Massive touch screen control???

Mebfab · Nov 4, 2014

Vertical Machining Centers | CNC Machine Tools - DM

Anyone heard of or seen this machine? PC control? Massive touch screen!

traditional-tools · Nov 4, 2014

That is pretty cool, although Windows 8 ? :rolleyes5:

HuFlungDung · Nov 4, 2014

I don't think what version of Windows matters too much, since the application runs full screen.

What I don't see a lot of use for is standing there and making up a part on the screen. Hardly likely a full fledged CadCAM system on board. Oh, lots of general procedures can be done in a general manner, no doubt.

Anyone actually stand and wave their arms on a big touch screen for a while? It gets tiresome on the arms. I fully appreciate the scaling up of tiny mouse movments onto big screen sweeps. That's something that the tech world doesn't seem to recognize in the rush to make everything touch screen this and that. It has some use, but is not the be all and end all of all interfaces.

jrmach · Nov 4, 2014

The screen looks like something I could live without,,unless you could watch Football on it too.

oldbikerdude37 · Nov 5, 2014

I would want my screen to play rock videos.

traditional-tools · Nov 5, 2014

I don't know, can't have too much real estate on the screen. Much of the information that is looked up in the Machinery's Handbook can be done online and/or electronic documents. Opens up a lot of possibilities. That goes for having your favorite music video also.

I scoffed at them using Windows 8, mostly because I don't use Windows very much unless I'm forced, but Windows 8 is hated by most all people. It's almost like the rotten egg of the microsoft systems, possibly only second to vista. Seems like some irony there...they may be using some "special feature" of Windows 8 with their remote support...just that the thought of having an ms operating system around sharp tooling...is well, scary, in the same way it is to have it in automobiles. :ack2:

HuFlungDung · Nov 5, 2014

I don't know about this particular controller, but I'd guess they probably drive the machine with a dedicated motion control card. Modern versions of the OS are so virtualized now, that one dare not trust actual machine control to the whims of a flakey OS.

Having composed my own machine control logic using Camsoft and Windows 98, I can say I appreciate all the bug kills done in most black box controllers. There's thousands of ways to screw up controller logic. And, it takes a long time, and lots of different operators to actually discover all those bugs. That is what I found out about Camsoft's controller: the basics are there, but protecting yourself and your machine from normal operational booboos takes lots of thought and logic planning.

Camsoft also included a rudimentary cadcam: I never touched it. Not comprehensive enough, and I'll be damned if I'm going to learn and run more than one cadcam system at a time.

jast.313 · Nov 5, 2014

Mebfab said:
Vertical Machining Centers | CNC Machine Tools - DM

Anyone heard of or seen this machine? PC control? Massive touch screen!

We decided to use a large 39” 4K monitor because that is roughly the size of other conventional operator panels. Essentially we have replaced conventional buttons with touch buttons (similar to smart phones). There are ~10 different windows that an operator may want to interact with while using the machine, each of these windows can be docked in any location or floated. You can also show multiple graphics screens simultaneously for different programs or subroutines. The screen fills up fast when you have this sort of information at your finger tips!

We can also connect a camera(s) inside of the machine, and view it on the screen.

This large screen also helps at the machine programming. You’d be surprised how fast you can program many parts using the built in software and large screen. We’re so confident of this, we put our training videos online for anyone to watch (Learn How To CNC Program with DM-CAM | Conversational CNC Software Programming Training Videos - DM)

While this is not meant to replace CAD/CAM, it can be used to program “almost” anything… this is proven on 1000s of machines running DM CNC world wide. And of course, our machines can run GCodes like any other machine for those external CAD/CAM programs.

-Jas Trounson
Lead Software Developer, DM

dsergison · Nov 5, 2014

can you disable the touchscreen momentarily and very easily so you can clean the screen without pressing important stuff, while running?

Abeship · Nov 5, 2014

Personally I think it looks like an impressive machine for the price... I think the 4k monitor is overkill but that doesn't hurt I suppose. I wonder the failure rate of a touch screen compared to the failure rate of traditional buttons on a cnc.

EDIT: Just looked a little more on the site. I am not sure why you require 15mbps internet in the shop to run the machine. Care to elaborate on that?

jast.313 · Nov 5, 2014

dsergison said:
can you disable the touchscreen momentarily and very easily so you can clean the screen without pressing important stuff, while running?

Great question. At the moment, there is no user friendly way... but just unplugging the USB cable behind the monitor would do the trick. We'll keep this in mind for future improvements.

jast.313 · Nov 5, 2014

Abeship said:
Personally I think it looks like an impressive machine for the price... I think the 4k monitor is overkill but that doesn't hurt I suppose. I wonder the failure rate of a touch screen compared to the failure rate of traditional buttons on a cnc.

EDIT: Just looked a little more on the site. I am not sure why you require 15mbps internet in the shop to run the machine. Care to elaborate on that?

Thanks for the compliment! Yes, we understand that the monitor "looks" overkill. However, I have personally used it quite a bit... and when I go back to a smaller 19" monitor on other machines, it feels painful. Once you use the large monitor, you'll never want to go back. We've used the same type of monitor on our desktop stations for about a year now (ever since they were released) and have had no problems. The monitor cabinet is properly ventilated, so heat is not an issue. In our experience, monitors in general have high reliability. The touchscreen should be more reliable than conventional buttons. There are no moving parts to wear out. The screen is just a normal piece of glass and sensors around the perimeter. The senors are well protected to prevent debris from causing a problem.

The Internet needs to be "high speed" if/when the operator requires support. It's also useful for backing up programs, cloud storage, remote access of the machine and a whole host of other uses. We specified 15mbps, only to convey "high speed". We basically don't want people trying to use dialup. We recommend leaving the internet connected full time, but it can be disconnected for normal operation without problem.

DDoug · Nov 5, 2014

oldbikerdude37 said:
I would want my screen to play rock videos.

Fur shure.....
From the album "keep your hands off my power supply"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bHoPYLQvnQM

Abeship · Nov 5, 2014

Nice to see a reply

I like the fact that it is 39" on the monitor, I think that is exceptional (bigger is always better right). Where I think it is overkill is the 4k resolution, I have two desktops monitors, one 1440p and one 1080p, the difference in pixels between the two is pretty big. I can only imagine what 39" of 4k is like. Out of curiosity, why did you decide on 4k vs 1440, or 1080?

Mtndew · Nov 5, 2014

jast.313 said:
Great question. At the moment, there is no user friendly way... but just unplugging the USB cable behind the monitor would do the trick. We'll keep this in mind for future improvements.

Who the hell wants to disconnect cables to clean the damn screen?

tjd10684 · Nov 5, 2014

Maybe a button on screen similar to your smart phone unlock. You lock it by pressing the lock button then to unlock you have to swipe a certain way or something.

My main concern would be is this monitor proprietary? If your touching a screen after handling chips and stuff odds are your going to scratch up the screen and it would be a real PITA, and wallet, to replace. Its hard enough to find regular screens for older machines I would hate to brick the whole system in 5 years because I can't get a replacement screen.

traditional-tools · Nov 5, 2014

Mtndew said:
Who the hell wants to disconnect cables to clean the damn screen?

Someone who wants a clean screen ?

You couldn't find anything better to gripe about?

Philabuster · Nov 5, 2014

Bad ass!

The new Sodick Wire EDM we have also uses a touch screen control (running Windows 7) which totally rocks. It took me about 1 day to get used to it, but no more buttons is a good thing.

One thing I would add (if not included) is a manual pendant control with a MPG wheel. Lots of larger machining centers have a pendant and it makes life MUCH EASIER when you have your face inside the machine doing a setup.

Touch screens suck ASS when you are not looking at the screen and happen to touch stuff. A manual touchscreen lockout is mandatory IMHO.

The hard buttons on the old controls give people a tactile feel and do not need to see what they are doing as their fingers already know where the correct buttons are located.

The built in trichordial milling paths and the ability to digitize a 2D part contour was just cool as shit. :eek:

jast.313 · Nov 5, 2014

tjd10684 said:
Maybe a button on screen similar to your smart phone unlock. You lock it by pressing the lock button then to unlock you have to swipe a certain way or something.

My main concern would be is this monitor proprietary? If your touching a screen after handling chips and stuff odds are your going to scratch up the screen and it would be a real PITA, and wallet, to replace. Its hard enough to find regular screens for older machines I would hate to brick the whole system in 5 years because I can't get a replacement screen.

The screen itself is a standard off the shelf monitor. We add a touchframe in front of the screen which is less standard only because there are few consumer level touchframes. One of our design goals was to use as many off the shelf components as possible for economy of scale...

jast.313 · Nov 5, 2014

Philabuster said:
Bad ass!

The new Sodick Wire EDM we have also uses a touch screen control (running Windows 7) which totally rocks. It took me about 1 day to get used to it, but no more buttons is a good thing.

One thing I would add (if not included) is a manual pendant control with a MPG wheel. Lots of larger machining centers have a pendant and it makes life MUCH EASIER when you have your face inside the machine doing a setup.

Touch screens suck ASS when you are not looking at the screen and happen to touch stuff. A manual touchscreen lockout is mandatory IMHO.

The hard buttons on the old controls give people a tactile feel and do not need to see what they are doing as their fingers already know where the correct buttons are located.

The built in trichordial milling paths and the ability to digitize a 2D part contour was just cool as shit.

Yes, we have found the same regarding touchscreen buttons. The best part is customizing the screen for the operators desire

We also include an MPG standard. This is such an important part of operating a machine... Here's a video that shows this in action

Massive touch screen control???

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