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OT-ish: How do they shape natural sharpening stones?

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Georgineer

Stainless
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Dec 27, 2008
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Portsmouth, England
A comment of George Wilson's in the Damascus Steel thread piqued my curiosity, and I felt it was worth opening a new thread for. Referring to a natural mined sharpening stone, George wrote "I have a very unusual one which is perfectly round in cross section,looking like a much elongated football."

I have an India stone and a Turkey stone which belonged to my late father, but have never given a thought to their origins, and particularly how they were shaped after the raw stone was mined or quarried. What would you use to shape them? Steel would be an obvious non-starter. Flat cuts could possibly be made with copper wires and abrasive grit, but how would a round one be shaped? How would you hold it and turn it? And how was it done in days of yore, before diamond-studded cutters were available? Can anybody enlighten me?

George
 
Stone has been shaped and worked for a long time. I have seen ancient Egyptian stone vases that must have been done on a lathe. For at least a couple of hundred years, soft iron or steel wire running over pulleys has been used to saw slabs, from huge to little. I saw a 19th century granite quarry in Massachusetts (now a park) where they used lathes to make large round columns and mooring bollards. The New England seaports have lots of those granite bollards along the old docks.

You can tour the Rock of Ages tombstone factory in Vermont and watch some of the ways they work granite. Tours and Activities | Rock of Ages Corporation

I flattened a worn hard Arkansas bench stone on my surface grinder.

Larry
 
There is a suspicion that Egypt had invented a low-pressure, non-ultrasonic version of what has become the abrasive water-jet.
Bill

Now that is mighty interesting, care to elaborate? Just some "guess" from one of these "Aliens did it" shows . Probably not. You don't strike me as the man to fall for this type of crap. To much an engineer....
Any sources one might read....i positively love the idea. Some sort of "sandy waterfall" i suppose....
 
Actually got a tour inside those places. Yes it was the 'populist' literature that got me to wondering. Then also, I have an original of Rogers, Pumps and Hydraulics, and HE - and his sources - had done a good deal of detective work whilst some now-gone features of the technology of the ancient world still existed.


Bill

Bill, it isn't 1850 anymore. No one says "whilst" anymore unless they're retards like you.
 
Not one of your better comments.....

bad John, no "like"......

This is interesting.

I have received 4300 likes and have made 5571 posts = 1.3 posts per like.

Bill has received 2700 likes and has made 10094 posts = 3.73 posts per like.

So yes, bill is a retard. He's easily the worst writer on here. ( or any forum I'ver ever seen). I would be one thing if he knew anything about machining. I might cut him some slack. He just posts word diarrhea and punctuation. It's not like he's disabled and can't help it. He means to write what he writes and tries to be terrible.
 
My totally apology to the OP. But this just has to be said. I've reached my limit...

This is interesting.

I have received 4300 likes and have made 5571 posts = 1.3 posts per like.

Bill has received 2700 likes and has made 10094 posts = 3.73 posts per like.

So yes, bill is a retard. He's easily the worst writer on here. ( or any forum I'ver ever seen). I would be one thing if he knew anything about machining. I might cut him some slack. He just posts word diarrhea and punctuation. It's not like he's disabled and can't help it. He means to write what he writes and tries to be terrible.

Funny, I have met both John Welden & thermite. Two very different contrasts in personality.

John Welden gave me, my sister, & my B-in-L a tour of his company when I was out in Seattle a few yrs ago. He works on some pretty tiny complicated parts in Ti for various devices in the medical field. He's very technical & precise. But I guess you've figured that out. Oh and he's very direct. John showed us around and when we got back to the start, his manner and language changed such that it was easy to realize the tour was over, it was time for us to leave, he had to get back to work. We said or thanks and goodbyes and left. I have a lot of respect for John, might not always agree with his views, but the guy has talent.

I've met Bill (aka thermite) on two occasions. He lives near me and I sold him some 10EE parts. He met me at my work to make the PU & cash exchange. The first time I met Bill, we did the meet and greet. But from the start he just talked about this and that, hard to get a word in edgewise. I really felt like he just wouldn't STFU. Much like he writes on this forum. Finally I was like, I've got to go and got my $$ and walked off back into my building.

2nd time, same deal, but I knew what I was up against. I met Bill in the parking lot, gave him the parts, got my $$, and avoided conversation more or less saying I had to get back to work. And left the scene.

Bill has good intentions, and deep down he's a smart & intelligent guy who would like nothing more than to help anyone out. And he's never done me wrong in any way.

Donie (Monarch forum) had Bill (thermite) pegged. Those who know about this will know. Those of you that don't will have to figure it out. Bill was recently gone from the forum for a period recently. And I noticed immed when he got back. Bill seems to have to be the post whore in too many topics. Posting his "artsy prose" that is generally not related to the topic and technically lacking. If I could give Bill some advice... don't be a post whore.

Sorry this has come out like this but this has to be said. I guarantee you I'm not the only one of this opinion.

I'm pretty tolerant, but I've had my fill. I know there are many others that share my opinion.
 
My totally apology to the OP. But this just has to be said. I've reached my limit...



Funny, I have met both John Welden & thermite. Two very different contrasts in personality.

John Welden gave me, my sister, & my B-in-L a tour of his company when I was out in Seattle a few yrs ago. He works on some pretty tiny complicated parts in Ti for various devices in the medical field. He's very technical & precise. But I guess you've figured that out. Oh and he's very direct. John showed us around and when we got back to the start, his manner and language changed such that it was easy to realize the tour was over, it was time for us to leave, he had to get back to work. We said or thanks and goodbyes and left. I have a lot of respect for John, might not always agree with his views, but the guy has talent.

I've met Bill (aka thermite) on two occasions. He lives near me and I sold him some 10EE parts. He met me at my work to make the PU & cash exchange. The first time I met Bill, we did the meet and greet. But from the start he just talked about this and that, hard to get a word in edgewise. I really felt like he just wouldn't STFU. Much like he writes on this forum. Finally I was like, I've got to go and got my $$ and walked off back into my building.

2nd time, same deal, but I knew what I was up against. I met Bill in the parking lot, gave him the parts, got my $$, and avoided conversation more or less saying I had to get back to work. And left the scene.

Bill has good intentions, and deep down he's a smart & intelligent guy who would like nothing more than to help anyone out. And he's never done me wrong in any way.

Donie (Monarch forum) had Bill (thermite) pegged. Those who know about this will know. Those of you that don't will have to figure it out. Bill was recently gone from the forum for a period recently. And I noticed immed when he got back. Bill seems to have to be the post whore in too many topics. Posting his "artsy prose" that is generally not related to the topic and technically lacking. If I could give Bill some advice... don't be a post whore.

Sorry this has come out like this but this has to be said. I guarantee you I'm not the only one of this opinion.

I'm pretty tolerant, but I've had my fill. I know there are 100 others that share my opinion.


Thank you for being honest, but get ready for haters.
 
John Welden said:
He just posts word diarrhea and punctuation. It's not like he's disabled and can't help it. He means to write what he writes and tries to be terrible.

In fairness to Bill, he does try hard and is very creative with abbreviations.
I'm still trying to work out what some of them mean. WTF OTOH. Guess my head is a bit slow eh?
More on topic, I once made a slipstone by cutting a section from a much larger stone using a conventional hacksaw blade and water. Slow, and got slower but it did cut fairly well. Remainder of the shape was achieved by rubbing with a lump of sandstone.
 
First a water ram pump was built into the rock underneath the pyramid, fed by the Nile. From then on the broken stones could be made to fit. Agree completely with the assumption of sand loaded water jets.

I have the strange idea that the Cheops pyramid also served as an ice machine. With the almost abrupt temperature decrease when night falls in the concave surfaces, yes, the four triangle sides are not flat, lost a lot of warmth. Under the condition that there is a constant flow of water over them, it freezes in the wind. Imagine what they had with ice!
 
Thanks to those who have brought the thread back on track - I opened this new thread to avoid the sort of spleen that was being vented on the Jerusalem Artichoke thread.

Some hopes!

So to make George W's football shaped stone (I presume a rugby ball, not a soccer ball) I put the roughly shaped stone in a lathe and set it spinning. Do I hold another stone against it or what? I presume these stones were commercially made, so there must have been some method available that was quick enough to be profitable and durable enough to be reliable.

George
 
Carbide coated 'rod' type HS blade, ends removed, clamped in a cheap Delta jig-saw here. Two hands free for control. The blades still wore out right fast, but at least I didn't.

Had to do it today, I'd (first) try an older diamond blade in my tile wet-saw. Else an abrasive disk in the angle grinder. Cheap one, of course.

Bill

Ah yes, the tile saw. At the time I didn't own one and diamond blades were unaffordable to mere mortals but would do it that way now if required. Iirc the blade was an old hardback "eclipse" blade and this cut better than a bimetal blade.
It seems that diamond tooling is much more available than previously; pcd tipped saw blades are commonplace for cutting fibre cement, for example.

Limestone rock is sawn on a continuous basis using nothing more than sand and a wire rope. I recall fine woodworker had an article on the making of Arkansas stones and they were shaped in a very basic way using sand or loose abrasive against another stone, powered of course. Probably what inspired me to try the hacksaw.
 
Thanks to those who have brought the thread back on track - I opened this new thread to avoid the sort of spleen that was being vented on the Jerusalem Artichoke thread.

Some hopes!

So to make George W's football shaped stone (I presume a rugby ball, not a soccer ball) I put the roughly shaped stone in a lathe and set it spinning. Do I hold another stone against it or what? I presume these stones were commercially made, so there must have been some method available that was quick enough to be profitable and durable enough to be reliable.

George

Having watched masons on site working limestone, much of the rough shaping seems to be done by crushing the stone in a controlled way. A star wheel dresser may achieve the desired result but stone working is a black art and your results may be very frustrating.
The shape of stone you describe seems to be what is known as a scythe stone, used for dressing the edge of that tool. Not uncommon and certainly still in use.
 
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