OT: Tired of low quality junk ! What to do ???

I would like others opinions here.

This is my situation:


Four years ago, we completely remodeled our bathroom replacing all of the plumbing fixtures walls, etc.. I have always been a stickler for buying quality products and although I don't buy the most expensive products, I usually spend enough to believe that I'm buying quality.

So far, my 2 year old granddaughter kicked a hole through the paper thin side of our bath tub. All of the chrome plumbing fixtures are corroding and the stopper no longer functions. We've had to replace the toilet seat and the screws had rusted so badly I could not get the plastic nuts off without chiseling them off. The bathroom sink has several cracks in it. The stopper in this sink broke as well, and while replacing that, I noticed excessive corrosion on what I thought were brass fittings. Oh, did I mention the brand new shower fan we installed quit working. Basically everything we purchased four years ago has to be replaced. This is ridiculous. I thought, at minimum, that I could get 10 years out of these appliances and fixtures.

Everything you buy now is absolute junk.

So, what's the next step ??? How do you replace these items so they last ???




Frank

This is ridiculous. I thought, at minimum, that I could get 10 years out of these appliances and fixtures.

Everything you buy now is absolute junk.

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I feel your pain. I try to never buy the lowest end pricepoint. Consumer grade fixtures from places like Lowes and Home Depot have had corners cut everywhere during there mfgr to get them to a certain pricepoint. Try to avoid buying from those types of places might help. If you can bitch to the mfgr that might get you a replacement.

I don't know what to tell you. Domestic mfgrs are feeling all kinds of pressure from the low end chinese crap that comes here. So they respond by cutting quality out.

It sucks. I try to buy made in USA when I can. If I can't buy a reasonable quality made in USA, I'll just try and go w/o it if I can.

I get very tired of all the low quality crap that's being sold, so I just try and consume less.

Use Kohler fixtures and a cast iron tub. That's what I did 35 years ago when I built my own house almost 40 years ago. They were VERY pricey then and I assume still are. I still have the same fixtures. The chrome still sparkles. I've had to change the faucet washers once or twice but with thier design the washers don't spin against the seat so they last. After 40 years all parts are still availabe. I'm not sure Kohler quality is still there. Maybe they are Chinese by now. I hope not...........Bob

rockfish said:

I would like others opinions here.

This is my situation:


Four years ago, we completely remodeled our bathroom replacing all of the plumbing fixtures walls, etc.. I have always been a stickler for buying quality products and although I don't buy the most expensive products, I usually spend enough to believe that I'm buying quality.

So far, my 2 year old granddaughter kicked a hole through the paper thin side of our bath tub. All of the chrome plumbing fixtures are corroding and the stopper no longer functions. We've had to replace the toilet seat and the screws had rusted so badly I could not get the plastic nuts off without chiseling them off. The bathroom sink has several cracks in it. The stopper in this sink broke as well, and while replacing that, I noticed excessive corrosion on what I thought were brass fittings. Oh, did I mention the brand new shower fan we installed quit working. Basically everything we purchased four years ago has to be replaced. This is ridiculous. I thought, at minimum, that I could get 10 years out of these appliances and fixtures.

Everything you buy now is absolute junk.

So, what's the next step ??? How do you replace these items so they last ???




Frank

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In general, pay more
Make sure to know the right brands and examen the items in person
For example Why did you buy that bad tube with that paper thin wall
If you examed it before buying it you could have known

Peter from Holland

Not everything is junk -- just most. You definitely cannot buy high quality at big box stores. And you have to spend a lot more money.

For example, the chrome plumbing fixtures you have are probably typical box stuff, which is usually low quality, thin, chrome-on-steel. This always peels and rusts, only a question of if in 2 years or 10 years, depending on usage, environment, etc. But there are still a couple old-school companies like Chicago that make heavy solid brass components with quality chrome plating, and they last decades. And there's lots of European made stuff of high-quality. But high quality faucets start at about $300 and can easily be double that -- not the $89 big box stuff.

Also, if you don't know, it's been well documented that the name brand stuff sold in big box stores is often not the same as the Manufacturer's equivalent models sold elsewhere. From plumbing to locks to power tools, the manufacturers have big-box versions of their stuff that they make to the lower price point demanded by the Walmarts of the world. Usually the model numbers and packaging are nearly identical and the differences require close inspection to identify. Typical differences include things like plastic gears vs. metal (tools), metal gauge (plumbing), material such as die cast vs. solid and machining tolerances (locksets), etc.

Yikes

That's not a good storey given that you'll have to do it all over again labour wise.

I would have to speculate that you need to spend more money to get higher quality but 4 years service is pretty hard to imagine unless your grandaughter bathes with boots on and personal hygiene is a contact sport at your home.

I gutted my house right to the outside walls over ten years ago now and my bathroom fixtures look as good as the day I installed them. We have hard water so a water softener was a must to keep everything bright and corrision free.

I did buy mid-level Kohler, Moen, Baldwin from Home Depot and I remeber thinking that the $$ was not cheap but you could truly see and feel the quality over the less expensive stuff. On the chrome work you could see where the better grade was brass under the chrome and it had far better prepwork done to it prior to plating - no thin sharp edges etc..

By no means did I buy boutique/designer grade fixtures but I did buy pretty close to the "best" that HD carried.

Sorry about your trouble here but not to defend substandard materials here but ...

So far, my 2 year old granddaughter kicked a hole through the paper thin side of our bath tub.

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She really kicked a hole in it?...barefoot?? Common Frank, there is no way that you picked up that tub and didn't feel it as thin and junkie 4 years... sorry, you are guilty of picking substandard items and material....

I have always been a stickler for buying quality products and although I don't buy the most expensive products, I usually spend enough to believe that I'm buying quality.

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Then in the rest of your post you go on to explain how you did not buy the cheapest . Sounds to me as though you looked at the item and said to yourself...well, it's not the cheapest one, so it must be better than junk....Price does often indicate some level of quality...you know that.

I sugest you look at the item first and then look at the price...ohh and expecting only 10 yrs?.. or maybe 20? .... MINIMUM those items should last is at least 50 yrs... maybe closer to well over 100

We bought the tub at Home Depot. It was NOT cheap. They looked fine in the store. We had the tub delivered, and I did not install it, my cousin did, while I was working. He's a certified plumber and he didn't see any problems with it. It was covered under warranty and we had the factory service center come out and look at it. Somehow, when the tub was made, the inner wall had not been made as thick as the rest of the tub. Since the whole thing was built into the wall, we couldn't pull it back out without destroying thousands of dollars worth of other work that had been done. They sprayed the tub with fiberglass to repair it, but the repair also eventually cracked.
I'm probably going to have to have one of those tub inserts installed next to fix it.

None of the fixtures were cheap either. Well over $100 each.



Frank

Could the advanced corrosion be due to an especially harsh bathroom atmosphere? Examine the cleaning chemicals you use. For example, a typical bleach based "in the tank" toilet bowl cleaner constantly emits gases that will corrode toilet seat hardware much faster than normal.

Mixed results

About 22 years ago after buying a house (e.g. very little money left) we gutted the main bathroom and replaced everything. We got a brand name tub and toilet from an auction house and the sink from a big box store. By the time we got to the tub/shower plumbing all we could afford was a very cheap generic imported set. The castings were light and cheap but this was a stop gap until we had more money.

Years past and I kept waiting for it to die but it kept working. It was used fairly heavily (4 kids, 2 dogs). I've never had to do anything to it. The spigot does have a very small amount of corrosion where the water exits but it still works and looks OK, not stylish but OK. Last summer I bought a more expensive set to replace it but I'm feeling a little guilty as the old set keeps on working and I'm a little worried about Murphy's law when I do.

Having said this I've replaced much better quality bathroom sink taps a few times and by the looks of the ones in our spare bathroom I'm going to have to do it again. The plating starts to break down on them and no matter how well you clean them they don't look so good. Or I've had the 3/8th water supply tube easily break on me when we went to change out the the sink, it doesn't leave you with much confidence.

Now all the really cheap sets are mainly made of genuine plastic, not imitation plastic . We've got an old bronze casting laundry room faucet set in the basement with genuine 1/2 water supply lines and every time I use it I'm amazed at the volume of water that comes out.

Dave

A quality toilet will cost well over a hundred bucks.

The Kohler cast iron tub I bought five years ago set me back $480.

"Also, if you don't know, it's been well documented that the name brand stuff sold in big box stores is often not the same as the Manufacturer's equivalent models sold elsewhere."

This is absolutely, positively true, and it gets carried to ridiculous extremes.

Besides price, sometimes the legal deptpartment of the big box rears its ugly head. Buck Brothers was told by one big box that any wood chisel they sold thro the big box would have to be soft enough to bend before snapping just in case some clod used it to pry open a paint can. So, a Buck chisel headed for the big box would have the same steel, but tempered to a lower hardness.

Another driver is fear of Lead (Pb) liability and the european RoHS (Reduction of Hazardous Substances) standards. No more lead in the faucet alloy, which was certainly found in some of the great bronzes of the 20th century.

You can get better stuff in a junkyard than you can at a big box. And, in the end, you'll sink just as much into restoring the "architectural salvage" as you will into repeatedly re-buying and re-installing the crap.

JRR

SouthBendModel34 said:

You can get better stuff in a junkyard than you can at a big box. And, in the end, you'll sink just as much into restoring the "architectural salvage" as you will into repeatedly re-buying and re-installing the crap.

JRR

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Having gone the "architectural salvage" route, I don't recommend that for anyone but architectural purists. I've had old faucets re-chromed, etc, and they look and work well, but they are older technology -- seats and rubber washers, etc. Newer generation stuff quality stuff (eg, Chicago) use "cartridge" valves that last much longer before they leak and are a snap to replace.

Renewable Repairs and Refurbishment

From Wilkipedia:

Home or residential renovation is a $300 billion industry in the United States,[2] and a $48 billion industry in Canada.[3] The average cost per project is $3,000 in the United States and $11,000–15,000 in Canada.[4]

It makes sense that this huge industry would use cheapo, low quality, mass produced products to sell the folks that frequent their stores. They keep you coming back......................

no high quality stuff in their inventory

rockfish said:

We bought the tub at Home Depot. It was NOT cheap.

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Expensive at HD or Lowe's only means that they're making a high profit margin on junk.

it DOES NOT imply quality.

- Leigh

I know for a fact that Kohler makes their standard line and a cheaper line for HD, Lowes, etc. I just bought a Kohler kitchen faucet and HD had their standard store version for $230 and the real version for $100 more but it was special order only. However, if you look around on the net you can find the real Kohler stuff for the same price or less that the HD junk version. I used PEX - Radiant Heat - Radiant Heating - Plumbing Supplies - PexSupply.com for my fixtures and was very pleased. Even Amazon.com has good prices on that kind of stuff. I think I ended up getting the "real" Kohler faucet for about $219.

You certainly get exactly what you pay for.

Take for instance a garden tractor. You can get a brand name like John Deere at a big box and they make it sound like a lifetime purchase. Forget that deal. Go find a good used made in the USA tractor from the 1960s and 1970s from John Deere and THAT will be a lifetime purchase.

Same thing applies to house fixtures. Hit the salvage yard, bring cash, and get something heavy!

Well, I'm finishing to build a new house, still a few things to do but moved in 3 months ago. I've built it well above any building code, with top quality products. All Grohe faucets, neptune toilet/bath/shower, ICF from the footing to the attic(I burnt 1 cord of wood in all winter, never had to use the Infloor heating, its nuts). 400amp service, had the floors and trusses engineered above normal (L/580 floors), NO OSB. Thermador Induction cooktop. Bath fans are Panasonic with 6" exhaust line, very quiet, very good, kinda pricey... I was able to get some of this stuff at good prices though, not regular retail, but still a few times more than store brand stuff.

Often the cost is in the details, like in the work we do as machinists.

Unfortunately even some of the top name stuff is made in China, but at least it is generally of higher quality than the store brand stuff.

I can tell you that a general contractor could build a house of the same size, that would look "similar", but cheap it out to the point that it would cost them 1/2 of what I have into it so far, and that is after saving ourselves at least 100K in labour. You know what the problem is? they're pretty much appraising my house as not being worth much more than the junk being built everywhere to the bare minimum of building codes, with junk fixtures, etc, which they then try to sell for 400K, and doesn't cost them half that to build.
I've pretty much documented everything, lots of pictures, etc. So that when the day comes that I decide to sell, I can show the people why my house is worth what its worth, and why it'll be standing when all the others have rotted or blown away. Every time the building inspector came he asked why we were putting so much more than what is usually put in. I wanted to do it once, that's why. Sadly if I was offered 400K I would say no because I'd barely break even, it won't be an easy one to sell, unless someone " GETS IT " Maybe I'm just crazy, then again I built it for me.

rockfish said:

None of the fixtures were cheap either. Well over $100 each.

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Quality standard sized 4" sink fixtures start at $120 and go up to $400 - $500 or more depending on how much gold plating you want, a quality chrome plated brass tub fixture is probably $300 on up. A decent vitreous china toilet is what? $400 to $600, Toto, or Kohler brands. Tubs are wicked expensive, even the plasticy gel coated ones.

You can find all that at the big boxes, just a few steps away from the chromey-plastic fixtures that tract house builders and landlords favor.

Gary

Ceilstrange may have it. I had no problems with cheep cromed zicast fixtures till I started using a cleaning agent with Clorox in it. zinc don't like it. I doubt if many other metals do either.