Tricone Well drilling Bit ideas

Geo NR Gee · Sep 23, 2011

It looks like a lot of knowledgeable folks hang out here from some of the posts I have previewed. My friend and I recently purchased some tricone bits to use in drilling boreholes for geothermal heating and cooling. We are trying to use them with a Hydra-Drill well drilling system.

The Hydra-Drill rig has been beefed up a little to use the tricone bit, but the part that I am having a problem with is making an adapter to go from the tricone tapered threads to the small 1.375 (approx.).

I have a 6" Atlas Lathe but don't know if it (or I) could duplicate the threads. Or would welding a coupler onto the tricone bit that the drill stems use work?

Any help would be appreciated.

Geo NR Gee · Sep 23, 2011

Here is the picture of the tricone bit.

FishTaco · Sep 23, 2011

it is best left up to the professionals, that thread is a API Tapered thread Probably 3 TPF and 5 Threads per inch with a .04 Rad at the bottom of the thread. It required a special gage with a stand off to shoulder the bit correctly. You are looking for a downhole tool called a SUB with the two different connections you want on it. It would be made out of 4140 HTSR or even better 4340 Vmod.

FishTaco · Sep 23, 2011

double post.

Geo NR Gee · Sep 23, 2011

Thanks for your reply. So its called a Sub adapter. Thats it. Unfortunately I have more time than money. Would I be able to weld to the bit? Or is this something that would weaken the bit?

FishTaco · Sep 23, 2011

Does your lathe have a taper turning attachment? Generally speaking in the oil industry you arent allowed to weld tools. I have built 1000's of different downhole tools in my career, no one welds the threads in case of it breaking off down hole. There are a few exceptions to that rule, that tricone bit is 3 different pieces welded together. It was more than likely x-rayed after welding. In my oppinion welding the bit is a bad idea. Call a company called Cobra Machine in Nisku Alberta, it might be cheaper then you think to get a Sub Adapter made.

true temper · Sep 23, 2011

I am not sure your rig and drill pipe is tough enough for a bit like that.

For a sub you might try these guys, Mills Machine Company - Earth Drilling Products - millsmachine.com

Geo NR Gee · Sep 23, 2011

I don't believe that Atlas manufactured a tapered turning attachment, but some folks that have made them and posted it on youtube. I am not shy of trying to do it myself, but if someone has the tools to do it for a good price, then that may be the way to go.

Keep in mind that I am only going 200 ft. per borehole. I am only using a 6 hp motor for the drill rig also.

Mike C. · Sep 24, 2011

If you had a good sized engine lathe with a nice telecsopic taper attach, this might be a good project. A 6" Atlas is a great lathe for making model railroad parts or maybe R/C airplane or car bits. It is just not enough machine for this kind of industrial work. It's like putting a fifth wheel hitch on your 4wheel ATV to haul semi trailers with.

I seriously doubt a 6" Atlas can be set up to cut a 3TPI thread, to boot. If you can figure out the proper gearing and get it set you are probably going to have to drive the leadscrew with the motor and let it back-drive the spindle. If there is a taper attach for a 6" Atlas, it'll be a non-telescopic taper, so you'll have to take the cross slide leadscrew out to use it and do all your depth of cut adjustment with the compound. This is one of those things that you will come out cheaper buying, even if it costs a lot.

Tony Wells · Sep 24, 2011

Somehow I have trouble thinking a 6 hp motor will drive a 4 3/4" bit efficiently. What are you using to circulate the fluid? What fluid?

Adapter or crossover sub would be the recommended way to change from that 2 7/8 thread. You have a means to torque that bit up?

Geo NR Gee · Sep 24, 2011

Tony Wells said:
Somehow I have trouble thinking a 6 hp motor will drive a 4 3/4" bit efficiently. What are you using to circulate the fluid? What fluid?

Adapter or crossover sub would be the recommended way to change from that 2 7/8 thread. You have a means to torque that bit up?

I have a 5 hp mud pump originally paired to go along with the drill rig. We are using bentonite and polymer based material designed for what I am doing.

On torqueing the bit up, I don't know if you mean when it is installed or when it is in use?

Geo NR Gee · Sep 24, 2011

Mike C. said:
If you had a good sized engine lathe with a nice telecsopic taper attach, this might be a good project. A 6" Atlas is a great lathe for making model railroad parts or maybe R/C airplane or car bits. It is just not enough machine for this kind of industrial work. It's like putting a fifth wheel hitch on your 4wheel ATV to haul semi trailers with.

I seriously doubt a 6" Atlas can be set up to cut a 3TPI thread, to boot. If you can figure out the proper gearing and get it set you are probably going to have to drive the leadscrew with the motor and let it back-drive the spindle. If there is a taper attach for a 6" Atlas, it'll be a non-telescopic taper, so you'll have to take the cross slide leadscrew out to use it and do all your depth of cut adjustment with the compound. This is one of those things that you will come out cheaper buying, even if it costs a lot.

The atlas lathe was used by my gramps back in the 60's. I never met him, but my mother said he spent a lot of time cutting metal. Your probably right about coming out cheaper buying it. Thanks.

WizardOfBoz · Sep 24, 2011

Mike C. said:
I seriously doubt a 6" Atlas can be set up to cut a 3TPI thread, to boot.

If there is a taper attach for a 6" Atlas, it'll be a non-telescopic taper, so you'll have to take the cross slide leadscrew out to use it and do all your depth of cut adjustment with the compound. This is one of those things that you will come out cheaper buying, even if it costs a lot.

I think that the OP had a typo, and that he was wanting to say 3 ipf taper, 5 tpi threads (yes?). Agree that this could be a new adventure in machining on a 6 inch Atlas, and cutting taper threads in a large-diameter chrome-moly workpiece, with the taper complications you mention, would be tough.

The Atlas 10 had as low as 4 tpi threading, not sure about the 6 inch. The 6 inch DID have a taper attachment (below). 3 inches per foot may be beyound the range of that thing, though.

Tony Wells · Sep 24, 2011

Geo NR Gee said:
I have a 5 hp mud pump originally paired to go along with the drill rig. We are using bentonite and polymer based material designed for what I am doing.

On torqueing the bit up, I don't know if you mean when it is installed or when it is in use?

I meant when making up that joint. You have a breakout unit or tongs on your rig? Have any pictures that you'd share?

Geo NR Gee · Sep 24, 2011

Tony Wells said:
I meant when making up that joint. You have a breakout unit or tongs on your rig? Have any pictures that you'd share?

Oh, ok, well I just use a couple of pipe wrenches and a long pipe for leverage. The picture is the model that I have. Still more of a toy drill rig. HD2001 - Deep Rock Manufacturing

The unit needs to be portable for locations that are remote or don't have access with large equipment. Also cost is a factor.

My drill rig has been modified to work more like a Portadrillmini PORTADRILLMINI MODELS

Kingbob · Sep 24, 2011

Making subs and the like for the oilfield is a big part of what I do for a living. if you can get me so dimensions on that Connection I will be able to identify it for you and also be able to provide you with a drawing for the female version of this thread or I can even quote you a price for a crossover sub to connect this back to your drill string.

4GSR · Sep 24, 2011

Geo NR Gee said:
The picture is the model that I have. Still more of a toy drill rig. HD2001 - Deep Rock Manufacturing

My drill rig has been modified to work more like a Portadrillmini PORTADRILLMINI MODELS

Attaching a 4-3/4 Tri cone bit to that unit is looking for big trouble! Ouch!

Better off sticking with a fish tail bits.

If you are trying to get through hard rock/granite formations, I think some kind of percussion bit setup would be a better setup. Just need a large Compressor!

Ken

Geo NR Gee · Sep 24, 2011

Geo NR Gee said:
Here is the picture of the tricone bit.

Kingbob said:
Making subs and the like for the oilfield is a big part of what I do for a living. if you can get me so dimensions on that Connection I will be able to identify it for you and also be able to provide you with a drawing for the female version of this thread or I can even quote you a price for a crossover sub to connect this back to your drill string.

Is any information that you need identifiable from the picture of the actual bit and packaging on this picture?

Geo NR Gee · Sep 24, 2011

4GSR said:
Attaching a 4-3/4 Tri cone bit to that unit is looking for big trouble! Ouch!

Better off sticking with a fish tail bits.

If you are trying to get through hard rock/granite formations, I think some kind of percussion bit setup would be a better setup. Just need a large Compressor!

Ken

We used the drag bit that has been coated with grits of hardened metal, but it only lasted 45 feet before the material was gone. Mostly the ground around here is unconsolidated material with small rock, sand and gravel. I only ran into trouble with a couple of football sized rock. A local geothermal driller uses a 4 3/4 Tricone bit for boreholes up to 300 ft. He owns the Portadrillmini unit.

I do have a large compressor available, but the then that requires a new bit. Maybe I will have to go that way if this plan doesn't work out.

RDL · Sep 24, 2011

Geo NR Gee said:
... Maybe I will have to go that way if this plan doesn't work out.

The XO sub you require is called a Bit Sub which is box box connections. You have a very ambitious project and it may work in certain conditions but when it doesn't you will probably have a major headache. A hydraulic puller may be required.

The makeup torque is important because if the joint slips downhole it will over tighten. How are you controlling the torque applied to the drill string? I suspect that the string is of light built so dynamic torque will be minimized but you might be surprised at the loading on the bottom connections when the bit jams and comes to a quick stop.

What is the configuration of the drill string? How much Weight on Bit and rotation do you expect to use?

Where will be the neutral point? If you have 1.375" pipe in 4.75" hole you should consider pipe buckling. You will also have to look at stabilization to keep the hole straight and somewhat pointing downwards. All those things increase the torque required.

I suggest talking to anyone who has made holes in the area so that you can anticipate and influence the odds.

Tricone Well drilling Bit ideas

Plastic

Plastic

Attachments

Aluminum

Aluminum

Plastic

Aluminum

Stainless

Plastic

Diamond

Banned

Plastic

Plastic

Diamond

Banned

Plastic

Attachments

Stainless

Diamond

Plastic

Attachments

Plastic

Stainless

Similar threads