How smart is Smart car?

We've been eying the Smart fortwo for a couple years but could not see a big advantage over my wife's traditional Subarus. However it is time for another car and we are seriously considering the Smart as a daily commutor.

Typical driving profile is ideal for this car, about 20K miles yearly for commute and work related. Daily commute is one driver, about 53 mile round trip on country roads and highway, then another 5 to 30 miles in town driving for meetings or errands. IOW, about 400 miles/week. In addition, up to another 10K mils/yr might be added by personal use with 2 people, or a few work related trips.

Again, realizing that *most* of this driving is one person + briefcase & pocketbook, the math works out somewhat favorably, even against the AWD Subaru which will be kept for longer trips with family, and winter days when AWD is useful. I will begin using the Subaru as around town transportation instead of my Silverado 4 x 4.

Lets call the Subaru overall mileage at 29, which is pretty realistic. Suppose the Smart gets 40 overall. That means that on 25K mi/yr, the advantage is Smart by 237 gals of gas/yr, or about 27% better than Subaru.

Unfortunately, as we just discovered, the Smart appears to take premium gas only. So the fuel price advantage over a year is smaller than 27%, about 20%, yielding a small annual savings of maybe $500 at current rates ($10/week)

Smart warranty is also "the skimpiest in the business" at 2 yrs/24K miles.

This car would work well for us, if we get 150K miles over 5 - 7 yrs.

Does anyone have long term experience (high miles) with a Smart? With 25+ yrs experience in them, I can say that Subarus are not the maintenance free vehicles legend would have it. But the engines (other than cam belt change at mid life) are near bullet proof, ditto the manual trans, but the rest of the drive train (axles, rear end, etc) is less steller, depending on model. How likely is a Smart to make it to 150+K miles, and what kind of annual maintenance costs are typical?

BTW, vehicle we are looking at is way under market price, owned by proverbial little (not too old) lady who pampered it for only a couple K miles and needs to cut payments having other vehicles and diminished income. So first price is not a factor, but cost of use is.

Thanks!
smt

I don't know about their longevity, but I was impressed with some of the crash test footage I saw on them. That's a major factor in a car purchase for me (old Volvo guy here).

What are your chances of waking away if you get sandwiched between two of Detroits behemoths? I would reconsider, but then I don't feel safe in anything smaller than a Ford F-250.

If someone is going to make you a great deal that's always hard to overcome otherwise.

But, a Honda Civic or Toyota Yaris would be a far better ride. 20K miles per year is a fair amount if driving. Every mile represents risk. If I had to slammed into by the typical Suburban driven by a soccer mom a Smart car is the last thing I'd want to be in.

My uncle has a Yaris - I don't consider it especially safe either - but he does get around 37MPG average city/highway.

I don't ebleive for a second a Smart will be as reliable or maintenance free as a Toyota.

Any help?
http://www.smartz.co.uk/index_vb.php?

FWIW Quite a few in the UK and whilst allowing for the enthusiast factor, I've yet to speak to a dissapointed owner.

FWIW II They ain't arf nippy for their size, especially about town, the neatest trick is parking square on to the kerb

FWIW III The ones I've looked at are twin spark engines without a drain plug, you gotta suck the oil out.

FWIW IV Pattern parts are available in UK.

GregSY said:

I don't ebleive for a second a Smart will be as reliable or maintenance free as a Toyota.

Click to expand...

Two things here, isn't Smart a Mercedes?, (then why are they ashamed of it.?)

And, aren't Mercedes pretty fair in the reliability and maintenance dept's, compared to Toyota?

Inquiring minds want to know....

Bob

IMO, the "Smart" is dumb. For what you actually get, and give up........

it SHOULD cost about $11k. MAX

And it SHOULD get about 75 mpg.

It does NEITHER, it costs around $18k even jow, and it gets 40+ mpg as of my last check.

You are better off with a Prius, which gets similar mileage , and is actually a practical car that you could use.

20K is a lot more than I drive in a year, and I prefer a decent vehicle, not a "suit of clothes with wheels".

I have considered em, because I like the way they look.
And I have always driven small cars, and loved it.
So I am willing to take the risk of getting run over by a Buick.
I drove tiny sports cars, and will again.

But in a simple financial evaluation, I could not justify a Smart. For the money, its not THAT good of mileage. And there are several other small, equally cute cars, that get similar mileage, but are more useful.

I would look seriously at a Honda Fit and the new Mini.
Both get mileage very close to the smart, the Honda is in the same price range, the Mini only a bit more- and both are MUCH MUCH more practical.
You can not even carry 2 people and 2 bags of groceries in a Smart.
I have a good friend with a Fit- she sleeps in it on camping trips. It will seat 4, not like a Caddy, but you can do it. And Honda's are remarkably reliable- I have had several run for 150k to 200k with NOTHING but tires, oil changes, and brake shoes.

Now, IF they sold the diesel Smart here, and you could get the 70mpg the europeans get, that might change the equation some- but you cant, and probably wont ever be able to. Our diesel pollution standards are higher than Europe's, and they just arent legal here.

Reply

You'll want to think about security for parking. I know there have been a LOT of problems with "rowdies" flipping Smart cars over on their sides while they're parked, even in broad daylight. Apparently one not unusually strong fellow can usually do it alone, and the vehicles don't handle it well.

A yaris or corolla, probably about the same mileage and you have the
advantage of more of the vehicles made, so there's an economy of scale
for parts and so on.

The smart is, what, 70 hp three banger, the yaris is about 100 hp four banger.

For those of you who discuss the crash stats, well as a motorbike rider I can
say the smart car is quite decent. Plus it has that all-important red button.

Don't honestly think the smart car should be getting 70 mph gasoline.
My 250 cc dual-sport, gets about 50 mpg.

I guess for me the ability to carry more than two people in a pinch would be
the final arbiter. It would be a great car for driving to the train station or
for small shopping. Which honestly we do a lot.

Jim

BTW the single biggest risk factor in driving a suburban or an exploder, is
driving off the road and flipping over, during the first snowstorm around here,
or in anything other than a gentle summer drizzle. If you extrapolate from
the observables around here, anyway. Add in some texting or cell phone
use and all the guard rails and phone poles also become death-dealing hazards.

I agree with Ries, The Smart is cute and small but it really has no room for much. I know several people who own them as tenders to their RV's. They solo when going shopping in order to have cargo room. The Fit is a good choice as is the Mini, Yaris is one of the few Toyotas built in Japan and they are of good quality as well. My own choice would be the Mini. I had a Honda Civic when they were still small like the Mini and really enjoyed it, I don't care for the bigger new Civic.

The reliability of Smart cars is confounded by the fact that it uses Mitibushi engine without a direct comparison vehicle in the market. The Smart is a product of Mercedes Benz yet it not a Mercedes. My biggest gripe is that they are so small inside with very little other benifit over other models in MPG.

Steve

I have two friends who own smart cars - they both "like" them rather than "love" them.

I met up with one of the owners at a truck show last year and I rented a Prius - he couldn't believe how much nicer a ride the Prius was, how roomy it was and how snappy it was. I drove that car 4 days with a good mix of city and highway driving (in central Kansas where everything is basically flat) and averaged 43 mpg.

After the trip my buddy said if he had to do it over again, he would buy the Prius.

My other buddy lives in Thousand Oaks and commutes to Burbank every day by himself. He is happy with the economy and quality - niether of these guys work on their own vehicles so no comment on that end of the spectrum.

I think I'd enjoy this smartcar:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oPQIizRp9ck

You are a perfect canidate for a plug-in electric/ hybrid. Too bad we're too stoopid as a society to make some.

Rich

jamscal said:

I think I'd enjoy this smartcar:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oPQIizRp9ck

Click to expand...

I have a friend who did a "Busa" engined Smart, it broke an axle on the first test drive. A real whirling dervish

Steve

I'd like a SmartF2 for only one reason - ease of parking here in San Francisco. It doesn't seem to pay off for any other reasons.

SF2 - 106.1"
73 Austin Mini 120"
73 Honda Civic 139.8"
1992 Ford Festiva 140.5
2010 Mini 145.6
Honda Fit 161.6"

I had a Festiva (Kia-made Mazda 121 IIRC) and it was very handy around town and actually not bad out on the highway on 180 mile trips. What appeals to me would be something the size of an Austin Mini. SF2 could could add 14" (improving the ride and adding some interior room) but the new Mini needs to lose 25".

cheers,
Michael

Ries said:

I would look seriously at a Honda Fit and the new Mini.
Both get mileage very close to the smart, the Honda is in the same price range, the Mini only a bit more- and both are MUCH MUCH more practical.
.

Click to expand...

+1
After 30+ years of driving pickups I love my MINI and won't go back. Base price is about $19K, bells and whistles more like with any vehicle. I average 32 mpg and that's driving for performance not economy. 14,000 miles and zero complaints but the road noise might bother sedan drivers.

6 airbags but I've never had an accident so that's not a big concern, it's got a lot more zip to pull away from a situation than any pickup.

The Hondas seem really well built but the neighbor only gets 22 in her Element and another friend gets under 20 in her Passport.

Hmm- I have 94,000 miles on my Element- bought it new- and it consistently gets 25mpg.

But it is not a Fit.
A Fit is weighs 1000lbs less than an Element.
And it has a much smaller, and thus more efficient engine.
1500 cc versus 2500 cc.
35mpg Epa Estimate versus 25mpg Epa Estimate.

So I think its reasonable to expect 32-35mpg in a Fit, depending on how you drive it.

jamscal said:

I think I'd enjoy this smartcar:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oPQIizRp9ck

Click to expand...

Oh yeah, dang!

I'm down to riding one of my bikes, fairly often but only on local jaunts now. Makes me feel all fuzzy inside, knowin' my bod is protecting the motorsickle...

Always felt a little sorry for the paranoids who always sought out the fattest, heaviest lump-cage, "for safety". ...dreary...

Oh well, they may have been right all along, I haven't hit 71 yet, maybe my choice of vehicles will snuff me out in my youth... better hurry though..'til then, lovin' every minute.....
young-at heart Bob.

A big deal is made over these "smart cars" lately. I had a 1979 VW Rabbit diesel. 40mpg around town, 54mpg on a trip from Joisey to Florida, two adults, one kid and enough luggage for 5 people. It seated 4 comfortably, had a great trunk and when I got rid of it with 300K it only had valve cover gaskets replaced yearly due to leaks (later gaskets from Felpro cured this), two exhaust systems and regular oil and filter changes.

The car topped out at 82mph and could keep that speed come hell or high water.

If it were me, I would look into a small diesel car. More room, better mileage and a hell of a lot better warranty.