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Thread: Sl vs Gt lathes
12-23-2010, 10:58 AM #1
Sl vs Gt lathes
what is the difference in the slant lathe series for the GT (chucker) lathes?
Besides the obvious like spinde speed and the ability to have live tooling.
12-23-2010, 07:11 PM #2
Gt vs sl
I am no expert but I believe that you will get more Z travel on the SL than the GT series. A friend of mine has a GT10 and it has limited Z axis travel. I believe the GT 20 has a little more Z travel and I think it requires 3 phase and the GT10 will run on single phase. The SL has more rotary stations on the turret.
I think HAAS is phasing out the SL series of lathes and replacing them with the ST series.
If you go to the HAAS website you will be able to easily determine the available options for each series.
12-30-2010, 06:48 AM #3
The GT isn't really a chucker...I think the chucker is the TL.
The TL (Toolroom lathe) is a conventional lathe design with CNC Motor driven axis and Ball Screws.
Chips fall on saddle, no enclosure so Flood coolant becomes a feel mess...even at low speeds. Single tools on a post. I think the programming is more conversational with canned cycles.
From what I was able to tell...the GT series was an SL series and they removed everything except the Spindle and the XZ Travel. They come with a manual chuck...guess thats why we think Chucker...
I believe your supposed to use as a gang tool machine...but the X Axis is limited in motion so only a few tools or you need to get creative.
In the right situation I can see where it could be a handy tool...Single Billets chucked with a few operations you get alot of machine at a good price...but for me I need flexibility and need to automate for Bar feeding...by the time I added an automatic collet system and a turret for more tools, an auger, coolant I was getting into the SL Series...the now ST Series.
12-30-2010, 07:39 AM #4
I thought a chucker was a lathe with no tailstock....but I could be mistaken
12-30-2010, 09:52 AM #5
Actually, what I really would like to know is what the purpose of the GT lathe is period?
Back in late '03 ( pre GT series lathes ) I was told that the GT20 will be a beefier gang tool lathe than the Minilathe was. Back then the assumptions from the HFO was that it will have larger travel, heftier motor ....
Well, a year later when it came out we all stood around it and attempted to figure out just exactly what was the thinking behind the contraption and where would one use it?
I'm still trying to find the answer, but one thing is for certain. With the puny 8" of X travel, a gang tool lathe this definitely is not!
With the add-on turret it still ain't a match for any of the SL series.
With no tailstock it isn't an alternative for any of the TL lathes.
So if anyone has an answer, I'm sitting and waiting here eagerly.
To anyone at Haas: Would you guys just please build a gosh darn honest the god gang tool lathe again please!!!!
01-02-2011, 08:47 AM #6
01-03-2011, 01:49 PM #7
Define your gang-tool machine
As to the original "concept" of the GT series, it was marketed as a small-footprint chucker lathe. We no longer build the GT series.
As to your request for a "gosh darn honest [to] god gang tool lathe", please provide the specifications for your applications:
01-03-2011, 04:11 PM #8
Ken, for the specs please look no further than your very own Minilathe, built form 2001 - 2003 I believe.
Furthermore, ignore all the marketing garbage Hardinge is putting out about the Mini's collet closer and the slanted table. Apparently they do make an incredibly stout gang tool lathe but have no idea what's involved to make a quick setup change when more than 4 tools are used or longer tools are required.
Nonetheless, as an overwhelmingly happy Minilathe user, I can tell you that the long collet nose ( I believe manufactured by MicroCentric ) and the nearly 45deg. tool table is in fact one of - if not THE - best idea EVER utilized on a standard gang tool lathe.
I'd be happy to provide either images or better yet, actual parts produced on this machine over the last 7 years.
I'd even make some videos to show how easy it is to use and set up the machine utilizing not some fancy gangtool-specific toolholders with custom inserts, but rather all standard 1" or 1/2" stick holders with the widest variety and fully available cutting inserts. Tough I have 3 other larger machines, the Mini is by far the most used one on a larger variety of parts than any of the others. I even use it to 2nd op parts from any of the big guys using 2" 5C collets. Relatively few aluminum, some brass but by and large SS, Inco and TI parts, some as large as 1" diameter stock.
I've mentioned that to indicate that the OfficeLathe as an alternative is a non-starter.
You could almost reproduce the machine as it was back then, except for maybe one major - but not impossible - modification.
If you're interested in the details, please ask either here or in a PM.
I'd be truly interested to see if Haas would be willing to reconsider the prospect of a production gang-tool lathe.
01-03-2011, 05:52 PM #9
01-03-2011, 05:55 PM #10
After seeing some pictures of how the minilathe gang tools are set up, and the collet nose I definitely see some really nice advantages to it and good capability.
It needs to have a true 5hp/cont minimum, ideally 7.5hp so it still has some balls at low speed, don't put a 3hp and call it a 10 is what I'm saying.
Ideally in the low $30K range, even better if you can keep it just a bit under 30K.
Properly advertised it would get much of the sales of the other gang tool cnc currently made/sold by other companies, the higher quantities would help keep a decent lower price.
There's still many of us making small parts that can use such a machine. So far I've stuck to my manual Cyclematic 618evs because most gang-tool cnc's sold right now cost as much as a 6-8" turning center, and they have no service in most areas. So most shops get by doing their small work on regular larger turning centers that offer more bang for the dollar(versatility), or stick to doing it manual as I have even with batches over 1000parts.
01-03-2011, 06:48 PM #11
The Mini has a 7.5HP Int. rating, but on a gang lathe it actually is quite enough as you will hardly ever turn large diameters for very long and you won't be pushing insert drills either.
Yes, while 30K price would be wicked nice, one thing is for certain. If you have any qty in the 100-200 piece range or above, these things will have a 30 to 50% faster ROI than any ( or most ) typical turret type lathes running the same jobs.
I've tested it a few times, even compared it to the NL-SY. Tough the Mini does not mill, the turning portion was about 15% faster than the Mori using 6 tools in a 2 + 2 + 1 +1 configuration ( Double station rough/cutoff, double station spot/drill, ID finish boring bar, OD finish turn)
As I write this, the Mini is running a 7 tool job from a 5/16 dia 303SS bar.
OAL is .480 with a .125 +/-.0005 cbore, .047 through hole, OD is +/-.0015 with an O-ring groove. Total QTY is 2700 pieces, cycle time 57 sec.
You'd be hard pressed puttin' this on even on the SL10, let alone the bigger guys.
As soon as this is finished, it'll be running a 7/8 dia 347SS job with a .625 fancy through bore and partially threaded ID and OD. That QTY will be 250 pieces and is (tested) quicker on the Mini by 14 sec than either the SL or the Duraturn.
Even between friends, that job alone is done nearly 1 hour faster than any of it's bigger brothers.
01-03-2011, 07:30 PM #12
been in a lot of shops but only saw a few with the minis and gt lathes. they were strictly a chucker no tailstock option. they were nice for certain parts or like previously mentioned used for 2nd ops. even had one hooked up to a bar feeder. those lathes were tough to beat with certain parts applications.
01-03-2011, 08:27 PM #13
For the record, the MiniLathe and the GT are not by any means in the same category under any circumstances.
The GT was .... well whatever you want to calll it.
The Minilathe OTOH is a true gang tool lathe with a very unique configuration.
This is an image of one, tough the machine is in a wicked disgusting shape with truly awful lighting for an advertisement:
Mini Lathe | CNC Gang Lathes| KDCapital