If you shake the cobwebs out of your cranium, you may recall that we did just that in 1762 when we rounded up all of the dastardly Acadians and shipped them all to Louisiana.
:-) It is my recollection that Louisiana was a French colony at that time so that it is unlikely that the British colonies were very concerned about it. And I was thinking of workers' paradises such as China and Cuba, not down here.
Anyway, we have been living in the era of judicial dictatorship for at least a few generations.
When they started taking away the now "prohibited" handguns(105mm barrel of less) from people who were not club members, and thus had no reason to own the gun if they didn't actively use it. I figured it was only a matter of time before another genius gets voted in and says " you don't hunt, thus you have no reason to own a hunting rifle". Lots of them want those gone too.
Well they actually have all of our prohibited weapons already. The machine guns and the prohibited handguns will all go to the crown upon our death and will be destroyed. With no compensation. I think if you keep abreast of the prohibited list you will find that new guns are added to the list daily. This is their long term function to guaranty removing firearms from the public. The people that push all of this have no use for firearms and they are afraid of them. And they are afraid of the people who own them. Oddly enough they are the same people that are out there protesting women's rights, gay rights and things like the abortion issue. Their key foothold is discrimination. Oddly enough these protestors are doing to the gun owners, exactly what they are fighting against. Simple discrimination.
[QUOTE=SND;1789610]They should give QC the portion regarding their residents (not that its what the people really want there either...) but at least leave the rest of canada alone. "here's the pile, sort your own mess, buh bye" no more money wasted in court over this.
As usual with the media, the facts are few and far between, but it appears that the Quebec court decision is for only a few days to allow the forces of evil to appear in court to argue for keeping the useless data the Feds gathered in Quebec only. And, the Registry still must be used in Quebec until further notice.
So it looks like the argument is ONLY about Quebec data, and may or may not drag on for a long time. Considering the massive Canadian court system is full to the brim with Progressive hacks, all the way to the Supreme Court, it may well drag on and on.
Another issue is the federal bureaucracy has stated they will not be able to actually delete the data for the other Canadian provinces until August. Whether this is just another example of a bloated bureaucracy's incompetence or political footdragging [or both] is open to discussion.
Thus, IMO, it behooves all good Canadians in the civilized areas to rush out and buy, sell, trade and barter all long guns to and with all other Canadian gun owners who are legally able to own firearms, in the manner sanctioned by [the new] law.
"Oddly enough they are the same people that are out there protesting women's rights, gay rights and things like the abortion issue."
Not a real forum for politics but I urge you to think long and hard about that statement. In the US there are often strange bedfellows.
Consider that firearm ownership and many of the things you mention above are really about *one* issue: keeping the government
out of folks private lives. Women and gays own firearms too. Some of them might even agree strongly with your sentiments
about firearms ownership. Respectfully.
Maybe I read it wrong or maybe you missed my point. Activists are the ones who make change. Those who sit on the fence and say nothing have little or no impact. But in a lot of cases the activists ignore the basic fundamentals of most of these issues which is freedom of choice and the right or privilege of being left alone to do as we please so long as we do not cause harm to others. Being anti ANYTHING is simply admitting that you discriminate against others for no reason other than you do not do, or are like the other person is. Whether you are against abortion, guns, gays, hunting or pokadot smurfs you are doing nothing more than discriminating against another person.
As far as government in Canada, all the parties are anti gun and only use such issues when they have no other way of forming a government. The liberals started it with Trudeau, Kim Campels conservative government strengthened it and then the liberals took another run at it and beefed it up. I would hate to think what the NDP or the Block would do if given a chance. It took 18 years of whining and the conservatives needing a platform to get elected with a majority that put an end to it.
And as we speak California will start their registration program. Fortunately we're bankrupt and will have real problems with enforcement.
I still don't understand how registering guns is a problem.
Its a huge waste of money. In the case of long guns, it does next to nothing for crime prevention or crime investigation. Criminals prefer handguns. My personal preference is for an A4D loaded with napalm, but that lacks a certain surgical je ne c'est quoi.
In my own brief experience in Canadian law enforcement long ago I can recall zero long gun crimes department wide over two years. A shotgun suicide, but they are damned hard to prosecute.
If that was where it ended it would be no problem. The problem lies in the fact that it gives them a complete list of where to come to pick them up when they institute the next phase of their plan, and rest assured that is what they want.
Originally Posted by Mydrrin
Actually cooperating with any goverment program is A) a step closer to the demise of your rights and b) a means of revenue generation/extortion. The laws get passed purely for financial gain for the government and the net result is more crime and misery. Try registering dope dealers first.
Originally Posted by Mydrrin
Originally Posted by Mydrrin
Go talk to a Brit. They had a nice simple gun registration, just to make sure no criminals had guns, right? Then some wackjob with registered handguns decided to shoot up a school in Dunblane so the politicians changed their minds and demanded surrender of every registered handgun. So, you either surrendered the handgun that they knew you had, or you went to jail.
Can you understand that the surrender or jail option isn't available if there is no registration?
I've heard from a few people recently that the rcmp are now actively seeking out anyone with restricted and prohibited firearms and asking for proof of club membership or hand them all in you can no longer own them. So far it appears stopping the long gun registry is only making things worse for everyone now that its up to every province and whoever wants to call the shots to do as they please. So everyone make sure your membership and everything is up to date or you could become a criminal without even knowing it.
As a brit that likes shooting all i can say is that gun control can be a slippery slope. These days all i can shoot is a air rifle or a sub 6ftlb air pistol (to be fair the air pistol is way harder - more challenging than the rifle over my typical 10-20 meter range. Just trying to find - become a member of a gun club is painful and getting a firearms certificate is darn hard. Im equally content offing a few bunny's on a local farm or making a empty coke can do the air pistol cha cha :-) I am no way near good enough to compete at target shooting.
Whilst i fully agree society has gotta try and keep the bad boys from getting guns, just like society needs to stop insane country's getting nukes. It really seams a downward spiral. I can honestly say as a kid when we visited texas and walking around shopping with people who openly carried real 6 "shooters" i felt a frigging sight less concerned than i did staying with my brother for the odd weekend in Manchester here in the uk!
At least in texas, if some one drawed there weapon, there would be a few to return fire. Here in the uk a armed criminal is only going to be stopped by the armed police, once they have finished there doughnuts and drank there coffee! Gang's were rife in Manchester, they did not give a hoot about the laws. What's worse is that in most of the inter gang fuading its innocent bystanders that often get injured.
All that said i really don't know the answer about gun owner ship. I'm not even sure there is a answer. Whilst some members of society are happy to go out and kill other's and some of us that are happy to just get along im really not sure there ever will be a solution. There is so many guns out there in this world too its not like banning them works. Even if every gun on the planet could be destroyed tomorrow there not exactly overly complicated to make! Even then based on the uk Knive crime then takes over.
Even if all our laws were repealed and we could carry + use force to defend our selves im really not sure what the long term out come would be.
You got to remember in the uk if some one attacks you weather there armed or not you can not use a fire arm legally in self defence. That includes air weapons as much as it does say a 50 calibre auto machine gun, there all considered firearms under our laws. Even keeping a base ball bat beside the bed here for self defence would be a dodgy situation legally if you ever had to use it. Its' arguably the thing i hate most about living in this country, i can not use force to defend what i have, my family, my possessions and my life if it comes to it legally. Whilst there's becoming a better chance these days you would not get convicted of it, it would still be several months before your a free man if you killed a burgler in self defence.
Personally i would much prefer to live in a country were if it was to be a case that i could waste any bugler that entered my property after issuing clear warnings. I firmly believe that a English man's home is his castle. I just wish i could legally use force to repel invaders! If the whole country did it it would make for a very diffrent place. As is people attack and rape 90+ year old grandmas in there own homes these days.
All i will add is i firmly belive that your individual rights + liberties should sease to exist once you cross into invading some one elses rights. When punishments become less than living legaly it seams kinda topsy turby.
Sounds like you brits needed to pull off a 1776 like we did. Kinda hard to do without firearms, though.
I think we here in the US might have to do it again against an over bearing government. Particularly if Ovomit is reelected.
BTW, Omovitcare was ruled OK by the Sublime Court. Aint that a kick in the crotch.
And what else could they possibly have had in mind when they created that law in the first place? Any nimrod could tell you that the crooks weren't gonna comply with it, they're crooks! Breaking the law is their stock and trade! The antis always use that old junk about protecting the public. How could imposing on the law-keepers to register their method of self defense have possibly ever benefited anyone except those determined to impose their will on the lawful, be it criminals or liberals? The pendulum does seem to be swinging back in our favor lately, with more laws like this being repealled or amended in favor of the lawful shooter, but as we can see here, gun CONTROL is about CONTROL, gun part is secondary.
Originally Posted by SND
As to pulling of a 1776. It would be bloody non British to do it with out right force using firearms. You gotta remember, pulling a gun is just not the British way. Were far more likely to go for a proper fist fight. Hell maybe kick em in the knads at worst & even that's bad form!
You got to remember, we still have the house of lords + a queen & royal family that it's fair to say most of the Uk respects + likes. Politicians are just one group of idiots. The queen still has to sign stuff of, even though the government can kinda force it. If it came to it i think you will find the queen would not. Then the country would stand behind her. She's not some one to mess with, she has a truly loyal following here! All the armed forces + police + boy scouts swear allegiance to her, not the PM! But above all else, she has earnt the country's respect. A elected Idjiot has not.
As to taking control of a country with a armed civil uprising, you only have to look at Siriya to see what a blood bath that would be. Now consider doing that against a government with the capability yours has now! Even if every civilian had a full auto AR15 it ain't going to achieve much, probably akin to me single handedly trying to invade a country using a catapult! It would be a blood bath of epic proportion!
No i just want the right to have a firearm because i like to shoot, i like to hunt. I would like to be able to use it to protect my family too, weather from a criminal minority or a bigger event, but that is not a option here. If i could ever get elected i would be changing the later. There would be some very clearly laid down conditions - requirements. But Power would be handed back to the law abiding citizen, its the criminals that would have to fear! Even if that ment arming every house hold in the land with a tasser. Criminals need to know, invading some one else's castle will be met with resistance. The punishment will be worse than the crime. Human rights will be lost when you exceed some one elses!
As to your incessant worrying about obama care, don't it can't be a bigger mess than your current system. The Nhs here saves way more lives + helps more people live longer with a better quality of life. In a civilised world health care is a basic right, not a privilege and certainly not something whole industries should make a fortune out of. A profit for drug companies, yep no problem with that. But the returns of your insurance industries is pure gread, akin in scale to that of a slave master IMHO!
The way I look at it, its much harder to invade a country if every citizen has a gun and reason to want to defend it, then one tiny army that can be crippled in hours and a defenseless population. Bet you a few countries would have had different outcomes in WW2 if every citizen had had a gun.
I know we have it pretty easy in north america, and a few other countries as well, but it only takes 4-8hrs on a plane either way to be in one major shit fest. Hopefully it never makes it here, but better safe than sorry.
Seriously? It costs billions of dollars and very literally did nothing. It kept a log of gun owners who have done nothing wrong. It was also going to be used to confiscate Canadian's private property for doing nothing wrong.
Originally Posted by Mydrrin
Do you understand the problem now?