uk equipment prices

I have been watching a moore 1 1/2 jig borer with tooling on ebay. I was amazed to see that it went for £52 ($75 ish).

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/180759591164?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649

Firstly well done whoever got this.

Secondly how can such a fine piece of equipment in what looks like good condition go for so little?

Is everybody in the uk in the same position as me too many tools in too little space? (If I had space it would be on the back of a lorry next week making its way to the 'shed'!)

Andrew -

I think it is because the industrial rationale for a jig borer like that has mostly gone. We don't need as many drill jigs and other similar tooling as we used to, and the accuracy that a jig borer can provide is largely achievable by more productive machines. That leaves the amateur buyer and they are constrained by space, weight and maybe knowing what to do with it.

Having said all that it is a fine machine and sadly, at the price, it may even have gone just for scrap value.

Was a nice machine yes. Is now, who knows, looks like its been out of the essential warm dry toolmakers shop environment for a fair few years so its bound to be out of spec. Anyway what the heck would you do with it. If its out of spec its barely better than a Bridgeport with a quality set of DRO scales. If its in spec the contortions needed to use it to it full potential are um "tedious" and just how many people need to work to that precision. If you are a proper business there are other easier ways now.

Picked up Moore Tools book "Holes, Contours and Surfaces" a couple of weeks back (E-Bay £6.99 delivered) which gives considerable details on how the Moore Jig Borer and Grinder should be used. In between the usual American "We are the greatest" advert puff and a few fairly dubious assumptions and assertions concerning the super accuracy resulting from some techniques its a very interesting book. However its also very clear how the development of modern digital techniques and appropriate methods of use have squeezed out the ecological niche in which it lives. A familiar scene to me as much of my work in wage slave days concerned to design, development and improvement of optical test methods where highly accurate mechanical movements were a necessity. I had a ringside, and sometimes in ring, seat to watch the evolution of digital methods from "joke, it will never catch on, too expensive" to game changer. As I could never buy off the shelf the great thing with digital is the way it expands opportunities to, frankly, "cheat" in getting more precision than ought to be possible.

Horrible though it is to say it. These days that machine is little more than a fancy drill press!

Clive

PS Yup. I'd have got it to put in the shop for pure swank too. I've got the room and the Range Rover could tow a trailer to handle it. But 350 miles away put it out of temptation range.

I saw it and was surprised at the price as well, that said I agree with most of what has been said about jig borers in the modern world.

And yes if I'd the space and it wasn't 400miles away - it would have been pry bars at dawn

An aside;- I knew of a large Newall jig bore that was sold for little more than scrap (complete with all it's kit!) to see it's days out reboring motorcycle etc cylinders........ I was told the buyer said it was the best boring bar he'd ever had

Limy Sami said:

An aside;- I knew of a large Newall jig bore that was sold for little more than scrap (complete with all it's kit!) to see it's days out reboring motorcycle etc cylinders........ I was told the buyer said it was the best boring bar he'd ever had

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Not so much of an aside more an excellent example of where old, low priced due to being redundant, but still inherently accurate heavy iron can, and should, be re-purposed into a job which always needed, but could never afford new, its qualities. (Hafta say the first time I saw a set of Van Norman cylinder reboring kit I thought it was a joke or at least something well preserved from a 1920's corner garage.)

Clive

Clive603 said:

Not so much of an aside more an excellent example of where old, low priced due to being redundant, but still inherently accurate heavy iron can, and should, be re-purposed into a job which always needed, but could never afford new, its qualities. (Hafta say the first time I saw a set of Van Norman cylinder reboring kit I thought it was a joke or at least something well preserved from a 1920's corner garage.)

Clive

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Couldn't agree more Clive.

It does indeed hurt to see such a fine machine go for less than cost of a simple tool holder.....but as others have said....what are you going to do with it....almost certainly nothing truly profitable

I will also say that I am perfectly happy with my Van Norman boring bars, more particularly the much improved English Shaftsbury version

Coincidentaly, for many years during school hollidays my parents took us to Anglesey where we stayed in a rented cottage just round the coast from Beuamaris, I became friends with a young lad of similar age who's father owned an engineering firm in Beuamaris & can remember vaguely a very tidy machine shop. His family owned a decent sized motor launch in which we took fishing trips off Puffin Island.
I can not imagine that there was more than one engineering firm in Beuamaris so I may quite possibly have seen that very machine, if indeed it arrived there in 1972.

regards

Brian

I have no real use but as Sami if close and i had space it would probably be a new addition. Is actually needed ish as i currently have two punch tools to make up and better than bridgeport holes would - are needed for once!

I know of a beautiful Societe Genovese gate type jig borer with a 4 ft tilting rotary table and all the normal bits that is for sale, the lads from the 'sub continent' offered just over scrap so if you have an interest, PM me
Peter

And then there is this :-
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/110780565...AX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649#ht_500wt_1257
Who has got the bottle to PM a certain Scottish gentleman who sometimes share his views on Colchester lathes in these hallowed portals with news of the "bargain" he has missed.
Even without factoring in transport I can't see how anyone expects to come out of the right side on that. Mascots aren't that uncommon and, skipping the Colchester effect, even some dealer prices on similar size Elliot / DSG et al in apparently serviceable condition are depressed enough to be quite favourable in comparison to the probable final total before that one is turning again.

Clive

Clive603 said:

And then there is this :-
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/110780565...AX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649#ht_500wt_1257
Who has got the bottle to PM a certain Scottish gentleman who sometimes share his views on Colchester lathes in these hallowed portals with news of the "bargain" he has missed.

Clive

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Ooooh that could be nasty

Clive603 said:

Who has got the bottle to PM a certain Scottish gentleman who sometimes share his views on Colchester lathes in these hallowed portals with news of the "bargain" he has missed.

Clive

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More rubbish from our Clive.But,credit where credit is due,he is very good at it.

The Moore and the Mascot have been bookmarked since they were first listed on Ebay.Neither of them were at a price that would allow a profit to be made.The Moore was scrap anyway as there is not a market for them.There`s always an idiot to buy a broken down Colchester at an inflated price but there was no room for me to make a profit.