lead to there are rollers on springs. These "pockets" are supposed to be about 1/3 full of oil so they self lube the table EVERY time it is moved. The rllers ride on the V's, bring up oil as they do. You want to fill the pockets with oil BEFORE reassembly, then just add as needed by opening the cap and see when it has gone down. I for one would think glass oiler in the way. Plus the fact, if you filled them they be higher than the top of the pockets and just leak all the oil out in a hurry! Kevin

Barry Lanier · Aug 26, 2007

Any of you guys got any pictures of a Brown and Sharp's table lube rollers? I now realize after seeing these pics what is missing from the grinder i have tore all over my shop. Another problem.To be overcome. They don't look to bad to make. But I need an idea how the spring loaded mech looks like on the B&S. Better yet anyone parting out a #2 B&S grinder I never get that lucky. I have several hours work in this project or I would part mine. Thanks in advance Barry Lanier

Kevco · Aug 26, 2007

Barry,
Like you noticed, it isn't rocket science once you see it. Looks like his are suspended with a screw, having a bent groove to hold the roller in place. On most of the ones I've seen they are just spring steel bent into a "W" shape, turned upside down, with the roller trapped in the low. You just have to make sure the roller is ABOVE the contact point of the table V or flat. Simple and effective system. When I got my Reid 2 of the springs were broken and if I had run it as is without inspecting, I would have wore it out fast. I you have access to a lathe, Make the rollers yourself and bend up the spring steel W's. Hope this helps, Kevin

AlexKu · Aug 26, 2007

I wonder if you suppose to empty "oil pockets" once in a while, otherwise the pockets get filled with accumulated abrasives particles.

I've put some 30 SAE Motor oil in the glass oiler. Hope I didn't screw the spindle by that. I'll replace it with light spindle oil eventually.

Barry Lanier · Aug 26, 2007

After some more cleaning and thinking I could copy the way the one in the pics look by drilling a hole and tapping. Any reccomedations on material for wheels Thanks Barry

magicmaker · Aug 26, 2007

My Boyar-Schultz 612 is similar. Oil just flows through the machine to cleanse everything.

Here are the oilers for the vert ways and crank arm for height:
http://www.jamesriser.com/Machinery/BoyarSchultzOilPics/TopOilers3361.jpg

Here is the oil hole (with sealing plug in place) for all of the way table ways (x & Y movement):
http://www.jamesriser.com/Machinery/BoyarSchultzOilPics/TableOiler3362.jpg

I really need to pump in a lot of oil here as it keeps running out to fill oil grooves etc. when starting up a grinding session.

I do not want to lift my table up right now; but here is a view of the right way ends:
http://www.jamesriser.com/Machinery/BoyarSchultzOilPics/TableWayEnds3364.jpg

Barely seen are oil grooves in the ways. My grinder has a much more intricate oil groove pattern along the ways to move lubricant the full length of both the flat and V ways.

The only other lube hole is for the table crank arm:
http://www.jamesriser.com/Machinery/BoyarSchultzOilPics/TableCrankOilHole3363.jpg

I tried several types of oils when I first set up the grinder and gave up on oils. Way oil was too "sticky" and thick. The table actually lifted up on the oil until things warmed up giving a lousy grind. It was so sticky that I could barely crank the table back and forth. I settled on ATF (automatic transmission fluid) as the only lube on the whole machine and could not be happier. When a good film of ATF is on the ways, the table glides easily back and forth and does not change height in the middle of a grind.
Jim

Oops... I forgot to mention that the spindle bearings are sealed on mine.

AlexKu · Aug 27, 2007

Guys,

is it important to level your surface grinder. The floor in my garage is has a slight slope, I wonder if I really have to buy leveling feet.

Kevco · Aug 27, 2007

AlexKu,
If you get enough sludge in the pockets to fill them up you've got other problems! DO NOT use an air hose around the ways. You'll end up forcing grit into the ways. your machine will wear out much quicker if you insist on doing it.
Turcite makes the tables smooth, but in my experience, it traps ANY piece of grit and makes it like sandpaper on the V's. I prefer not having it if I have a choice.
30 weight would be a little too thick, switch it out. Kevin

aboard_epsilon · Aug 27, 2007

just looked up the old details of my machine ...if it were an older machine with plain babet spindle bearings it would use mobil velocite number 3

all the best.mark

AlexKu · Aug 27, 2007

How can I find out if mine has plain babet spindle bearings. Will you be able to tell from the spindle picture?

aboard_epsilon · Aug 27, 2007

you may be able to see the lead coloured end of it after removing the stone .

all the best.mark

aboard_epsilon · Aug 27, 2007

and

not sure how you get this ..weather this is a lending library or what

http://catalog.dalnet.lib.mi.us/ipac20/ipac.jsp?session=1Y88G42418D32.23599&profile=henryford&source=~!merge&view=subscriptionsummary&uri=full=3100033~!91002~!3&ri=8&aspect=subtab3 18&menu=search&ipp=20&spp=20&staffonly=&term=Abrasive+Machine+Tool+Company.&index=.AW&uindex=&aspect=subtab318&menu=search&ri=8#focus

stephen thomas · Aug 27, 2007

Barry, sent you an email, there are more pictures, but here are the basics on the B & S in case anyone else needs them. Note the springs are as someone else described, sort of "W" shaped. In the B & S #2, they are not attached, they rest on milled pads in the pockets and float. The width would be a clearance fit to your pocket, the shape just enough to add some pressure. Notice the ends of the "flats" are slightly upturned to prevent diggin in. The axles ought to be steel, but the wheels could be delrin, or most any oil resistant material that can be securely attached to the axle.

The width between the wheels for the flat ways is essentially a nice clearance for the flat spring width, as is the distane between the small "hubs" inboard of the wheels for the Vee ways.

smt

custardcats · Jun 24, 2017

aboard_epsilon said:
would guess at Mobil dte light in the glass container for the spindle and Mobil vacoline 1405 for the ways.

my shipman uses Mobil vacoline for the ways and all hydraulics ...

i would if i could replace the way oiler cups with similar glass oiler as on the spindle ...so you got constant oil supply washing away crap from grinding

all the best...mark

For the head with PLAIN bearings use ISO 5 HYDRAULIC OIL. Normal running temperature is 160 degrees C - end float 2 tenths/thou

tdmidget · Jun 26, 2017

magicmaker said:
My Boyar-Schultz 612 is similar. Oil just flows through the machine to cleanse everything.

Here are the oilers for the vert ways and crank arm for height:
http://www.jamesriser.com/Machinery/BoyarSchultzOilPics/TopOilers3361.jpg

Here is the oil hole (with sealing plug in place) for all of the way table ways (x & Y movement):
http://www.jamesriser.com/Machinery/BoyarSchultzOilPics/TableOiler3362.jpg

I really need to pump in a lot of oil here as it keeps running out to fill oil grooves etc. when starting up a grinding session.

I do not want to lift my table up right now; but here is a view of the right way ends:
http://www.jamesriser.com/Machinery/BoyarSchultzOilPics/TableWayEnds3364.jpg

Barely seen are oil grooves in the ways. My grinder has a much more intricate oil groove pattern along the ways to move lubricant the full length of both the flat and V ways.

The only other lube hole is for the table crank arm:
http://www.jamesriser.com/Machinery/BoyarSchultzOilPics/TableCrankOilHole3363.jpg

I tried several types of oils when I first set up the grinder and gave up on oils. Way oil was too "sticky" and thick. The table actually lifted up on the oil until things warmed up giving a lousy grind. It was so sticky that I could barely crank the table back and forth. I settled on ATF (automatic transmission fluid) as the only lube on the whole machine and could not be happier. When a good film of ATF is on the ways, the table glides easily back and forth and does not change height in the middle of a grind.
Jim

Oops... I forgot to mention that the spindle bearings are sealed on mine.

Rein in that imagination. Automatic transmission "fluid" is hydraulic oil with a red dye.

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