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Handgun barrier for a shop

9100

Diamond
Joined
Nov 1, 2004
Location
Webster Groves, MO
A local merchant asked about reinforcing a wall to resist handgun bullets. This is a low crime area, but holdups have happened. He just wants a partition he can duck behind with a door that will resist someone beating on it long enough for him to get out the back door.

Part of the debate is what caliber an armed robber is likely to have. He recognizes that one with a 30-06 and armor piercing ammunition is unlikely; 9mm or 40 S&W seems to be the most penetrating he can expect, maybe a .357, but most holdup men don't know that much about firearms and are using whatever they could steal.

The obvious answer is sheet steel, but I wonder if there is a composition board that would be lighter and/or cheaper.

Bill
 
Back when I was tink'n full time, we used to build our bullet traps used for test shots and practice from telephone books. Cheap. And easy. The thickness, combined with the numerous layers would stop almost anything very quickly, actually. Try it with one. You'll see.
 
Back when I was tink'n full time, we used to build our bullet traps used for test shots and practice from telephone books. Cheap. And easy. The thickness, combined with the numerous layers would stop almost anything very quickly, actually. Try it with one. You'll see.

What's a phone book? Probably in the communication wing of the Smithsonian along with phones attached to wires and long distance operators.

Bill
 
Local medium size town has a drop down barrier made of thick plexiglass of laminated type that upon press of button it drops from ceiling to great shield in their waiting area

Some local stores in not so good areas have barriers made of similar stuff.

The materials are already readily available but not likely cheap.

But the real issue is liability as you are asked for bullet deterrent and if not properly licensed to possible engineer it you could get jammed up.

May be better to search for sources of pre engineered materials then consult with vendor how to get it resold into your customers place while insuring any liability for suitable use are addresses.

If you built for a certian size and a clown comes in with larger then what?

Stupid that it needs to be discussed but it does need to be on the front end.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337Z using Tapatalk
 
Local medium size town has a drop down barrier made of thick plexiglass of laminated type that upon press of button it drops from ceiling to great shield in their waiting area

Are you sure that was not polycarbonate? I had a small piece of 1/2 inch thick polyC and shot it with a 22 Remington yellow jacket 1500FPS from close range with a rifle and it did stop the slug. The plastic was bulged out but not penetrated. Bullet proof windows in cars are made from what looks like 1 to 1 1/2 inch thick polycarbonate with a glass veneer for scratch resistance.
 
I would feel "pretty well protected" behind a wall and door made of three layers of 3/4 inch CDx plywood.
A straight on shot might get through, but all the piss would be out of the lead. Any angle to the strike, would stop or send a lead bullet off somewhere.
Paint the surface a slippery color ;-)

Hollow and filled with sand would be a sure thing.
 
A "wall" sized piece is going to be costly in engineered materials.
Is size a concern ?
Sandbags, behind drywall, would be cheap, fast, easy, and resistant to anything.
Add pockets, kevlar, thickness based on preferences for cost and major impact resistance.

A4 paper in carton boxes would actually work well, but You might not get paid a lot for the work.
 
Couple sheets of 1/4" steel, spaced, with sand between. First one deforms the round, sand slows it, second stops it. Many would not make it into the sand, given that the weapon might be a .22 or .32.

Frankly, holdup guys do not come in shooting, in general. Some shoot AFTER the holdup, of course, but exiting the back seems like a good way to run into the guy again. The wall would be more of a terrorist shield than for holdups.

Plywood would not stop 0.45 lead. I have slingshots that get through ply.
 
What they use in cockpit doors is Dyneema and then cross plyed
The fibers are not woven but glued together with latex in one layer
Then those layer get cross plyed an pressed together hot so the latex binds it all together
Much better as a woven fiber
I installed one of the first machines for this product more as 20 years ago


Peter
 
Since we are not talking about belt-fed, crew-served weapons, a plain 6" concrete wall (poured, not cinderblock) should be ample, and relatively cheap. Even 4" would probably do well, but if you're paying for the labor to form and pour it I don't see the point in saving 2" of concrete in materials. The door will be the weak spot. Metal frame and metal door, like a fire door, obviously. Much better at resisting smash-ins if you install it with a three-point locking mechanism (top, bottom, side), and ensure the bottom lock plate is sturdy and embedded in the floor, not just an aluminum threshold with a couple of wood screws. Not many doors, even metal fire doors, will keep out a slug, but you should be able to resist several blows with a SWAT ram no trouble.
 
That's where a three-point locking mechanism makes a real big difference.

Interestingly, the three-point locking mechanisms get a big play in high-end energy efficient home construction. Nothing to do with security, but the multiple bolts apparently make the door seal better against the gasket/frame, especially after time passes and the frame/door has shifted a little bit from the original (supposedly perfect) hanging.
 
If you are looking to get out of it to reduce cost, then they aren't making enough money to stay there. Sell it and move. If they would rather stay cheap I would start with free donuts for the cops.
 
but most holdup men don't know that much about firearms and are using whatever they could steal.

I would not bet on that. They also know about jacketed bullets and hollow-points. They might also be bright enough to inspect the hold-up location and have a guy at the back door.

When I used to shoot .22 rifle in high school competition the range was in-doors. The back stop was a sheet of at least 1/2" of steel angled at 45 degrees to the floor. That will make the lead splatter on the plate and embed into a sand pit at or below ground level.

A piece of 1/2" steel from about groin level to head height bolted to the back-side of the wall. He can use the steel plate to hold up pictures or calendars with little magnets. Then he has a functional backstop.

A couple of cameras with blink leds. Maybe some stickers that say "We support our local police".
 
"He just wants a partition he can duck behind with a door that will resist someone beating on it long enough for him to get out the back door. "

1/4" hot roll would be my choice. A 4' tall partition shouldn't be too expensive. Years ago I tested various handgun ammunition on steel sheet/plate. 1/8" was enough to stop .45 cal round nose, but 9mm would
punch nice holes in it.

Chuck
Burbank, CA
 
For a DIY job you'd have to test samples with real handguns to see what works but generally what you want to do is damage the bullet, absorb energy, and ultimately absorb (stop) the bullet. Alternating layers of different materials can work quite well. Layers might include thin steel sheets on plywood, ceramic tile on plywood, etc.

The idea is to make the bullet work on penetration by hitting materials of different consistency so that it deforms/deflects. Ceramic tiles tend to shatter and spread the energy that can otherwise easily drill through wallboard, plywood and other materials. Steel is very good at catching rounds after they have lost some velocity.

Years ago someone I knew fired some rounds into an empty 55 gallon drum and discovered that they would easily penetrate the first side and then simply bulge the other side. These were all non-magnum handgun rounds. A .357 with sturdy bullets probably would have punched through both.
 








 
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